Mental Health Vent/Discussion

[StormyPica]

So, in the past I thought right... something confused me - later I thought autism spectrum is a general name for autism, Asperger's and something else.

Yup.

 

[Rozalka]

Yup, and Roz seems to think 'Aspergers' is a seperate disorder, when it's really just part of the autism spectrum?

I knew, it is a part, but thought it is some sort of a separate disorder (like green cheeked and sun conures - they both are conures but different genera). Anyway - this disorter is somehow different than other autism "versions". I don't know why as a child I was learnt that Asperger's syndrome - somehow "smart" children, autism - children with "big problems". Now I disagree... but they still are different

 

[BirdyBee]

deleted message

 

[StormyPica]

Autism isn't a spectrum of different diagnoses or "severities", but rather of different symptoms, behaviours, etc. Think of the spectrum of a circle rather than a line

Yeah, a circle

I may (uncertian) not have autsim, but I have a good understanding of it.

 

[Rozalka]

Now, I started reading again about "classification" of autism. In general the rule which I've written about Asperger being "better functioning" (I mean less communication problems) is right, but the border between Asperger and non-Asperger autism is very unclear. So that would be why there are so many exceptions. I've read also about such thing like "High-functioning autism" which is similar to Asperger

 

[StormyPica]

Now, I started reading again about "classification" of autism. In general the rule which I've written about Asperger being "better functioning" (I mean less communication problems) is right, but the border between Asperger and non-Asperger autism is very unclear. So that would be why there are so many exceptions. I've read also about such thing like "High-functioning autism" which is similar to Asperger

High functioning is an outdated label. It infers that 'low functioning' autistics are dumb and 'high functioning' autistics don't struggle.

 

[Rozalka]

High functioning is an outdated label. It infers that 'low functioning' autistics are dumb and 'high functioning' autistics don't struggle.

so how can we call different types? Imo we should name somehow - there are autistic people like my past classmate, who aren't able to talk (just single words), but there also are people who normally talk. I don't wanna call "law functioning" as dump, but I can't imagine myself saying "I have autism" - in my family I can't even say that I have Asperger's Syndrome

 

[StormyPica]

so how can we call different types? Imo we should name somehow - there are autistic people like my past classmate, who aren't able to talk (just single words), but there also are people who normally talk. I don't wanna call "law functioning" as dump, but I can't imagine myself saying "I have autism" - in my family I can't even say that I have Asperger's Syndrome

Welp, you can call yourself whatever you want.

 

[Rozalka]

Welp, you can call yourself whatever you want.

I know, but I mean how to call other autism types?

 

[BirdyBee]

deleted message

 

[Rozalka]

You can say "higher-support" autism(meaning you need therapy, struggle to communicate, etc.) And "lower-support" autism(meaning you don't really need a lot of therapy, you don't have a lot of difficulties in communicating, etc) and then you have non-verbal and verbal autism

it's a lot better than functioning label IMO.

thanks, it makes sense

 

[Skarila]

Autism isn't a spectrum of different diagnoses or "severities", but rather of different symptoms, behaviours, etc. Think of the spectrum of a circle rather than a line

I highly disagree here. It is litteraly that. High functioning vs low functioning.
Aspergers (as much you hate it) was declassified in 2013, but many people prefer to use it, not to glorify the person, but simply because it is easier for them to differentiate.

As you said yourself that people in your family have severe cases of autism which makes life much harder. Low vs high functioning doesnt mean dumber nor not (while it can) it simply means wether the person on the autism spectrum can function alone to a degree or not. As you mentioned, verbal or not, how independent they are. People with severe cases od autism need help, and someone to look after them. The high functioning simply do not display such severe symptoms. These people, like my self, are usually just seen as weird, odd, and we struggle internally. For some reason girls hide it so well, masking prevents diagnosis on time, and many women don't even realize they are on the spectrum until adulthood. Also, highly intelligent people who are on the spectrum (high functioning) hide it so well, because if you're smart, everything is alright, no? (Logic of so many parents).

It is still disputed wether Asperger's should be put in same classification as Autism. For now, it is. It is such a difficult thing to discuss and get diagnosed.

I don't understand what is the issue if I wish to label myself as "high functioning", which according to psychiatrists who finished their schools and phd, I am?

Also we better stops using the "Pavlov's law/reflex" because what he did to the dogs was awful (just google how actually the tests were done) Oh, and Einstein was a horrible and rude and simply bad to people, especially his wife. The list goes on.

Lets just say that noone will ever be happy with anything if everyone keeps arguing about "labels" or "names".. Maybe I sound like an old fart, but think about it, slow down a bit and try to think what is the point of the whole thing.

 

[StormyPica]

I highly disagree here. It is litteraly that. High functioning vs low functioning.
Aspergers (as much you hate it) was declassified in 2013, but many people prefer to use it, not to glorify the person, but simply because it is easier for them to differentiate.

As you said yourself that people in your family have severe cases of autism which makes life much harder. Low vs high functioning doesnt mean dumber nor not (while it can) it simply means wether the person on the autism spectrum can function alone to a degree or not. As you mentioned, verbal or not, how independent they are. People with severe cases od autism need help, and someone to look after them. The high functioning simply do not display such severe symptoms. These people, like my self, are usually just seen as weird, odd, and we struggle internally. For some reason girls hide it so well, masking prevents diagnosis on time, and many women don't even realize they are on the spectrum until adulthood. Also, highly intelligent people who are on the spectrum (high functioning) hide it so well, because if you're smart, everything is alright, no? (Logic of so many parents).

It is still disputed wether Asperger's should be put in same classification as Autism. For now, it is. It is such a difficult thing to discuss and get diagnosed.

I don't understand what is the issue if I wish to label myself as "high functioning", which according to psychiatrists who finished their schools and phd, I am?

Also we better stops using the "Pavlov's law/reflex" because what he did to the dogs was awful (just google how actually the tests were done) Oh, and Einstein was a horrible and rude and simply bad to people, especially his wife. The list goes on.

Lets just say that noone will ever be happy with anything if everyone keeps arguing about "labels" or "names".. Maybe I sound like an old fart, but think about it, slow down a bit and try to think what is the point of the whole thing.

Ok, everyone, good points. I do suggest if this is going to become a heated topic, please shut it down. If it's just friendly discussion, please, keep discussing.

 

[BirdyBee]

I highly disagree here. It is litteraly that. High functioning vs low functioning.
Aspergers (as much you hate it) was declassified in 2013, but many people prefer to use it, not to glorify the person, but simply because it is easier for them to differentiate.

As you said yourself that people in your family have severe cases of autism which makes life much harder. Low vs high functioning doesnt mean dumber nor not (while it can) it simply means wether the person on the autism spectrum can function alone to a degree or not. As you mentioned, verbal or not, how independent they are. People with severe cases od autism need help, and someone to look after them. The high functioning simply do not display such severe symptoms. These people, like my self, are usually just seen as weird, odd, and we struggle internally. For some reason girls hide it so well, masking prevents diagnosis on time, and many women don't even realize they are on the spectrum until adulthood. Also, highly intelligent people who are on the spectrum (high functioning) hide it so well, because if you're smart, everything is alright, no? (Logic of so many parents).

It is still disputed wether Asperger's should be put in same classification as Autism. For now, it is. It is such a difficult thing to discuss and get diagnosed.

I don't understand what is the issue if I wish to label myself as "high functioning", which according to psychiatrists who finished their schools and phd, I am?

Also we better stops using the "Pavlov's law/reflex" because what he did to the dogs was awful (just google how actually the tests were done) Oh, and Einstein was a horrible and rude and simply bad to people, especially his wife. The list goes on.

Lets just say that noone will ever be happy with anything if everyone keeps arguing about "labels" or "names".. Maybe I sound like an old fart, but think about it, slow down a bit and try to think what is the point of the whole thing.

(edit: I'm just deleting this)

 

[Skarila]

You can have your opinion and I can have mine. Also, I'm the only reported case in my whole family. I was mentioning people that I know(not people in my family. No-one in my family, present or past had symptoms). I never said that I'm against people who prefer to identify with high-functioning/asperger's, instead that I just disagree with it.

Sorry just I'm getting bad vibes with even discussing the labels/names, and changing them because a handful feels it is "rude". 'Tis why I said noone will ever be happy with labeling, and self labeling without others having an understanding of the meaning of it is chaotic. Just imagine if doctors used the same way! (aka when we say "Asperger's" we get a different meaning from just saying "i am on the ASD spectrum" . Also it just makes everyone nervous and putting into a panic mode, noone likes to walk on egg shells (will it hurt xzy?), from experience, I can tell you it drives people mad. It drove me mad to a point.

Because every autistic person, I do mean every, is displaying different set of symptoms, different way of behaving and coping methods, is the main reason why it is SO hard for specialists to give exact diagnosis, is it even autism we're talking about. And then there are many other disorders which do share similar symptoms (ADD/ADHD, borderline personality disorder, etc) it's hard to pin point. Is it one thing, or the other, or even both?! Or all three?! Oh let us not forget drop in a pinch of depression into the whole mixture.

For me personally was a bumpy ride, still is. And I bet for everyone who joined this thread is as well. World is a cruel place, and we're fighting and doing our best to try to fit in somewhere, or simply cope with things. Best thing we can do is talk to professionals and trust them. Read lots on the topics you're interested with and what might help you (internet is too chaotic, I prefer actual books :') ) Also by time, you all will be wiser and learn more and more how to cope with your issues, since many neurotypical people cannot and will not fathom your/our struggles, and many will not make our lives easier. Tackling one issue at a time helps A LOT. Me just by tackling down the depression made me live again with (almost) full lungs. Next on my list is ADD which is currently very prominent once I put the reigns on the depression part.
-----
At age of 16 I thought I was wise.
At age of 20, I thought I was really dumb at age of 16, and that I finally got wise.
at age of 23 I thought I became an adult, became wise (for real now) and thought of 20 year old me as dumb and childish.
At age of 28 I find my self growing and learning every day, more tolerant, and realizing the 16-23 year old me wasn't dumb, just inexperienced. And I am still childish and I love it.

 

[BirdyBee]

Sorry just I'm getting bad vibes with even discussing the labels/names, and changing them because a handful feels it is "rude". 'Tis why I said noone will ever be happy with labeling, and self labeling without others having an understanding of the meaning of it is chaotic. Just imagine if doctors used the same way! (aka when we say "Asperger's" we get a different meaning from just saying "i am on the ASD spectrum" . Also it just makes everyone nervous and putting into a panic mode, noone likes to walk on egg shells (will it hurt xzy?), from experience, I can tell you it drives people mad. It drove me mad to a point.

Because every autistic person, I do mean every, is displaying different set of symptoms, different way of behaving and coping methods, is the main reason why it is SO hard for specialists to give exact diagnosis, is it even autism we're talking about. And then there are many other disorders which do share similar symptoms (ADD/ADHD, borderline personality disorder, etc) it's hard to pin point. Is it one thing, or the other, or even both?! Or all three?! Oh let us not forget drop in a pinch of depression into the whole mixture.

For me personally was a bumpy ride, still is. And I bet for everyone who joined this thread is as well. World is a cruel place, and we're fighting and doing our best to try to fit in somewhere, or simply cope with things. Best thing we can do is talk to professionals and trust them. Read lots on the topics you're interested with and what might help you (internet is too chaotic, I prefer actual books :') ) Also by time, you all will be wiser and learn more and more how to cope with your issues, since many neurotypical people cannot and will not fathom your/our struggles, and many will not make our lives easier. Tackling one issue at a time helps A LOT. Me just by tackling down the depression made me live again with (almost) full lungs. Next on my list is ADD which is currently very prominent once I put the reigns on the depression part.
-----
At age of 16 I thought I was wise.
At age of 20, I thought I was really dumb at age of 16, and that I finally got wise.
at age of 23 I thought I became an adult, became wise (for real now) and thought of 20 year old me as dumb and childish.
At age of 28 I find my self growing and learning every day, more tolerant, and realizing the 16-23 year old me wasn't dumb, just inexperienced. And I am still childish and I love it.

True. I get what you are saying. I think we should just stop discussing labels since there is no point in THAT. It's just making both of us feel upset it's giving us bad vibes. I just prefer not to use functioning labels since if I say "I'm high-functioning" or "I have Asperger's", people just expect me to be like a neurotypical person, while that is not true.

I have SPD as a merged diagnoses with my autism. I can't make eye-contact for more than 3s without internally cringing. I struggle understanding things that most neurotypical beings can. It feels like everyone is in the inside of a circle and I just can't seem to fit in most of the time. I really enjoy going to youth at my church since it feels like everyone just respects me for.. well, being me.

I really enjoy discussing my autism here since it feels like people here actually understand my struggles and know what it's like to be neuro-divergent.

 

[Skarila]

True. I get what you are saying. I think we should just stop discussing labels since there is no point in THAT. It's just making both of us feel upset it's giving us bad vibes. I just prefer not to use functioning labels since if I say "I'm high-functioning" or "I have Asperger's", people just expect me to be like a neurotypical person, while that is not true.

I have SPD as a merged diagnoses with my autism. I can't make eye-contact for more than 3s without internally cringing. I struggle understanding things that most neurotypical beings can. It feels like everyone is in the inside of a circle and I just can't seem to fit in most of the time. I really enjoy going to youth at my church since it feels like everyone just respects me for.. well, being me.

I really enjoy discussing my autism here since it feels like people here actually understand my struggles and know what it's like to be neuro-divergent.

From my experience I can tell you that things do not really get easier, but you will learn how to cope a bit better. You are still very young, and have a long path before you! And you are in an advantage here - since you're aware of your diagnosis, you can start working on it much earlier. I didn't think of that I would have any of these disorders until my 20's, until I met a guy with Asperger's (with boys it is MUCH more visible)2, and from there some things started falling into their places, I finally got my answers for my ever so awkward childhood and now adulthood, and I finally could go and reach out to the therapists and go on with my life and correct therapies.

10 years ago I couldn't look people in the eye at all. People would tease me that I am talking to the table instead of them, or I would look right past them. With sufficient training, especially with my partner, it is a bit better now. In the end idea is not even to look into the eyes but rather the "triangle" on the face, between the eyes/forehead or nose, and just keep moving the look. For neurotypical people this is in their genes, they do have this instinct, we however must learn this..! How incredible! Now that I am a tad older, it is less stressful to look people into their faces, but I still tend to look away a lot if I am under stress, or if the situation is simply too much for me to bear it.

I realized I like it more when people treat me like a neurotypical. I only had bad experience ever since I would mention any of my disorders, especially Asperger's. In my cases, people do start treating me WAY too differently, making me feel very unconfortable. If people don't even notice that I am an aspie/on ASD spectrum, good for me! Means I am doing a fairly good job and copying and masking. Tiresome as it may be, it is sort of rewarding for me? People put a "dumb" label on me as soon as they find out the disorder, which...just isn't true. I only cannot read faces and emotions, and cannot express my real emotions as it is expected by neurotypical people. This is the only this I mention to people to help me out, to be open with me. Tell to my face: "I am happy, I am sad, I am perplexed". Also it helped me saying stuff outloud what I feel, it helps people too to understand me a bit better.

Now I share the info about my disorder only to my closest friends, and people I trust. And boy, their faces. "Really? You just don't strike me as such. Tell me more"

It is truly a journey!! See what works with which people, and what doesn't. Different countries have different mind sets, so you do you! I am just overjoyed that through patience, time and experience I can finally sometimes hold the reigns, know what to expect, and just keep trying. It is a never ending quest/journey/battle, but hey, at least we can say we are playing this game called "Life" or Hard Mode

/rant

 

[BirdyBee]

From my experience I can tell you that things do not really get easier, but you will learn how to cope a bit better. You are still very young, and have a long path before you! And you are in an advantage here - since you're aware of your diagnosis, you can start working on it much earlier. I didn't think of that I would have any of these disorders until my 20's, until I met a guy with Asperger's (with boys it is MUCH more visible)2, and from there some things started falling into their places, I finally got my answers for my ever so awkward childhood and now adulthood, and I finally could go and reach out to the therapists and go on with my life and correct therapies.

10 years ago I couldn't look people in the eye at all. People would tease me that I am talking to the table instead of them, or I would look right past them. With sufficient training, especially with my partner, it is a bit better now. In the end idea is not even to look into the eyes but rather the "triangle" on the face, between the eyes/forehead or nose, and just keep moving the look. For neurotypical people this is in their genes, they do have this instinct, we however must learn this..! How incredible! Now that I am a tad older, it is less stressful to look people into their faces, but I still tend to look away a lot if I am under stress, or if the situation is simply too much for me to bear it.

I realized I like it more when people treat me like a neurotypical. I only had bad experience ever since I would mention any of my disorders, especially Asperger's. In my cases, people do start treating me WAY too differently, making me feel very unconfortable. If people don't even notice that I am an aspie/on ASD spectrum, good for me! Means I am doing a fairly good job and copying and masking. Tiresome as it may be, it is sort of rewarding for me? People put a "dumb" label on me as soon as they find out the disorder, which...just isn't true. I only cannot read faces and emotions, and cannot express my real emotions as it is expected by neurotypical people. This is the only this I mention to people to help me out, to be open with me. Tell to my face: "I am happy, I am sad, I am perplexed". Also it helped me saying stuff outloud what I feel, it helps people too to understand me a bit better.

Now I share the info about my disorder only to my closest friends, and people I trust. And boy, their faces. "Really? You just don't strike me as such. Tell me more"

It is truly a journey!! See what works with which people, and what doesn't. Different countries have different mind sets, so you do you! I am just overjoyed that through patience, time and experience I can finally sometimes hold the reigns, know what to expect, and just keep trying. It is a never ending quest/journey/battle, but hey, at least we can say we are playing this game called "Life" or Hard Mode

/rant

I also prefer being treated as neurotypical but I don't like it when they expect me to behave like neurotypical beings and to think that just because I'm, well, "higher functioning" that I don't struggle.

People always think(especially older family members)that my autism "got better" and will continue to "get better". No. I'll definitely learn how to cope better but my autism won't "fade away".

My mom told me about my diagnoses last year and I was shocked tbh, but it helped me understand myself better. I've been diagnosed since I was 2-3!

Thank you for the advise, much appreciated. Luckily I don't have too much of an issue with reading/expressing emotions.

 

[Skarila]

People always think(especially older family members)that my autism "got better" and will continue to "get better". No. I'll definitely learn how to cope better but my autism won't "fade away".

This. This is the only truth. It never goes away, it sticks with us forever.

 

[Scott]

I've been thinking if to write it or not... but I'll do:
As I've already written, I have Asperger's Syndrome. As a child many of my "friends" was doing everything just to make me angry - they were looking for many reasons in many small details - such as what do I like (love to parrots, favorite color, or even mentioned before "hetero, homo or bi" question) - after learning what I like/who I am, they were doing only annoying things using knowledge about me - such as "if you aren't homo, hetero neither be, you're a plant", "Szafirek/Limonka is stupid" etc...
I'm not sure if the past does matter.... but now I don't like talking about myself, especially about my hobbies. I avoid even saying in public that I like parrots... and when I hear during first class "say something about yourself/say what you like", I always start being so stressed... There's been few times when I was even too scared to say that I have/love parrots - then eg. I was saying I like music... despite I love parrots definitely more. The only exception is here cos I know you all are parrot lovers (I have the same thing on another forum related to my another hobby).

And now I dunno... yesterday I failed my English exam and I'm not sure what is the reason - my English is too weak or maybe I am too closed (or both) - there were many personal questions such as "Do you like animals?", "Do you have pets?", "Why do you have parrots?", "Why do you love parrots?" (gee I don't know the answer even in Polish) ,"What do you study?", "How do you help to protect environmental?" I hate so many questions about me...
Ps. please don't say my English is good cos nobody of you heard it.

I'm not a fan of "labels," but let's face it, protocols vary globally and are crucial within the professional mental health community for purposes of diagnosis and hopefully assigning cogent treatment. And in the U.S, for insurance billing purposes.

Roz, sorry to hear you did not exceed personal expectations with English exam. Truly a difficult language to manage even for native speakers! I've learned to compartmentalize disappointing results and working ever harder to improve for the future. Every confidence you will do better next exam for I am the "forever optimist!"