Harrison's Pellets Seem Questionable

[Teddscau]

So, I was reading about different pellet brands so I could explain to my dad about why I don't like pellets. They all claim to be nutritionally complete, but they don't list the vitamin or mineral content, just protein, fat, ash, and moisture. Well, when I started reading about Harrison's things got even sketchier. Well, I think these links explain it well.
7 Questions With Dr. Harrison | Harrison's Bird Foods
Eclectus, commercial bird food diets and ?toe-tapping? | Harrison's Bird Foods

The second link claims that it's healthy for eclectus to toe tap, and that they should receive nutrient dense foods, especially pellets.

Here's some quotes from the first link:
1. Please share your thoughts about the trend of chopped, cook and serve or soak and serve foods for birds?

The bottom line on most cook/soak and serve foods is that they are not balanced and don’t offer much in the way of playing a part of a balanced diet. Those diets are for bird owners, not birds. They do not contain the essential nutrients etc. to make up a complete diet. They lead to metabolic bone disease as well as elevated cholesterol.


5. I mean no disrespect, but some people I’ve talked to say that no pelleted food can possibly meet a bird’s total nutritional needs. They say a bird needs the variety in shapes, color, palatability and vitamin content to keep its interest, to allow it to forage, and fulfill its nutritional requirements. How do you approach this topic?

A lot of people offer unsubstantiated opinions on this topic but Harrison’s backs up our claims with studies, clinical trials and actual results.

Birds do not need variety in shapes or novel colors.

Food is for nutrition, while foraging and proper socialization serves other needs. A bird depending on food for entertainment or socialization is not going to be a very entertained or socialized bird.

Harrison’s is fully fortified with vitamins. It is a proven complete diet that yields the best long term health results of any documented commercial or homemade diet. Harrison’s is the only diet proven to prevent metabolic bone disease, as well as prevent and reduce elevated cholesterol.

------------------

I mean, these are just some of the questionable things that Harrison's says about parrot diet. Why are their pellets so great? Here's the ingredients in their pellets: *Corn, *Hull-less Barley, *Hulled Gray Millet, *Toasted Soybeans, *Peas, *Lentils, *Peanut Kernels, *Sunflower Kernels, *Toasted Oat Groats, *Alfalfa, *Brown Rice, and *Chia.

Okay, you're probably wondering how parrots can get proper nutrition from that. Well, here's what the other ingredients are:
Calcium Carbonate, Bentonite, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Sea Kelp, Salt *Algae Meal, Vitamin/Mineral Supplement (Vitamin A Palmitate, Vitamin D3 Supplement, dl-Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Niacin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Zinc Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Sodium Selenite, Calcium Carbonate and *Sunflower Oil)

So basically, Harrison's pellets are just junk food with a bunch of vitamin and mineral supplements? I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be hard on them or anyone who gives their birds this brand. But, apparently this should make up at least 90% of a parrot's diet? How is this healthier than a well planned whole food diet? The feeding directions actually warn about what fruits and veggies you can and cannot give a bird on Harrison's. If you don't follow it to a tee, you put your bird at risk of deficiencies and vitamin overdose.

 

[SailBoat]

I am really unsure what it is that you are trying to get too. Your discussion seems based on cutting 'Marketing' plates and Forum responses.

Today, a health diet is a combination of Healthy fresh foods combined with a Healthy dry food base, which represents a high-end pellets with a high quality seeds, grains, nuts, etc... mixed to the needs of a specific Parrot species. This commonly means; no sunflower seed or peanuts. The percentage is heavy toward the fresh foods with the dry foods a lower percentage.

Harrison's like near everything sold today have a marketing department that has a very specific responsibility: Sell Product!

I use Harrison's, but it represents a segment of an overall offering.

 

[CherylCali]

I feel like pellets are a good staple for me. I live in a small town and lack a variety of accesible fresh foods, there is no high end grocer here at all. I buy green bananas only one at a time and it spoils before Early can finish it. I have one petite green cheek conure and I simply can't afford to re-up a completely nutrionally balanced supply of produce every three days. I live in incredibly high heat and humidity, I am fearful of sprouting due to human error, or environmental constraints. So pellets give me a safety and assurance that a base nutrition is being met, and everything else I am capable of providing is just an additon to that.

CherylCali

 

[Teddscau]

...I actually don't remember what I was trying to get at 0_o. I appreciate what pellets can do for birds living in places such as you, CherylCali. What I don't really get is why so many avian vets are so quick to get on your case over not feeding at least a 75% pelleted diet. As soon as I told the Bowmanville vet that my birds aren't on a pelleted diet, she said any and all problems that they're experiencing is because they're not on pellets. Honestly, Lara's just morbidly obese because of bad breeding and needs to have her activity level monitored or else she becomes so obese and weak that she has trouble even moving. Also, I think the vet should have been a bit more concerned over the fact that Alice has flair ups with her vent, causing poop to get stuck to her vent which leads to her plucking most of the feathers from her vent. It gets so sore and raw.

Maybe I'm still ticked off that I spent over $700 for a vet to tell me my birds need to eat pellets.

 

[plumsmum2005]

...I actually don't remember what I was trying to get at 0_o. I appreciate what pellets can do for birds living in places such as you, CherylCali. What I don't really get is why so many avian vets are so quick to get on your case over not feeding at least a 75% pelleted diet. As soon as I told the Bowmanville vet that my birds aren't on a pelleted diet, she said any and all problems that they're experiencing is because they're not on pellets. Honestly, Lara's just morbidly obese because of bad breeding and needs to have her activity level monitored or else she becomes so obese and weak that she has trouble even moving. Also, I think the vet should have been a bit more concerned over the fact that Alice has flair ups with her vent, causing poop to get stuck to her vent which leads to her plucking most of the feathers from her vent. It gets so sore and raw.

Maybe I'm still ticked off that I spent over $700 for a vet to tell me my birds need to eat pellets.

Everyone who has spent loads at an AV's has been told the same not much fruit and Harrisons Pellets even though I have said Plum will only eat TOPs. Take with a pinch of salt - whoosh straight over the top of my head. I do not know why they push Harrisons (have a darn good idea) but as long as my AV treats what I have gone for. I will try my best to provide the best diet I can for him. Put your sensible head on and get on with it, because you do know what to do for your bird!

Pellets or seed - pellets! I am sorry but we do not live in an ideal world and you have to take what info you can and try to make the best decisions for your bird.

 

[Teddscau]

Man, I've been trying to get the budgies to eat Goldn'obles III and TOPs, but you can probably guess how that's going. That'll just be 1/4 of their diet, with 1/3 being stuff I've baked for them (IF I can get them to eat the baked goods), and the rest consisting of fresh veggies and sprouts.

Noah definitely prefers the Goldenfeast over the TOPs. I have to wonder if he's actually eating any of it, or just making a pile of powder in the bottom of his dish...

So, what's your theory on the pushing of Harrison's? Is there money exchanging hands?

 

[plumsmum2005]

Man, I've been trying to get the budgies to eat Goldn'obles III and TOPs, but you can probably guess how that's going. That'll just be 1/4 of their diet, with 1/3 being stuff I've baked for them (IF I can get them to eat the baked goods), and the rest consisting of fresh veggies and sprouts.

Noah definitely prefers the Goldenfeast over the TOPs. I have to wonder if he's actually eating any of it, or just making a pile of powder in the bottom of his dish...

So, what's your theory on the pushing of Harrison's? Is there money exchanging hands?

Asked my AV re the dust making and they all do it. Just keep giving them. Theory, you have a brain don't you?
Plum has turned the tables on me and now will eat pellets great but chop nooo! Any ideas LOL? BTW re Harrisons Plum has taken to scooping the whole contents of his pellet pot out if I mix with TOPs unless I use a Pestle and Mortar on them to make into dust for him? Keep going, it takes endless patience.

 

[SailBoat]

Why Harrison's are so widely excepted by our Avian Vets:

Yes much of it has to do with their Marketing Department. Also, Harrison's being at every AVA meeting with presentations and Q&A sessions helps. Harrison's has a long History of 'HEARING' (that is a very important word!) recommendations for product improvement and additions to their lines from those Vets attending.

No, I do not work for Harrison's, but I have made it a point to be part of the Management of Market Leading Organizations. I have Sold and Managed the Sales and Marketing of those Organizations. When your company's goal is doing it right, it just makes Sales and Marketing so much easier!

That said, they had been the first to provide the Avian Vet Association with a detailed (line item by line item) breakdown of what their pellets are made from. They had been the first to create their pellets out of only Human Grade supply sources and to process their pellets in an FDA approved (Human Grade) processing plant. Add to that their early push to eliminate Coloring, Salt, and greatly limit sugar in their products.

The efforts of Harrison's has not gone unnoticed in the Parrot Food Industry. Today, as a result of Harrison's and individuals like the membership of the Parrot Forums push for ever better quality of what we are providing our Parrots. The industry as a whole (but not all) have moved to providing an ever better product!

All of the above, caught the attention of the Association and its individual members. So, it is understandable that your Avian Vet would recommend Harrison's and the larger the percentage the better. But WHY!: Because the vast majority of their Client are not always truthful as to what they are feeding their Parrots. So, from the Avian Vet's position, better to push a high percentage of Pellets and hope for at least some percentage.


Want an eye opener: Ask your local Big Box Pet Supply Store what their largest volume of 'Parrot Food' sales are! You will find that it is commonly the cheapest seed package they have!

Which Pellet is best for your Parrot? What your Parrot will eat! Having said that, target low to no coloring, low to no salt and low to no sugar.

 

[Teddscau]

Ah, thanks SailBoat. As part of the budgie lovers community, I don't have a whole lot of experience with pellets and all the in depth nutritional analysis of various foods. It tends to be more of a "larger parrot" issue, I find. I mean, with budgies, they don't have the same "exotic" diets as you see with other parrots. In the wild, budgies eat grass seeds and other seeds at various stages of development, eucalyptus, peppermint tree, bottlebrush, some flowers and buds, the occasional fruit, but that's basically it. You still have to worry about nutritional deficiencies, but not in the same way as the parrot community at large. I'm definitely learning a lot. I know that with parrots, you basically do what works best for your bird, but that's even more so with budgies.

You're definitely right about "cheap food sells." I have to buy EVERYTHING for my birds online, with the exception of some foods I can buy at the health food store. In Canada, shipping's a killer 0_0

To be completely honest, I've actually quit giving Noah his chop. Umm, I guess you could try putting the chop and pellets in a food processor with some flour and flax eggs, then put them on some greased cookie trays in Galah sized pieces, and bake them? I know you want your boy to eat some raw stuff, but at least baking it would help it last longer? You could also do up some chop, but instead of just chopping it, purée it and mix in a bunch of wheat germ and almond butter so it can be like dry, uncooked batter. Like, not wet or sticky. Then you could freeze the extras and give Plum some foot sized pieces. Actually, I think I might try these ideas with Noah...

 

[GaleriaGila]

My first and current avian vets recommended Harrison's, and my bird has been eating them for 25+ years, supplemented by fresh produce and healthy seeds/nuts. When I initially converted him, my vet advised putting the pellets out all day, and then giving him the seed-mix (his current diet) for two 20-minute periods a day. That kept him hungry, but sustained. He was eating pellets with the week. I love Harrison's.

 

[Terry57]

Out of all our birds, I only have one who will eat Harrisons. No matter what I did to it, they all completely avoided the feed bowl.
We feed pellets (Tropican and Zupreem) and all my birds love both of those, but the bulk of their diet is fresh.

 

[jenphilly]

Pellets will always be a hot topic debate... and what is the right or best pellet... Reality - consider pellet like a meal bar or health bar for humans. They should be not the full diet, but they are great source for a healthy addition and convenience. And what is the right pellet... well excluding the really bad ones that have too much sugar, the right answer is simple- the pellet your parrot will eat.

I think most vets and anyone who has studied avian nutrition (Jason Crean is a great example) will encourage fresh foods. Much like any living creature, fresh foods mean a healthy body. We use pellets, but they are only a small part of the diet in our home. And I laugh at the thought that any cooked or soaked food is automatically not healthy. There are few options that are healthier for birds or people then live veggies - and those 'live' veggies start with soaking and sprouting. Again, its part of the diet. No person would be healthy drinking only 'well balanced' health or meal replacement shakes. So, pellets simple logic and common sense would say that pellets are not a health entire diet for our birds. Am I babbling a bit here or rambling in circle... feel a bit like I am...

Okay, focus, Jen... when we talk to adopters about diet, we suggest visiting sites like cookingforparrots.com. We suggest a few options for pellets (and Harrisons is not always one because we don't have the best luck getting parrots to eat them). But, we do suggest Roudybush California, Caitec, Zupreem Naturals (tho they have sugar, but if that is what a bird will eat), Hagen and Lafeber. I also am a huge fan of pellet alternatives offered by Phoenix Foraging. My macaw loves them. But pellets should not be 90% of a diet.

Anyone who says foraging and food do not go hand in hand with birds need to watch some bird videos and explain to me what they are doing to find their food. Cockatoos are ground dwellers, they are too often found digging up and foraging thru a field of crops eating roots and ground veggies. Parrots shred bark and leaves to get to berries or shred apart the leaves themselves. Tho most of us don't consider it, but parrots shred bark to also find some bugs and larva that they eat. Parrots do need protein too! Birds spend all day working and looking for food in the wild - that is foraging! Not bird in the wild is foraging for a finger trap or palm daisy or foam chunk to shred for the fun of it - their energy is spent searching for food to survive.

Topic of limit of fresh foods available to you... Super simple and incredibly healthy - SPROUTS! No one reading this can tell me they don't have access to sprouts. Even if you have a small grocery story that carries no dried lentils, beans, chick peas, etc., if you're online you can order these items!! And sprouts do not need to be the expensive sprout mixes you see for sale for parrots, they are a great marketing tool that are making some companies a lot of money. Reality... go to your local grocery or Walmart, in the aisle where you will find the bags of dried beans, just pick up lentils (you want the tan only, red tend to get mushy); garbanzo / chick peas; pigeon peas / beans; black eye peas; whole peas (split peas do not sprout).... I can come up with a list of others, but avoid kidney and lima off the top of my head. Years ago I did a sprouting post with videos, not sure that is still here and available, but it has lots of info about sprouting literally step by step. Sprouts are fantastic to have for your birds if fresh veggies are limited. But, if veggies are limited, go with planting up some herbs and such to grow on your windowsill! Options, options, options... think outside the box, you don't need to go to the store and buy it - grow it!!! And quality frozen veggies are wonderful options when fresh veggies are not available. Don't cook the frozen veggies, simply place them in warm water to unthaw. You can find collard greens, squash, broccoli, cauliflower, corn, carrots, beans, snap peas, various colored bell peppers, okra and more in your frozen food section! Again, just unthaw them and viola, you have excellent options for veggies for your birds! Even if you share your dinner with your bird, healthy steamed veggies are not bad options for your birds. You don't want boil away the nutrients in water, but steaming - just like for us, healthy options that keep more nutritional value!

And then there are so many excellent options these days for dried mixes! No reason why a bird cannot have a very varied diet that helps to replicate different items they come across in nature. I personally think at the moment I have problem near a dozen different mixes. I'll take pics if you want me too!! I have 4 different mixes from Goldfeast, 2 or 3 mixes from mybirdstore Worldly line and think there are 3 bags on the table my daughter just got from mysafebirdstore.com.

Feed your bird like you eat - variety!!! Well, I guess I'm giving everyone credit that they eat healthy... I could be giving that advice and someone will start feeding their parrots pizza, cheese steaks and hamburgers - hey Jen said to eat a variety like us Sorry, being a smart aleck... But, sometimes, I think we overthink and listen to the 'experts' too much. I get adopters all the time who believe what they are doing is right because the persona who sold them whatever convinced them it was the right food, cage, toy, supplement, blah, blah, blah... Anyone who tells you they have the absolute right answer and their way is the only way or the 'right' way is trying to sell you something... that is so dang true when it comes to our parrots!!

Listen to the real experts - your parrot!!!

Okay, I've officially babbled for way too long... guess it's a good thing the Mods don't have timers or zappers connected to the reply option, I would have been shocked about 500 words ago!

 

[plumsmum2005]

Pellets will always be a hot topic debate... and what is the right or best pellet... Reality - consider pellet like a meal bar or health bar for humans. They should be not the full diet, but they are great source for a healthy addition and convenience. And what is the right pellet... well excluding the really bad ones that have too much sugar, the right answer is simple- the pellet your parrot will eat.

I think most vets and anyone who has studied avian nutrition (Jason Crean is a great example) will encourage fresh foods. Much like any living creature, fresh foods mean a healthy body. We use pellets, but they are only a small part of the diet in our home. And I laugh at the thought that any cooked or soaked food is automatically not healthy. There are few options that are healthier for birds or people then live veggies - and those 'live' veggies start with soaking and sprouting. Again, its part of the diet. No person would be healthy drinking only 'well balanced' health or meal replacement shakes. So, pellets simple logic and common sense would say that pellets are not a health entire diet for our birds. Am I babbling a bit here or rambling in circle... feel a bit like I am...

Okay, focus, Jen... when we talk to adopters about diet, we suggest visiting sites like cookingforparrots.com. We suggest a few options for pellets (and Harrisons is not always one because we don't have the best luck getting parrots to eat them). But, we do suggest Roudybush California, Caitec, Zupreem Naturals (tho they have sugar, but if that is what a bird will eat), Hagen and Lafeber. I also am a huge fan of pellet alternatives offered by Phoenix Foraging. My macaw loves them. But pellets should not be 90% of a diet.

Anyone who says foraging and food do not go hand in hand with birds need to watch some bird videos and explain to me what they are doing to find their food. Cockatoos are ground dwellers, they are too often found digging up and foraging thru a field of crops eating roots and ground veggies. Parrots shred bark and leaves to get to berries or shred apart the leaves themselves. Tho most of us don't consider it, but parrots shred bark to also find some bugs and larva that they eat. Parrots do need protein too! Birds spend all day working and looking for food in the wild - that is foraging! Not bird in the wild is foraging for a finger trap or palm daisy or foam chunk to shred for the fun of it - their energy is spent searching for food to survive.

Topic of limit of fresh foods available to you... Super simple and incredibly healthy - SPROUTS! No one reading this can tell me they don't have access to sprouts. Even if you have a small grocery story that carries no dried lentils, beans, chick peas, etc., if you're online you can order these items!! And sprouts do not need to be the expensive sprout mixes you see for sale for parrots, they are a great marketing tool that are making some companies a lot of money. Reality... go to your local grocery or Walmart, in the aisle where you will find the bags of dried beans, just pick up lentils (you want the tan only, red tend to get mushy); garbanzo / chick peas; pigeon peas / beans; black eye peas; whole peas (split peas do not sprout).... I can come up with a list of others, but avoid kidney and lima off the top of my head. Years ago I did a sprouting post with videos, not sure that is still here and available, but it has lots of info about sprouting literally step by step. Sprouts are fantastic to have for your birds if fresh veggies are limited. But, if veggies are limited, go with planting up some herbs and such to grow on your windowsill! Options, options, options... think outside the box, you don't need to go to the store and buy it - grow it!!! And quality frozen veggies are wonderful options when fresh veggies are not available. Don't cook the frozen veggies, simply place them in warm water to unthaw. You can find collard greens, squash, broccoli, cauliflower, corn, carrots, beans, snap peas, various colored bell peppers, okra and more in your frozen food section! Again, just unthaw them and viola, you have excellent options for veggies for your birds! Even if you share your dinner with your bird, healthy steamed veggies are not bad options for your birds. You don't want boil away the nutrients in water, but steaming - just like for us, healthy options that keep more nutritional value!

And then there are so many excellent options these days for dried mixes! No reason why a bird cannot have a very varied diet that helps to replicate different items they come across in nature. I personally think at the moment I have problem near a dozen different mixes. I'll take pics if you want me too!! I have 4 different mixes from Goldfeast, 2 or 3 mixes from mybirdstore Worldly line and think there are 3 bags on the table my daughter just got from mysafebirdstore.com.

Feed your bird like you eat - variety!!! Well, I guess I'm giving everyone credit that they eat healthy... I could be giving that advice and someone will start feeding their parrots pizza, cheese steaks and hamburgers - hey Jen said to eat a variety like us Sorry, being a smart aleck... But, sometimes, I think we overthink and listen to the 'experts' too much. I get adopters all the time who believe what they are doing is right because the persona who sold them whatever convinced them it was the right food, cage, toy, supplement, blah, blah, blah... Anyone who tells you they have the absolute right answer and their way is the only way or the 'right' way is trying to sell you something... that is so dang true when it comes to our parrots!!

Listen to the real experts - your parrot!!!

Okay, I've officially babbled for way too long... guess it's a good thing the Mods don't have timers or zappers connected to the reply option, I would have been shocked about 500 words ago!

Thank you! What you say is complete sense. I was one of those people, totally afraid of doing things wrong by listening and reading too much. It can and does have a negative effect sometimes. All you need sometimes is what you have done here by saying just get on with it, have a go, explore and learn. Love the link btw will be exploring that more.

 

[Teddscau]

With Noah, it was amazingly easy to convert him from seeds to pellets. He'd been an all-seed diet for almost two years (he turned two this summer) and hadn't been handled since he was little, but I got him on sprouts and pellets almost immediately. All I had to do was show him the pellets, eat some, then I let him have some. He bonded instantly to me when he came to live with us back in June (I think?), and will try anything I give him. I have to work with him some more to get him to eat fresh fruits and veggies. He LOVES dried (edible) flowers I got from the health food store. Chamomile are his favourite.

As for the budgies, it'll take months to get them to eat pellets. Before bed and in the morning before I drag myself out of bed to get them sprouts and veggies, I'd have seed available. You know, just to keep them from starving before I got them the main course. Honestly, you can't imagine what happens if they go two hours without eating. Withholding all food except for pellets does NOT work with budgies. Even if I offered them seed for two twenty minute periods, they would probably resort to cannibalism. Or they might just try to eat me . Did that sound critical? I wasn't criticizing. I was just informing those who haven't kept budgies how stubborn they are. They'll actually starve themselves to death, believe it or not.

Anyways, I want to replace the budgies' seed with Goldn'obles and TOPs, and have the majority of their diet fresh veggies, sprouts, and stuff I've baked for them. Also, I have to teach them to eat baked food. Darn. Seriously, budgies are completely different from other parrots when it comes to feeding.

Patagonian conure's are definitely odd looking birds, eh? They definitely don't like your typical green-cheeked conures.

Oh, I just wanted to let you guys know that I'm not criticizing anyone who feeds Harrison's. Harrison's and Roudybush are considered two of the best pellets out there, with birds living long healthy lives thanks to them, but I definitely have a bit of a hard time wrapping my head around it, given the ingredients.

Man, I type too slow! Two replies before I even finished typing! I feed my guys a variety of sprouts each day (Kamut wheat, hull-less oats, barley, mung beans, and few different types of lentils), and up until our vet visit a few weeks back, they were the main part of their diet, along with sprouted millet and canary.

 

[jenphilly]

Pellet cheat too!! My pain in the butt bare eye too came to me at barely 3 having lived on a horried seed diet and was already in early stage liver function issues (yeah, talk about a shocking new bird health screening and bloodwork).... And even to this day, there are times she won't pellets. And even the only one she really eats is Caitec Oven Bites.

But, thinking like a parent... hide the pellets For the longest time, I put pellets thru the nutribullet and just dusted everything she ate. One way or another the pellets were going in!! Some of the bird treats I make are pellet based, same logic as avicakes, use pellets hidden within stuff the birds will eat. For Ivory it's sweet potatoes and most root veggies, so I'll make sweet potato bites for her and its ground pellets I use in place of any flour!

 

[snowflake311]

I was a Vet tech so I know a little about why Vets might do what they do. Example most of the vet school have Hills sponsor and teach about cat and dog nutrition. Weird that a dog food company has such a hand in teaching Vets..... Most vets only get a Crash corse on animal diet it is not a main part of the schooling. MUCH like our doctors. They are not taught much about nutrition That is separate.

Vet push the food that helps them. If you get what I am saying. The food that comes in and give free stuff or discounts to them. Vets and Vet techs get BIG discounts on the Hills food.

So yeah don't buy what your vets says do your own research. I think an ornithologist would know more about bird diets than a vet.

Pellets are a good staple but your bird should be getting more than that. Think of what they eat in the wild and go from there. Thats the best way to feed your bird. We can't always get all the fresh food so Pellets are a good filler.

 

[Dinosrawr]

I was a Vet tech so I know a little about why Vets might do what they do. Example most of the vet school have Hills sponsor and teach about cat and dog nutrition. Weird that a dog food company has such a hand in teaching Vets..... Most vets only get a Crash corse on animal diet it is not a main part of the schooling. MUCH like our doctors. They are not taught much about nutrition That is separate.

Vet push the food that helps them. If you get what I am saying. The food that comes in and give free stuff or discounts to them. Vets and Vet techs get BIG discounts on the Hills food.

So yeah don't buy what your vets says do your own research. I think an ornithologist would know more about bird diets than a vet.

Pellets are a good staple but your bird should be getting more than that. Think of what they eat in the wild and go from there. Thats the best way to feed your bird. We can't always get all the fresh food so Pellets are a good filler.

^ This. Your average DVM will not be highly qualified in nutrition aside from what they learned in their four years of college, which is from sponsored food companies. Unless you're talking to a specialized vet with a PhD in nutrition, or one that has a passion for the animal and does research outside of what is required of them, they will push for a diet that they have been taught to sell.

 

[wrench13]

Salty has pellets, roudys , available all day, he gets fruit in the am, and some kind of chop sprinkled with oat groats,or fresh veggies at nite. And some pine nuts as training treats.

 

[GaleriaGila]

Patagonian conure's are definitely odd looking birds, eh? They definitely don't like your typical green-cheeked conures.


Yesssss... Patagonians *ARE* odd conures.
You reminded me of a story: back in the early days, I was trying to show the Rbird how tasty Nutriberries were. I moved them to my mouth, said "mmmmm", even tried fake-biting one. No dice. He knew I wasn't eating it, and neither would he eat one. Finally I bit the bullet (pun intended) and popped one into my mouth, crunched, swallowed. He was satisfied, tried one... it was all good after that.
They're not so bad!

 

[CherylCali]

That is so AWESOME, I sample everything Early eats, including pellets and nutriberries. This sounds nuts (I am a little nuts) but I have a very sensitive pallet (sp) so I do quality control, pretty much daily. Mainly checking for mold or anything like that. I recently had dried cranberries for Early from the natural food section that tasted like pvc, and if I wouldn't taste tested I would have fed them to her.

I think of Patagonians in the same category as Queen of Bavarias, the upper echelons of conures.

CherylCali