It's been too long (yet again...)!

Hey everyone, It's been about 2 years ago since I last posted something on the forums.
It also has been around 2 years ago since our Blue Fronted Amazon Kobus tested positive for PBFD, and I've had my ups and downs dealing with that truth.



First, the good news is that Kobus is still in, what is visibly, very good health, still has plenty of energy for driving us completely nuts on a daily basis,
and being the absolute paradigm of what living with an Amazon parrot is all about.

Kobus has no noticeable bald patches across his body, and his plumage is intact all over. He has a healthy appetite, and a (mostly) healthy diet of pellets,
palm nut oil, veggies and fruits, and anything he can mooch of of us of the side.

The bad(-ish) news is that I feel that I'm starting to see little signs that Kobus might be not as completely healthy as he wants us to believe, and is
ever-so-slowly getting worse. I've been checking every feather that he ever dropped after "the test results" came back, holding them to a lightbulb
to check for signs of blood or other abnormalities, and until today, nothing exceptionally severe. Sometimes, feathers that came from his wings
(Nonflight, so I guess you can call those secondaries?) look a bit curly, but I suspect this has more to do with the actual shape of the wing,
although, ofcourse, this too had me worried at first.

About just an hour ago, however, I found this tiny contour feather from his face on the bottom of his cage, and although it's just a small one, it's
obviously "just not right". The shaft is pinched, it seems as if there isn't really a "tip", and there's what looks like it's blood on the end of the feather,
even though it's barely a drip.



Kobus head seems to be full of small pinfeathers at the moment (I mean an absolutely, positively unending amount, but only when you feel with
your fingers, not visible from the outside), which *I GUESS* seems pretty normal.

I help him getting rid of the sheath's by pinching them between my thumb and index finger, and he's usually okay with that. Sometimes, I seem
to have found a sensitive one, or one that just "isnt ready yet", and I seem to hurt him a bit, which scares me off.
The first thing that goes through my mind at moments like those is "Oh boy, I just hope it isn't a BAD feather..:17:"

Another thing I have been noticing, but of which I'm not sure that it's absolutely "abnormal", is the amount of down that Kobus seems to "drop"
(or rather, "remove") on a daily basis. Kobus loves to sit on the knee of the lady of the house, but when he does, he spends a lot of time "preening",
and by the end of every evening, a respectable amount of down can be seen where he sat. He's been doing since forever, by the way.

There's a lot of dust, which I suspect is absolutely normal, but the down feathers worry me a bit. Especially because Kobus sleeps in our bedroom,
nowadays, in a sleeping cage. When I wake up in the morning, he usually looks like he's "shivering", not a lot, but just... "a little", noticeable by his
belly, mostly. Our room temperature drops to about 63 degrees Fahrenheit at night, so I'd hardly say it's cold, but still... How much "down" does an
amazon parrot "produce"? Is there even going to be enough to keep him "insulated"?

Kobus sat next to me today and "sneezed", and I actually felt some fluid hit my face. I checked his nostrils, and they seemed clear, I couldn't find
any traces of "moist", nor did they seem irritated, or otherwise looking abnormal. I do feel as if the skin above his beak has become just a tad
more "loose", just as one might sometime have with your fingernail. Is this something to worry about?


I took this picture while I was writing this post


Other than this, Kobus' beak and nails seem absolutely fine, I was worried at first because Kobus does tend to have a flaky beak every now and
again, but just about everytime I see literally ANY other parrot up close, I remind myself that every beak flakes every now and again.

Am I being a regular worrybutt here?

Still, come what may, I just wanted to let you guys know Kobus is still alive and kicking, and I just couldn't help but feel I wanted to reach out to you,
because you've been there to support me when I first got that awful news.
And all the things I worry about that people can convince me of not doing
so is just one less thing to worry about..

It is also because I'm so uncertain (or ... certain) of what might happen, that I feel that I want to share our story, and not go through this all by
ourselves

As of now, you can expect regular updates, the good and the bad :60:



* It goes without saying we have taken every possible precaution to make
sure that Kobus will never infect any other bird. Kobus lives in our house,
and we warn everyone of the condition of our bird. (I actually have
forbidden a coworker whose father has a cockatoo that he, too, regularly
has contact with, to enter my house, as he just came along to borrow my
buzzsaw, and I sure as heck don't want anyone's bird to become sick!

I have no answers to your questions, but I CAN respond heart-to-heart to your emotional reactions and worries. I think you are heroic and brave and absolutely doing a wonderful job of caring for this darling bird. I wish the best for both of you, and I would love to follow Kobus' story. Thank you for sharing it.

Hi and welcome back! The Wonderful World of Amazon Members have been missing you!

If you had not stated that Kobus has tested positive to PBFD, I would have stated that near everything that you have listed is normal Amazonisms!

Your Winter has been much like ours, odd! And, our Amazons is constantly dropping and adding downy and body feathers to adjust to this odd Winter. In addition, our Double-Yellow Headed Amazon had been working hard to make-up for our the little snow cover outside, by trying to create a White Christmas look to the inside of our home.

The Wing Feathers you are talking about sit above the primary and secondary Wind Feathers and support those feathers during flight.

We work with only Amazons and only those that are very sick and/or serious injuried. We fight daily to gain every hour, day, week or more we can have with our Amazons!

Worry will do nothing to gain you one second longer with Kobus. Loving Care every hour of every day will gain you time! Follow the guidelines from your regular visits with your Avian Vet and Love Your Amazon!

Happy and Loved Amazon's Have More Fun!!!

I am very sorry to hear that. I hope Kobus stays in top shape for as long as possible.

If you don't mind my asking, do you have any idea as to how he came into contact with the virus? Did he contract it while outside with you?

Any chance of getting a second opinion or test? When it comes to something this serious, I know I would want to be 100% sure. Kobus looks like the worst kind of blue front - innocent but crafty, charming but sneaky, inviting but CHOMP! LOL just kidding, but serious about the second test or opinion.

clayman said:

I am very sorry to hear that. I hope Kobus stays in top shape for as long as possible.

If you don't mind my asking, do you have any idea as to how he came into contact with the virus? Did he contract it while outside with you?

Click to expand...

Sorry for the somewhat late reply!

I am not quite sure how he ever got into contact with the virus, but I have several theories, the most likely one being that Kobus was already infected with the virus when I bought him from his then owners.

Other than that, Kobus has had precisely *one* trip with me to a pet store, of which I knew the owner. I took him there, to have her take a look at Kobus' nails, because since it's been ever since I was 18 since I had last had a parrot, I wasn't quite sure if I Kobus' nails needed trimming or not. I think the chance that Kobus came into contact with an infected bird at that time should be considered quite low.

That said, I too hope Kobus will be around for many years to come, but alas, or perhaps luckily, this is a certainty no one has, healthy or sick, old or young. We have to live our lives by the day, making sure to enjoy every one of them!

wrench13 said:

Any chance of getting a second opinion or test? When it comes to something this serious, I know I would want to be 100% sure. Kobus looks like the worst kind of blue front - innocent but crafty, charming but sneaky, inviting but CHOMP! LOL just kidding, but serious about the second test or opinion.

Click to expand...

I have been considering a second test, but the prospect of a second positive frightens me even more than the first time around. Especially considering the small feathers like the one in the picture on top that I find every now and then, it's almost like I already know what the result is going to be.

That said, you are absolutely right about Kobus, he is definitely the absolute *WORST* kind of Bluefronted Amazon you can imagine. "Is that mine?" "No, that is not yours". "Ok, that's mine". "That's not yours, please give me back my pen." "That's my pen." "No it's not." (I take the pen back and hide it) "Can you pet me?" "Yeah, I can pet you." "That's nice. It'd be a shame if I decided right here and now that I don't want to be petted anymore, wouldn't it?" "Yeah, that totally would". *CHOMP*. "I'm going to sit on the TV for a while". "No you're not". (casually flies back to the TV) "Yeah, I think I'm just going to perch here for a while". "No, I really rather you didn't". (casually flies back to TV) "Yeaaahhhh let's just sit over here for a while". "No I'd *REALLY* rather you didn' *CHOMP*. :07:

I would absolutely get a second test. The first could have been a false positive. It happens. The worst outcome is it confirms what you already believe. If the new test comes back negative, what a relief it would be! That said...there is merit in looking at every interaction as if it might be the last. Then we don't take things for granted ... I mean, what's the rush, we're all going to live forever, right? But knowing the truth might make a difference in some future healthcare choice that comes up.

Are you seeing a Certified Avian Vet (CAV) and when was the last time you visited? Normally, those Parrots with PBFD are seeing their CAV at a minimum of four times a year!

Stop Worrying - set-up an appointment 'Now is a great moment' with a CAV!!! Retesting is required!


For the membership as a whole:

PBFD: Psittacine Beak and Feather Disease
Source: Pet Education.com


Psittacine Beak and Feather Disease (PBFD) is a contagious, fatal viral disease that affects the beak, feathers, and immune system of birds belonging to the Psittacidae family. It was first recognized in 1975 by veterinarians in Australia, where the disease affects wild birds. Although birds showing signs of disease usually die, it is common for birds to be exposed to the virus, develop a mild infection, and recover.

What birds are at risk for PBFD?

PBFD has been diagnosed in over 40 species of psittacines, mostly in Old World members of the parrot family. PBFD is seen more often in cockatoos, but Eclectus parrots, lovebirds, budgies, and African grey parrots are also affected. Younger birds are more commonly affected, especially with the acute form of the disease. Most birds diagnosed with psittacine beak and feather disease are under 2 years of age.

What causes PBFD?

PBFD is caused by a DNA virus that affects the cells of the immune system and those that produce the beak and feathers. The virus is a circovirus, which is one of the smallest viruses known to cause disease. A similar virus affects doves and other birds.

How is the virus that causes PBFD transmitted?

PBFD is extremely contagious. Large amounts of the virus, which can become airborne, are found in the droppings, contents of the crop, and the feather dust of infected birds. The feather dust is easily dispersed and can contaminate food, water, cages, clothing, and other areas of the environment. Psittaccine beak and feather disease is thought to be transmitted by inhalation or ingestion of the virus. It has been suggested that the virus may be transmitted in utero from the female bird to the egg.

The incubation period (time between exposure to the virus and the development of signs) can be as short as 3-4 weeks, or up to several years, depending upon the amount of virus transmitted, the age of the bird, the stage of feather development, and the health of the bird's immune system.

What are the signs of PBFD?

There are both acute and chronic forms of the disease.

Peracute/Acute Form: The peracute and acute forms most commonly occur in very young birds, and may begin with signs unrelated to the beak or feathers. Affected birds are often depressed and regurgitate due to crop stasis. They may develop a diarrhea-causing enteritis or pneumonia, and die without displaying any lesions of the feathers or beak. This is often called the peracute form of the disease. In the acute form, juveniles losing their down and developing feathers may have lesions on the feathers, including circular bands around the feathers which constrict the feather at its base. These feathers are often loose, break easily, may bleed, and are very painful.

Common Signs of Psittacine Beak & Feather Disease

Acute Form
Depression
Regurgitation and diarrhea
Loss of appetite and weight
Abnormal feather development
Death

Chronic Form
Loss of feather dust and powder
Abnormal feather development
Abnormal growth and deformities of the beak
Necrotic beak and oral lesions
Secondary infections
Death in months to years

Chronic Form: In the chronic form of PBFD, which is more common in older birds, the powder-down feathers are often the first feathers affected. The feathers are fragile and fracture easily, have constricting bands, may hemorrhage, and may be discolored, deformed, or curled. As the feather follicles are damaged, the bird will soon be unable to replace feathers, and the primary, secondary, tail, and crest feathers are lost. Bare skin is exposed, and the normal feather dust is not found on the body or the beak, where it normally accumulates due to preening. Feather abnormalities, often termed "dystrophic feathers," may not appear until the first molt after infection, which could be a period up to 6 months.

The beak may develop irregular sunken areas. Brown necrotic areas may be found inside the upper beak, and the beak may elongate, become deformed, and fracture. Secondary beak and oral infections often occur. In some birds, the nails can also be deformed or slough.

Mucus in the droppings, or a green tint to the droppings may occur. In some birds, the liver will be affected, and liver failure may be the cause of death.

Birds with the chronic form of the disease may live for months to years before dying of a secondary infection. This long period of illness in which the bird may be featherless, and gradually weakens can be very emotionally difficult for owners.

How is PBFD diagnosed?

The review of the medical history, presence of clinical signs, and observations during the physical exam support the diagnosis of PBFD. Other conditions such as nutritional deficiencies, infection with polyomavirus (causes budgerigar fledgling disease and other diseases of psittacines), hormonal abnormalities, and drug reactions can cause lesions on the feathers similar to PBFD. Histopathology (microscopic examinations of biopsies) can confirm the diagnosis. Affected cells will have abnormalities in their nuclei, called "basophilic intranuclear inclusion bodies." The diagnosis may also be confirmed by a PCR (polymerase chain reaction) test on whole blood or biopsy samples from the affected bird. The test detects the presence of the virus. This test may also be used on swabs of surfaces in the environment to detect contamination.

False positive and false negative test results can occur. For example, infected airborne cells could contaminate a sample and cause a false positive result. Healthy birds with a positive test result should be retested after 90 days. If they still have positive test results, they should be considered carriers of the virus. If the retest is negative, the bird may have eliminated the virus, and become immune.

False negative results may occur if too much anticoagulant is present in the sample, an extremely high number of viral particles are present and interfere with the test, or there are an insufficient number of infected white blood cells in the sample.

How is PBFD treated?

There is no specific treatment for PBFD. Supportive care including good nutrition, supplementary heat (incubator), beak trimming, and treatment of secondary infections can be offered. The disease, however, is progressive, and very few birds recover. Euthanasia may need to be considered for birds with severe and/or painful signs. Birds who die a natural death usually succumb to a secondary bacterial, fungal, or viral infection despite treatment, since their immune systems have been critically suppressed. Most birds die within 6 months to 2 years of developing the disease.

How is PBFD prevented and controlled?

Healthy cockatoo Birds should be purchased from suppliers with disease-free birds. New birds coming into facilities should be quarantined and tested. Repeat testing in 3-4 weeks to allow for the incubation period is recommended. Infected birds should be isolated and removed from breeding programs. Juvenile birds should be housed separately from adults. Bird owners need to understand that if they handle other peoples' birds, it may be possible for them to bring the virus into their home and infect their birds. Good hygiene and sanitation should be used. There is no known disinfectant that kills this virus.

In Australia, a killed vaccine has been developed which can protect unexposed birds; it can cause more severe disease in birds already showing signs of PBFD. Birds should be vaccinated as young as possible, as soon as 14 days of age. The vaccine should be boostered after one month, and breeding birds should be vaccinated one month prior to breeding.

Thanks for posting that Steven..

If I didn't know Kobus had this disease,I'd say he was a very healthy (and handsome) Blue Front!

As far as "this is mine,not yours" and "I AM going here,and you can't stop me!" CHOMP! Been there,done that,a bazillion times with Amy..it is a never ending battle!

I agree...perhaps a "second opinion" is in order? I'd hate to be worring about something that MIGHT not be there..or to confirm my suspicions..just say'in..

Amazon's are strong willed and hearty breed..STAY STRONG KOBUS!


Jim

Thank you for this thread and all the great information. I hope for the best for your beautiful zon! I'll keep watching and hoping.

I hadn't seen this post previously, but thought I'd weigh in.

Aside from that one feather you pictured, my 'Zon Sammy exhibits every, single thing you mentioned (including occasional wet sneezes, lots of down shed, flaky beak, shivering, etc.).

From what I can see in your photos, Kobus' beak & feet look 100% normal & healthy.

Sammy's just had an full battery of tests by an expert avian vet, and he was found to be absolutely, disgustingly healthy (if a little on the tubby side). No PBFD, no nothing. He, too, has the odd feather that's not perfect, which is probably why they're shed (and he sheds a LOT of feathers).

As false positive PBFD results are known to occur, (and some birds are known to "shake it off" & test negative the next time around, usually more than 90 days after the first test), I'd be sorely tempted to have another test done. You'd hate to have your mutual enjoyment colored by a false prognosis!! Even if it's another positive test, you've already steeled yourself to dealing with it, so nothing would change. And imagine how good a negative test would be!

mh434 said:

I hadn't seen this post previously, but thought I'd weigh in.

Aside from that one feather you pictured, my 'Zon Sammy exhibits every, single thing you mentioned (including occasional wet sneezes, lots of down shed, flaky beak, shivering, etc.).

From what I can see in your photos, Kobus' beak & feet look 100% normal & healthy.

Sammy's just had an full battery of tests by an expert avian vet, and he was found to be absolutely, disgustingly healthy (if a little on the tubby side). No PBFD, no nothing. He, too, has the odd feather that's not perfect, which is probably why they're shed (and he sheds a LOT of feathers).

As false positive PBFD results are known to occur, (and some birds are known to "shake it off" & test negative the next time around, usually more than 90 days after the first test), I'd be sorely tempted to have another test done. You'd hate to have your mutual enjoyment colored by a false prognosis!! Even if it's another positive test, you've already steeled yourself to dealing with it, so nothing would change. And imagine how good a negative test would be!

Click to expand...

I cannot say it any better!!!

The reason, I added the writing on PBFD was to provide you, and all of our Members and Visitors with a clear definition.

False positives can and do happen. My goal is not to create a false belief that the prognosis was incorrect, but to strongly encourage you to 'retest.'

We work with very special Amazons that need continued Vet care and observation! For us, retesting is a standard part of the process as it allows our Vet and us to monitor an illness and what changes we can make to their life to keep them with us, and as comfortable and as healthy as possible.

Please have your Amazon Retested!