Screeching has got to stop

[gracebowen]

I have had a newborn so I do understand. Im not trying to be mean.

His screeching is keeping baby up. You say you cany reward doc for being quiet because you are busy with the baby and stuck in a chair.

Why cant you just take baby with you give doc a quick scritch, good bird and a treat. If that keeps doc quiet for a while it will be easier to get baby to sleep.

Also I saw they are making special noise reduction hats for babies. I was looking for one for me.
Just Google noise reduction hat.

 

[gracebowen]

Amazon.com: Organic Cotton Infant Noise Reduction Hat: Clothing

Heres the link.[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Organic-Cotton-Infant-Noise-Reduction/dp/B007V5W8BG#"]Amazon.com: Organic Cotton Infant Noise Reduction Hat: Clothing[/ame]

 

[Piasa]

I've been thinking a lot about your situation, Tidbit. It is incredibly frustrating when you keep trying things and get nowhere.

You have received a lot of advice and so many good ideas. I know you have tried some without success, and some are assuming things that aren't really happening - but it is not useless info. Modify it to work for you or try something new. Behavior changing is definitely personal.

Regarding snuggling, you will get a lot of conflicting advice. Part of it is semantics, part is because there is disagreement. Personally, I am in the same camp as your vet. Cuddling a bird (preening them), petting their head/neck/shoulders/beak, and letting them lean against you is all fine and should be done - this is social and family behavior. Back including under the wings/belly/groin are all personal areas that can elicit sexual responses when touched - mate and breeding behavior. Holding a bird cupped in your hand often or for long periods of time also can be construed as sexual.

Does Doc have a shower perch? If not, make or buy one and try bringing him in the shower (or have hub or daughter do this). Many birds love it! My conure sits on the shower rod and steams. Also a wet bird will be busy preening and cleaning, not screaming.

If you have a yard or patio and the space, you could have an outdoor cage or aviary for him. This can give you some space if you need it for sanity.

You haven't mentioned much about toys or playing, but if he doesn't play - teach him! If he does, try different toys as distractions, things to do. Edible plants are wonderful toys - even better if they think they are getting away with something by shredding the leaves.

What do I do when a bird screeches in the same room as me? When he first starts, I tell him it's okay. If he continues, I ignore him: I tune him out, don't make eye contact or talk to him until he stops. I try not to be affected, because if you are affected - even if you hide it! - the bird knows. I know you have been doing this. You just have to stick it out, or figure it out.

 

[Brittany741]

Covering him, punishment, and negative reinforcement is going to make things a lot worse.

Can you upload a video of his screaming and post it to YouTube? This may help us determine if he is truly screaming or if he is making normal bird noises.

While I know it would be very upsetting for your daughter (my daughter is about to turn 9, so I get it,) rehoming Doc may truly be your best bet. Sometimes doing what's best for the bird means giving him a new start where someone does have the time and energy. That's no fault of your own, having a new baby is HARD without a screaming bird.

 

[ATidbit]

I was actually just trying to find a way to upload a video. It isn't normal noises.

I am frustrated. I'm still confused. I understand punishment vs reward. I don't know how to apply it. I can't get up when the baby is actively nursing and my babe will nurse for 30 minutes to an hour. I can't get up when he is falling asleep, or fussing. I come give Doc attention as soon as I can.

So this video is from this morning. I was up with baby at 6. Uncovered and opened cage at 7 when the baby went back to sleep. Doc and I had been having a fine time. He was happy and chirping. Then he heard my daughter get up and start moving around. My daughter is Doc's favorite person. So he started screeching because he wants her to come out. Which she did for breakfast. I can't stop that. She ignored him while she ate. But Doc got what he wanted. His screeching was rewarded with her presence. As soon as she went back to the room, this is what happened. You can see her move around in the back. This was only one minute of a 15 minute screech session. Now the baby is crying. No one can sleep through this. And I put Doc in the other room hoping to avoid that.

As for toys, he doesn't play with them. We rearrange regularly, but other then one or two, he ignores them. We are due for some new ones. I don't know how to teach him to play with toys. This is really my first bird. We had one for a couple of months before, but he didn't like people. Doc is very friendly. He was hand fed and loves people. He also isn't fond of showers. He likes to sit on the bar, but runs if I put my hand up for him. And I've never forced him into the water. I just hold him outside the spray to see how he reacts. I figured he would tell me by moving away or to the shower. So now I let him be.

How soon should I see improvement with ignoring him? We are going on months here and it's actually gotten worse. Or my level of being able to handle it has gotten less.

I can't seem to upload the video and I don't have time to futz with it. Here is the link

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7NL2Wm19og&feature=youtu.be"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7NL2Wm19og&feature=youtu.be[/ame]

 

[ATidbit]

Oh, geez. It just loaded it automatically. Of course

 

[gracebowen]

Why cant you get up with the baby. Yes it will disturb baby for a min but a screaming bird disturbs baby too.

Cant you just let the baby keep feeding while walking around. I started out with first baby just feeding or just putting to sleep just like you. Soon after I started carrying baby around during feeding.

1 hand to hold baby. 1 hand to do other things.

 

[ATidbit]

The baby has latch problems. He was born with a big tongue tie and lip tie. They have both been fixed, but we are still working on our latch. I have occasionally moved around while nursing, but it's not something that works often. I will come out if baby is fussing. What is a little more noise at that time?

 

[Christinenc2000]

If you truly want to work with your bird, it WILL require just that: WORK. And LOTS of it. And LOTS of patience, and 'give and take' as well.

If you take the time and search the forum for behavior modification, we have TONS of helpful links. But again, it will take time AND dedication. It wont' happen overnight.

We all want nothing more than for you to work things out with Doc. For you all to be happy and live harmoniously. It's a lifetime adventure. It's also a lifetime learning progress.

Wendy gave some great advise.

 

[gracebowen]

Ok I understand better now. The hat might help baby sleep.

 

[Birdman666]

Sounds a little like a touch of conure "spoiled bird syndrome" i.e. possibly just held too much.

It's important that he doesn't get his way when he screams. Every time you pick him up, you reinforce the screaming.

Here are the screaming behavior mods:

http://www.parrotforums.com/training/48649-screaming-behavior-mods.html

Consistency is the key, and rewarding the bird FOR QUIETING DOWN is the message you're trying to send. So praise him and give him treats for being quiet. IGNORE HIM WHEN HE'S SCREAMING OR THROWING A TANTRUM.

What will probably help is if IN ADDITION TO THIS you add/impose structure to his daily routine. This is how it's going to be from here on out, bird. Get used to it.

This is your outside time. You only get it if you behave and you're quiet.

This is your inside time. Throw a fit, and you get covered until you quiet down.

This is your meal time.

This is the time you get handled.

This is the time you play/hang out on your own. Screaming doesn't change that, it only puts you in time out.

This is bedtime.

 

[ATidbit]

I forgot to add that before my daughter went back to her room, she stopped at the cage and said talked to Doc for a min or two.

 

[Birdman666]

Yeah. Not spoiled bird syndrome then, pair bond bird. Calling to a favorite person kind of stuff...

Consistency is the key. The same thing has to happen every time, and the bird has to associate that with the bad behavior. QUIET has to be praised and reinforced...

Everyone has to be on board with this.

How long it takes depends on the bird.

Once the structure is established, it's generally etched in stone. Establishing it can take anywhere from a few days, to a few months, depending on the bird and how quickly he learns, and of course, how stubborn he is.

 

[plumsmum2005]

Could you let Doc come out in the morning for a little while while your daughter has her breakfast? Then when that is over put him back with his breakfast? I think the routine suggestion would be a good thing. They get to know what happens when and hope he will settle down as a consequence.

 

[Brittany741]

Latch issues are truly awful. My daughter had severe reflux and nursed every hour and a half for 14 months to the point I was actually losing my mind due to sleep deprivation.

I was able to do a lot more with a pouch sling when she was tiny, as I could nurse her and move around at the same time.

You may have better success with a box fan in the baby's room. Point it at a wall and turn it on high.

 

[ATidbit]

I have a white noise machine in there.

I read that thread birdman. That's basically what we have done. He just hasn't gotten the correlation between scream-cover. Maybe we aren't rewarding him soon enough. I will try to get everyone to be better at that, but there are going to be times I can't get to him right away.

I do have a couple more questions. What does pair bond mean in terms of changing this behavior? It's not just with my daughter too. If he hears anyone in another part of the house, he will screech. Second, what do you do if he's screeching and not in or on his cage? Do I pick him up and put him in his cage or will he consider that attention?

 

[Sucre]

You really sound like you've got your hands full. I can't imagine!

To me, having 3 conures, it sounds like he's wanting attention. If he bonded as a mate with your niece and your niece is no longer there, that should not be the problem. And while I agree with your vet regarding large parrots and "inappropriate" petting, I don't agree with him / her on conures. They are pretty equal opportunity parrots.

With Doc, it sounds like there is a lot going on around him, but in his opinion, not enough attention is being directed towards him. With two young children, that isn't going to change for quite some time.

If he is unhappy and making the household miserable, have you considered giving him to the niece? Would that be an option at all?

We had an umbrella cockatoo. I had dreamed of having one my entire life. He was 6 years old when we got him - we had cockatiels and budgies before, but knew absolutely nothing about cockatoos other than that they were beautiful and entertaining. The first two weeks were a breeze, and we fell in love with him. The more used to us that he got, the more time he started spending with my husband, which was fine, but no one ever told us to only pet / scratch around their head and neck. Sucre got a full body rub down every evening when we came home from work. He started screeching anytime he wasn't on my husband. He became terribly aggressive towards me, to the point that I would have to close myself off in another room to keep from getting attacked. I sought advice and we worked for weeks trying to get him to at least accept me in the same room. When we realized how upside down he had turned our lives, we knew we had to rehome him. We had 2 little dogs that he terrorized, lovebirds and parrotlet getting absolutely NO attention, and we were working all day and spending our evenings in separate rooms to try to keep Sucre happy. We both cried for days, but it was for the best for him, and us. He is now living with a single lady who takes him everywhere with her. He's had more vacations in the past 2 months than I have had in the past 10 years. He exhibits NONE of the behavior he exhibited with us. She's had birds for years and she knows how to handle him. We did not.

I can feel your frustration in your posts. Doc can certainly feel it in the same room with you, just like our U2 could feel my fear. You can't control how you feel, but you can do what you have to do to make everyone's life easier.

I don't advocate rehoming animals. In fact, I do small animal rescue. But I do believe that with birds, sometimes you just don't have a good fit, and that really sounds like the case with Doc. Your plate is just too full, and I bet the stress is affecting everyone else as much as it is you.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. Just know that sometimes the last decision you want to make is the best decision.

 

[lplummer52]

You are asking your bird to understand the future now that baby is here. Birds don't do future...they don't plan ahead. All he knows is that something is missing that he used to love. This will take a long time for him to change his outlook and may never happen. Was he hand-fed? If so, he thinks he is the baby and Doesn't even know he's a bird! It's like feeding your baby and then putting him in his crib until the next feeding. Even if he's not hungry, he wants to be held and cuddled. Same thing for Doc. Maybe your 9-year old can take over where your niece left off? If not, then I would encourage you to re-home Doc to a home where someone can give him LOTS of attention. He's obviously a bird that requires a lot of interaction with people. You can never undo that...it's already instilled in him.