Unweaned babies a trend these days?

[JerseyWendy]

I'd just like to add that there is SO much more to "handfeeding" than filling a chick's crop properly. What about socialization? IMO that is just as important as feeding properly, especially for the later development and mental health.

It breaks my heart each and every time someone hops on the forum and starts asking questions on how to handfeed. This is not something that can be explained via typed out letters or viewing YouTube clips. It's something that must be learned from a reliable and reputable source. Temperature of formula, consistency of formula, keeping track of the weight, keeping an eye on the crop, etc.

Money, unfortunately, will always bring out the worst in people. Those who see our feathered friends as money making machines just won't have the same ethics as most of us here do. And we all know that if done right, there isn't much money to be made by breeding, raising and weaning chicks. It's a labor of love for those with the right mind set.

 

[labell]

I'd just like to add that there is SO much more to "handfeeding" than filling a chick's crop properly. What about socialization? IMO that is just as important as feeding properly, especially for the later development and mental health.

It breaks my heart each and every time someone hops on the forum and starts asking questions on how to handfeed. This is not something that can be explained via typed out letters or viewing YouTube clips. It's something that must be learned from a reliable and reputable source. Temperature of formula, consistency of formula, keeping track of the weight, keeping an eye on the crop, etc.

Money, unfortunately, will always bring out the worst in people. Those who see our feathered friends as money making machines just won't have the same ethics as most of us here do. And we all know that if done right, there isn't much money to be made by breeding, raising and weaning chicks. It's a labor of love for those with the right mind set.

I agree 100% Wendy there are posts that I have read in just the short time I have been on here asking for help with hand feeding and while I know the answers I am very reluctant to even attempt to write it out in text. It just cannot be covered this way or by watching someone else. I feel torn because while I am worried about the baby I also feel that if I answer and they still do something wrong that I have contributed to it. There is just so much more to it than most people realize.

 

[ImmunoGoblin]

Hand-feeding was a good experience for us - we brought Tater home when he was on 2-3 hand feedings a day. Our breeder made sure we knew what we were doing, though. And I'm a scientist and my partner is a nurse, so we're both very used to measuring things accurately and following directions! If I were a breeder, I'd probably not trust most of the potential buyers though.

 

[Birdman666]

Many years ago, when I was still volunteering at the rescue...

A wannabe inexperienced hand feeder brought in a cardboard box containing three adorable baby B&G's...

All three of them had badly burned crops. He didn't know enough to check for hot spots. Frankly, I doubt he checked the temperature at all...

They died in my arms.

It left a lasting impression...

Enough said.

That's specifically why I hate the practice!

 

[chippy]

My Pippin was only partially weaned when i got him, although I was told he was eating on his own at the time...it didn't take me very long to realize that he did NOT know what to do with solid food.

I spent the next little while teaching him how to eat mushy food and eventually got him onto solids but it was hard work and I know that even now, a year later, he is weirded out by unfamiliar foods unless he watches me eat them first and gets them carefully handfed to him or cut up very tiny and "hidden" in his regular foods.

I would NOT have taken him when I did had I known...I would have waited for him to be really ready to leave his momma....I do not think birds should be sold until they are fully weaned!

 

[goalerjones]

Not a trend in California, it's illegal to sell unweaned babies here.

 

[RavensGryf]

Not a trend in California, it's illegal to sell unweaned babies here.

That's good, though I'm sure people break the law. Btw, I didn't know that. I'm in CA too Where I've heard about it happening so much is on the forum! We hear it here so regularly I just had to ask :11:

 

[RavensGryf]

My Pippin was only partially weaned when i got him, although I was told he was eating on his own at the time...it didn't take me very long to realize that he did NOT know what to do with solid food.

I spent the next little while teaching him how to eat mushy food and eventually got him onto solids but it was hard work and I know that even now, a year later, he is weirded out by unfamiliar foods unless he watches me eat them first and gets them carefully handfed to him or cut up very tiny and "hidden" in his regular foods.

I would NOT have taken him when I did had I known...I would have waited for him to be really ready to leave his momma....I do not think birds should be sold until they are fully weaned!

That makes me sick to hear that someone lied to you and said he was fully weaned when he clearly wasn't. They didn't care one bit about that baby! Another person only out for the money pushing the baby out the door as soon as they think they could get away with it.

 

[SharlenaSharlena]

Our Lorikeets (now a year) were purchased from fantastic breeder at 9 weeks who walked us through the whole hand-feeding process and held our hand every step of the way since it was our first time owning parrots. It was a positive experience for both my husband and myself and now I think as a result of being so bonded we can be so affectionate with our bird (kisses, foot rubs, letting us roll them over, shouldering, etc) behaviors I think would have been harder to for them to emote had we not gotten them weaned. The whole process made us so much more responsible. There are bad people out there who breed birds and sell them to inexperienced people for profit without teaching them what to do. I don't think a person is bad for wanting to learn how to hand raise a bird otherwise how else do you learn? It's just a shame there aren't enough responsible breeders out there willing to teach people more from the sound of it

 

[MikeyTN]

Our Lorikeets (now a year) were purchased from fantastic breeder at 9 weeks who walked us through the whole hand-feeding process and held our hand every step of the way since it was our first time owning parrots. It was a positive experience for both my husband and myself and now I think as a result of being so bonded we can be so affectionate with our bird (kisses, foot rubs, letting us roll them over, shouldering, etc) behaviors I think would have been harder to for them to emote had we not gotten them weaned. The whole process made us so much more responsible. There are bad people out there who breed birds and sell them to inexperienced people for profit without teaching them what to do. I don't think a person is bad for wanting to learn how to hand raise a bird otherwise how else do you learn? It's just a shame there aren't enough responsible breeders out there willing to teach people more from the sound of it

I happen to disagree since all of our birds were adults when we brought them home except a few that I hand raised myself, but I'm a experienced breeder. Malachai allows me to roll him over, he lays on his back in the palm of my hand. I rub his feet, under his wings, wherever I want to rub. With proper training it can be done even if not a baby. With hand fed babies, without proper training they can be just as vicious as the adult ones that haven't been handled.

 

[SharlenaSharlena]

Our Lorikeets (now a year) were purchased from fantastic breeder at 9 weeks who walked us through the whole hand-feeding process and held our hand every step of the way since it was our first time owning parrots. It was a positive experience for both my husband and myself and now I think as a result of being so bonded we can be so affectionate with our bird (kisses, foot rubs, letting us roll them over, shouldering, etc) behaviors I think would have been harder to for them to emote had we not gotten them weaned. The whole process made us so much more responsible. There are bad people out there who breed birds and sell them to inexperienced people for profit without teaching them what to do. I don't think a person is bad for wanting to learn how to hand raise a bird otherwise how else do you learn? It's just a shame there aren't enough responsible breeders out there willing to teach people more from the sound of it

I happen to disagree since all of our birds were adults when we brought them home except a few that I hand raised myself, but I'm a experienced breeder. Malachai allows me to roll him over, he lays on his back in the palm of my hand. I rub his feet, under his wings, wherever I want to rub. With proper training it can be done even if not a baby. With hand fed babies, without proper training they can be just as vicious as the adult ones that haven't been handled.

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree since we have obviously had different experiences. I don't think every bad experience is the standard experience and if someone is interested in learning they should be taught how to do it properly not scared off from it. That's all.

 

[veimar]

I'm relatively new to the parrot world, and I would be totally HORRIFIED to get an unweaned baby! regardless of the fact that I do tons of research and reading about parrots on a daily basis. I think it's not a good idea unless the baby goes to someone who has experience.
The availability of baby formulas, easy video instructions on youtube, 'wiki how' sort of things and faster money might have triggered this trend IMHO. Even when I got Parry from Petsmart (he was "fresh" from the breeder and only 2-3 days on the floor) he was really bad at eating himself. I had to crush everything into tiny pieces and feed him from my hand for the first week.

 

[Sterling1113]

I would also be terrified to bring home an unweaned baby. I'm so paranoid about my adult birds' health , I'd be up every hour checking on the baby bird!!
*if* (not 'when', IF) I EVER considered hand rearing id spend an extended period of time with a breeder and take several classes before trying anything by myself. Too many risks.

 

[aliray]

Just another thought, puppies are better off left with their mom and siblings till weaned and eating on their own to learn social skills and how to be a dog. It is harder to bottle raise a dog by itself and teach what mom and siblings would such as bite inhibition etc. Is their a difference between handfed and parent raised after they are tamed adults? Just wondering

 

[RavensGryf]

Good point there, and I agree it's best anytime a puppy can be raised with mom to learn how to be a dog. BUT, since dogs are domestic, they are still tame after being parent raised. If a parrot is 100% parent raised you'll end up with a really wild bird.
Many breeders do half and half. Let them be parent raised at first, then at some point take over with hand feeding by a human.

I've read where studies showed the difference between birds weaned and pushed off to their new home too fast, vs hanging around even after weaning to be "taught the ropes" by a "nanny bird" for up to a year old! Of course breeders aren't going to do that for practical reasons, but the study was interesting nonetheless. The study was on African Greys, but I bet it applies to other sensitive species as well, like Cockatoos...? The studies found that these birds raised by the "nanny" grew up to be 'birds' (although tame and hand fed by humans) they grew up to be confident, well adjusted, more resistant to plucking and neuroses.... That's NOT saying that otherwise they will be maladjusted, it was pointing out how these birds raised in a setting and time frame closer TO THAT IN THE WILD were noticeably more resistant to common behavior issues, mainly plucking. It goes without saying that plucking can have other roots though.

 

[Eugooglizer]

I see unweaned baby birds for sale on my local CL on a daily basis :/. In fact I was looking just now and saw an ad for a baby black capped conure where the seller offers to finish handfeeding it themselves if you pay a deposit, but then says "You can handfeed it your self i highly recommend for you to hand feed it due to the fact it will bond a lot better".

 

[jiyabird]

I bought an Umbrella Cockatoo from Critter County Junction in Tampa Florida mid April of 2014.
When I first spoke with the guy he gave no indication to me that the baby was NOT weaned.
AFTER I had paid for him, made flight arrangements and was confirming shipping times he told me I MIGHT still have to hand feed him THREE times a day but it was easy, no problem and he would WRITE a note as to how and to call if any ???'s.
I asked my vet if I came by when the flight came in would she show me how to hand feed formula and she refused explaining how very dangerous it was for someone inexperienced what with temperature and misplacement of the syringe and all.
She referred me to a bird lady who had hand fed over 150 Umbys alone.
Luckily she agreed to take Domino.
I have had my sweet baby home for one week...ONE WEEK!
He was with a wet nurse for two months! I have NO idea what happened to his two poor clutch mates.
When I called the guy to tell him this he became very angry and belligerent.
No dealer should EVER sell these precious bundles of delicate feathers to people who have no idea what to do with them nor should they be pulled so early just for greed.

 

[RavensGryf]

I see unweaned baby birds for sale on my local CL on a daily basis :/. In fact I was looking just now and saw an ad for a baby black capped conure where the seller offers to finish handfeeding it themselves if you pay a deposit, but then says "You can handfeed it your self i highly recommend for you to hand feed it due to the fact it will bond a lot better".

And so of course tons of people 'buy' that line and make it so much easier on the breeder. Crankin them out like a factory, and raking in the dough...

I bought an Umbrella Cockatoo from Critter County Junction in Tampa Florida mid April of 2014.
When I first spoke with the guy he gave no indication to me that the baby was NOT weaned.
AFTER I had paid for him, made flight arrangements and was confirming shipping times he told me I MIGHT still have to hand feed him THREE times a day but it was easy, no problem and he would WRITE a note as to how and to call if any ???'s.
I asked my vet if I came by when the flight came in would she show me how to hand feed formula and she refused explaining how very dangerous it was for someone inexperienced what with temperature and misplacement of the syringe and all.
She referred me to a bird lady who had hand fed over 150 Umbys alone.
Luckily she agreed to take Domino.
I have had my sweet baby home for one week...ONE WEEK!
He was with a wet nurse for two months! I have NO idea what happened to his two poor clutch mates.
When I called the guy to tell him this he became very angry and belligerent.
No dealer should EVER sell these precious bundles of delicate feathers to people who have no idea what to do with them nor should they be pulled so early just for greed.

That's awful. Was that a breeder or a store? I'm glad that lady was able to take your baby until he was ready for you to take home and love.

No wonder the was guy getting defensive when you called... If he didn't tell you til LAST MINUTE that the baby wasn't weaned, he obviously knew that it was something that not everyone would accept, and was trying to be sneaky about it. Good for you for calling him out on it. It's one thing if people are up front about selling unweaned babies. Though I don't agree with it, at least they're not hiding it... This is even worse! I'm glad your baby is home for you to enjoy now

I have zero problem with it.

I know I've read your other posts... We are all entitled to our opinions whether everyone on the forum agrees or not.

 

[Eugooglizer]

I see unweaned baby birds for sale on my local CL on a daily basis :/. In fact I was looking just now and saw an ad for a baby black capped conure where the seller offers to finish handfeeding it themselves if you pay a deposit, but then says "You can handfeed it your self i highly recommend for you to hand feed it due to the fact it will bond a lot better".

[And so of course tons of people 'buy' that line and make it so much easier on the breeder. Crankin them out like a factory, and raking in the dough...

Yes it's very sad and frustrating. I have noticed multiple other posts from this same person for several other species of baby parrots who are also unweaned that include the same statement about them recommending the buyer handfeed it themselves in order to "bond better". Iirc there are also turquoise GCCs and blue crowned conures among others :/. And I know that in my area especially, there are many unethical people out there always looking to breed whatever is considered "rare" or "exotic" in order to sell the babies for an even more inflated price and thus make more profit. And because that's their true motivation, they're willing to sell to anyone who shows up with the cash.

 

[95talongirl]

I also disagree with it....

Had the unfortunate responsibility as a kid to take over feeding some cockatiel babies after their parents decided to abandon them. As a ~10 yr old this was a daunting task.. I had no help other than a book from the local library, and of course no money for things like a brooder and proper feeding equipment. So did what I could with a heat lamp and old aquarium. I did loose a few, probably to sour crop or something like that. It was devastating. The ones that did survive were quite characters and i adored them. But I NEVER want to do that again. It's scary when you don't know what to do, and its an art. I did whatever I could to discouraging the 'tiels form breeding after that, and any bird I got from there on out was fully weaned.

I haven't seen much of a difference in the temperament of the birds I raised, and from those that came to me after being weaned, or from a previous home. I think as long as you work with them, show them love, ect, no matter how old or how they were raised, you could have a sweet tempered bird.