Baby Green Wing macaw refusing formula at 11 weeks old

[JerseyWendy]

LMAO! Well Chad, I hope you got your potty break in.

As plumsmum has already explained, beak grinding is a sign of being content (GOOD sign!!).

Please don't let him mess with anything inside your mouth, including teeth because we have a whole bunch of nasties inside our mouths that can be quite harmful for parrots.

 

[chad84]

Will remember that

 

[chad84]

Goodnight all. I have so much updates for you! This is gonna be long...
Robert is weighing 900g. That's a considerable drop from the 950g 1 week ago. He is currently 14 weeks 3 days. He is on day 7 of the clavamox/enhancin antibiotic cocktail. I reduced his feeding from 120c 3 times a day to 90cc 3 times a day. Most days since he started antibiotic he throws up. Not a whole lot, about 5ml to 10ml. But it still worries me.

He also hasn't been eating much for the last 3 days (Day 5, 6 & 7 of antibiotics).
During these days he ate 40 ml in the morning, almost nothing lunchtime and almost nothing in the night. He doesn't have the feeding response and just simply does not want to swallow the formula. I offer him chop and soft food 3 times a day but he just plays with it, breaking it up to smaller pieces but I can't tell if he is eating any at all. Since he isn't really interested in formula I was hoping he would at least eat his chop and soft food. I need my Robby Boy to eat ANYTHING. But he isn't eating.

Robert started flying a few days ago. All he wants to do is fly to me from where ever he is in the house. He flies 5 - 6 times a day. If someone is holding him or if he is perched and I pass, he jumps down and follows me, if I hide he comes flying around and trying to land on me. He still flaps a ton. But he flies and circles in the living room looking for a place to land (me). He loves us so much. Can never leave him home. He is a love HOG. He gets loving by me till I am tired then goes to my wife.

So the weight loss could be that he isn't eating AND he is flying quite a bit.

He still pants a bit when he flies but I haven't really noticed him panting at rest.
One thing I must note. Robert isn't acting sick in any way. He picks fights with me, follows me around and cuddles with me almost all day making his baby sounds and begging to be played with. He is ALWAYS climbing, flapping, flying and BITING everything in sight.

Now that I have stopped him from trying to get into my mouth, his new obsession is my NOSE. He licks and nibbles my nose everywhere ALL DAY LONG.

Tomorrow I am going to the vet for a 1 week follow up check up and to do an x ray to check out his throat, lungs, air sacs and anything else. What else should the x ray tell me? The vet says they don't really do avian blood tests and avian cultures. So on Monday I am going to our government veterinary lab to ask if they will do the blood tests and cultures. They asked me what they should be testing for. Can you guys tell me?

 

[plumsmum2005]

Hey always love the updates on Super Robert LOL. He sounds totally adorable.

Please do keep him away from your nose there is the possibility he can pick up something from you. BTW did you know that humans can carry strep around at the back of the throat?

Bit concerned Robert not eating much. Hope Wendy will give her wise views later?

 

[JerseyWendy]

Thank you for the update, Chad!

I'm a bit concerned about Robert's weight. It's normal for them to lose some weight once they start flying, but at the same time, they should have a fairly good appetite from all that exercise.

Did you ever order him the weight gain formula I linked to a while back? This one: Z-AVI-QF16 Avitech Formula One Quick Weight Gain Mixture 16oz - AVITECH

As for what to test for, have a look at this site. Disease Center - Disease testing for psittacines and other birds.

 

[chad84]

Thank you for the update, Chad!

I'm a bit concerned about Robert's weight. It's normal for them to lose some weight once they start flying, but at the same time, they should have a fairly good appetite from all that exercise.

Did you ever order him the weight gain formula I linked to a while back? This one: Z-AVI-QF16 Avitech Formula One Quick Weight Gain Mixture 16oz - AVITECH

As for what to test for, have a look at this site. Disease Center - Disease testing for psittacines and other birds.

No didn't order it. I ordered the avitech probiotics.
Will order the formula one now.

 

[chad84]

Night guys. As I sit here Robert is preening my beard. And so diligently. I also stopped him from licking my nose just as my mouth as it may be dangerous. He goes through every hair on my mustache and beard. EVERY hair! It tickles so much. if I laugh he just starts over. I am taking 40 mins to write a 2 minute update.

His weight this morning was 920g. He actually ate today! He had 100 ml in the morning, 90 ml at lunch, 95 ml around 6pm and his crop is empty again. I had to force him to eat the formula though. No feeding response. just pouring it at back of throat and asking him nicely to swallow and he does. I have to do this 20 times to get 100 ml in. lol. 5 ml at a time. I love Super Robert (remember he is flying now) so much. These days on the antibiotics he vomits almost on every feeding, only about 2 ml. When I see him gagging I reach for him, hug and kiss him and let him know it will be alright.

Breaking news... I held him at the beak joint tonight and got some head pumps. But they didn't last long enough for me to feed him with head pumping. I got really excited though. Must be the extra vit A. I hope it comes back for good.

Robert is still doing his lick-tickle-preen on me.

He is sleeping throughout the night now and not waking and calling me. Seems he is feeling a little better.


He found a spot on top of the gate that he flies to a few times for the day.

 

[JerseyWendy]

What adorable photos!! THANK YOU! And thank you for the update, too.

Is he eating any solids on his own yet?

 

[chad84]

Hey all. Today Robert weighed 935g on empty stomach in the morning after 1st poop. it has been 2 complete days in a row where he has eat 3 meals a day. Around 100 ml per meal. He eats 60 ml with no fuss then I have to force the 40 ml extra down but he doesn't put up much of a fight. He swallows it but makes a crying kind of pitiful sound. Breaks my heart. He gained 35g from 900g about 3 or 4 days ago.

Today is day 9 of 10 on antibiotics (enhancin/clavamox cocktail). His vomiting has been reduced to 1 meal a day and it's only a few drips compared to the puddle from before.

Started doing flight recall training today. I place him somewhere and call him and he flies to me. We did a 20 min session today. I would have loved to give him treats but he doesn't eat solid food yet. He flaps and flaps boy... wow. He plays all day as well. He meets lots of new people several times a week. He meets my clients and employees of my clients. He also get alot of attention from the school children in the vicinity of my office. Can't believe how he just hops onto strangers' arms and cuddles looking for TLC.

He has been active and great.
He will live!
Anxiously awaiting tomorrow morning to go to the government veterinarian and government veterinary lab. They do alot of tests there and I heard the Avian Vet (only one in the country) has a Teaching Assistant. Will be making an appointment to see her. Yiiiiippppyyyyy!!

 

[JerseyWendy]

You are an exceptional parront, Chad! Good luck tomorrow!! Don't forget to write any and all questions you may have down, and take that with you. Sometimes people forget what they wanted to ask, if you know what I mean.

Looking forward to your next update.

 

[wrench13]

Chad, please take hard lesson from Birdman (Mark), if
Robert is taken outside. Either a harness or in a cage.
We don't want to read about another lost birdy. So glad that
Robert is doing better.

 

[chad84]

Hi all. Robert is still doing well. Didn't get a vet visit today. Scheduled for 10am tomorrow as she was booked out today. Told her to run all the tests possible. She is asking me 'like what?' OMG. I nearly tripped. I told her x ray, CBC, cultures, just everything. Gave her a pdf full of tests to run. She said they don't like drawing blood from ill avians. I tried hard to compose myself and not to start throwing around thing in her office like a wild animal. So I am thinking, tomorrow would be quite the waste of time except I will get the x ray I have been waiting on for a while. Sucks not having access to an avian vet. She looked at him and says he looks really good. She said he is extremely active and very close to peak health.

She pointed out that Robert stood there on 1 foot and grinding his beak contently. He indeed looked like he had the perfect life. She said that happy/healthy birds stand on 1 foot and they grind beak. She told me that his blunted choanal papillae are very pointy/sharp and are 80% regrown in just 10 days of increased multivitamin and high beta carotene intake.
I won't lie he indeed looks good.

Super Robert's constant flying is burning calories galore. He now east 90 ml 4 times a day... not 3 but 4! He has also become 1000% more destructive. He no longer licks stuff. He severs anything string or cord like, crushes and crunches wood he can find, destroyed all his toys and chews up everything in my man cave.
He is still having 30 ml carrot puree and 90 ml formula mixed. I give him 1 drop of multivitamin in his feed and a dash of guess what? Guess... Avi-Culture 2 probiotic. I waited till I stopped the antibiotics to introduce the probiotics.
I will be buying alcohol free milk thistle drops to sooth his liver after 2 sets of antibiotics and 1 set of anti-yeast. I really wanted to try the aloe detox as well.

So to recap.
He is eating 4 times a day around 90 - 120 ml but still throwing up
He is very active.
He started sleeping on 1 foot and beak grinding loud as ever (who gave him that PA system) lol
Vet doesn't seem to know much more than me (government vet)
Antibiotics are over... enter probiotics

 

[chad84]

Look what just came in the mail for Robert. Detachable bowls with double (2) wing nuts to fasten to the cage. They are 20 oz and are 5.5 in diameter. Locks securely to pet cage to prevent spilling. Instead of resting in a loop like the usual ones, these snap into the holder securely.

 

[chad84]

Hi all. Essay time!

So the vet I saw today was the absolute best so far. She listened well, gave great advise and commended me on my great care for Robert.

She was extremely kind to Robert and I. She took her time and inspected Robert from head to toe. He loved her. He flew to her and jumped on top her head and preened her hair. She was amazed at how active he is and wondered why I requested to see her. And guess what? She is an Avian Veterinarian. She teaches at the School of Veterinary Medicine (government) with the Senior Avian vet. I didn't get to see the one I was previously scheduled to meet. And boy am I glad.

I explained all that was wrong with Robert. Throwing up, no appetite, refusing food, has to be force fed, diarrhea and slightly yellow urine. She did a full examination on him. After which she told me he doesn't need a blood test just yet. And she doesn't want to do an x ray yet either. I was SO DISAPPOINTED. She saw this and explained to me fully why she thinks I should not waste time and money.

I didn't tell her what the 4 other non-avian vets told me, as I wanted her to form her own opinions. And I also didn't tell her about his medical past or his current diet. I needed to get her professional advice without prior knowledge. The Avian Vet told me that there are no easily discernible signs of illness and his energy levels are off the chart. She said she noticed 10% of his papillae on the choana are very short but the rest are pointy as they should be. She noted that he is recovering from a vitamin A deficiency. She also told me that he has a calcium deficiency and showed me his beak, nails and skin. She then told me he has a fat deficiency too. She also pointed out some white specs on his choana which she said he is getting a mild case of candida due to a probable previous antibiotic treatment (she was spot on) or low immune system (spot on again). The vet said that he had good breast muscle but could get some more. She said that his weight (930g) is not too bad as he had been sick but she thinks the fledgling depleted his calories and had him in a deficit. She said the Vit A deficiency and medication usually causes the refusing of food. She said I am lucky I can still get him to open his beak and accept the food all the way to the back of the throat and he swallows it even though he isn't in the mood. She noted that the diarrhea is caused by the candida and formula being too thin. She said the urine actually looked ok but if it get darker yellow or brighter yellow, then come see her. She said almost clear, yellowish tint is normal.
By the way, he is no longer sneezing.

Solutions!
She told me to get him on a complete formula like RoudyBush, Kaytee or Zupreem (already there... lol). She said to add a carrot or sweet potato puree to the formula (been there done that!), add 1 drop of multivitamin (been there too), a sprinkle of avian probiotics (started that last night), a teaspoon of red palm oil (but she prefers coconut oil) [didn't do this], a tablespoon of yogurt (neither this), and a whole lot of love (been overdosing on this one). Oh and to give him a few drops Apple Cider Vinegar in 30 ml of water halfway between meals to reduce fungal growths.
She said this will cover Vit A deficiency, fat deficiency (and allow the solubility and absorption of Vit A), calcium deficiency, candida and give him a weight gain boost.
She gave him a Vitamin A booster injection and an Amoxycillin injection which he didn't like but got over it in like 15 secs and started back playing with her.
She also clipped his nails! No more impaling...

She said give him 1 week off all meds and use the healthy all natural foods she suggested and come see her in 1 week to discuss if he is still vomiting and has diarrhea.

 

[wrench13]

Chad your love for Robert and the care your doing is so good to read. Blessings, man.

 

[chad84]

Tonight Robert ate his first cocktail that the vet asked me to give him.
90 ml Formula
1 drop Multivitamin
1 tsp Coconut oil
1 tbsp Yogurt
1 tbsp Carrot puree
1 dash of Probiotic powder

She said between meals I should give him apple cider vinegar in about 5 ml to 30 ml of water.
Now what I want to know is, should I just mix the ACV into his formula? Or would it kill the beneficial bacteria I added?
Why I ask is because I am unsure when exactly I should give him. That will be 3 extra times I have to put a syringe in his mouth besides the 4 feeding times.

Robert ate up the 1st 60 ml and gave trouble when I had to refill the syringe. He didn't throw up tonight! not even a little bit. None at all. He seems so content. He is standing on my arm while I type this message. My my my he is heavy. But he won't let me type properly. But his intrusion is a welcome one. He is fighting with my fingers as I type. Love my Super Robert so much. Wife loves him equally.

Enter the beak grind! Very very loud. But I feel good knowing he is content.

 

[chad84]

Chad your love for Robert and the care your doing is so good to read. Blessings, man.

Thank you.

 

[plumsmum2005]

Big smiles reading about Super Robert. Please continue to share his journey with you and your wife? Oh and well done!

 

[JerseyWendy]

What a wonderful update on Super Robert!!! THANK YOU!

You can add the ACV directly into the handfeeding formula.

 

[macawluv]

Finally a topic I can give great input on. What is AVC? I am very versed in probiotics as I work for one of the largest manufacturers as a Technical Support Scientist. What weight of the probiotics are you adding? I went to that website and rice maltodextrin is not a prebiotic. You should think of it as sugar. What stage of the process are you adding the bacteria to the blend? Before heating? after?