What do I do?

[Pilaf]

It's the 5th day I have my new 3 months old green cheek conure and today it's not going very well. His nibbling turned into biting and really very hard. Every time when he nibbles beyond comfort I use the word 'gentle' and push his beak gently away. This helped quite well but today he's suddenly nibbling a lot harder. An hour ago he started getting beaky on my finger, right next to my nail, and suddenly digging hard into my skin. It was really hurting a lot. I tried to stay calm and said 'gentle' and tried to get his beak of my finger. But the harder I pulled the harder he bit, and when his beak was finally off of me I gave him a time-out in his cage. My finger was really bleeding. After 15/20 minutes I took him out of his cage again, and we had a nice time for about 5 minutes until he did the exact same again to another finger. I could hardly get him of my finger. Now he's in his cage for a time-out again. He just chomps pieces of skin out off me. Is this normal? is he still learning? Or am I doing something wrong?
I'm trying to stay as calm as possible of course, but that's very difficult if it hurts that much. Can anybody give me advice?

 

[Kendar]

He could be testing you. When mine was a baby, and she would start to nibble, I would just put my finger up and get her to step up. Nibble, step, nibble, step.

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[Pilaf]

Hmm, yeah i also read that just now on a different thread. I figured I also have to respond sooner, before it hurts, i waited to long, so because it hurt so much I became a little bit louder, and he was probably finding that very interesting.

 

[Flboy]

Don't become a squeaky toy for him! Diversion is probably the best strategy!

 

[clark_conure]

Mine was kind of the same way at first, the pet store didn't interact as much as the breeder did hand feeding him and all I'm sure.

It won't be overnight, time outs worked on my bird where I would just stand up, put him down on the carpet (lowest place in the room) and walk away. On the long walk back (10-15ft or so) and the climb back up (5ft or so) he figured out oh, that was bad. and he would be much sweeter by the time he made it back.

hope this helps.

 

[Pilaf]

Today I have three chomps out of my lip and one out of my ear, all bleeding. I notice that I'm getting afraid even to have him close to my hands, and my face. That's not what I want. If I put him down on the floor he just flies back to me, that doesn't help. Diversion didn't help either. He just thought my lip and ear were more interesting.
I just don't know how to be fast enough, before i know it he already has his beak in my skin. Maybe I just shouldn't let him nibble at me at all.

 

[GaleriaGila]

Well... I'll tell my tale...
I have reduced biting to almost zero over the decades... not because I've changed the bird, but I have changed me. And a lot of that has involved giving up on a lot of my desires/expectations. After years of battle, I surrendered. I don't do stuff that gets me bitten. I don't scratch his head much, ever... tail is okay. I NEVER do stuff that makes him mad... I don't touch others when he's out; I rarely try to get him to step up onto my hand first. Hand-held perch first, then hand. In some ways, I swallow my disappointment at having such a little monster for a pet, but he is what he is. I ALWAYS wear my hair down when he's on my shoulder, so all he can bite is hair. Really, I don't involve hands much... he doesn't like them. He seems to think the real ME is my head, perched on a weird moveable tree with questionable appendages.
Since he's fully flighted, the ONLY way I get him into the cage is to toss a chile pepper in and he flaps in after it. So food reward is a necessity for me.
But please... listen to and try all the good advice you'll get here. Don't surrender until you know you've done your best. Then just accept and love whatever/whoever your bird turns out to be.
My darling is kind of a worse-case scenario, but we have it all worked out between the two of us.
Oh, and... every now and then, he breaks up with me. Gets mad for no apparent reason and won't come to me, won't call my name, won't even look at me. It can last days or weeks. Then he gets over it and takes me back. Little monster.
Hang in there!!!!!!!!!!
Very, very best of luck to you.
Good for you for reaching out!

 

[DoubleTake]

Your bird just came home and still adjusting, getting use to his environment. I would start from scratch and leave him in his cage. I'd be careful with the crime out in the cage' as you may be teaching him to bite you when he wants to go back in. I'd start be leaving him in his cage and see if he will take treats through the bars. Is the cage in a room where he can see you doing your normal activities?

 

[Inger]

Since you said he bit your ears and face, I assume you have him on your shoulder. Shoulder as perch should be reserved for a bird who has earned your trust - it's too soon for that. You can't see him, so you can't be watching/learning his body language so you know when the bite is coming.

I know he's a GCC, but go to the Macaw forum and read Birdman666's sticky in big beaks. Much of it is true for all parrots, and it helped me immensely with my occasionally beaky little parrotlet so I'm sure there will be something of value for you as well.

Remember, as others have mentioned, he's brand new to you and your home. He has a big adjustment to make. Go at his pace and be aware that it's never the fault of the parrot. It's always the fault of the human. Don't give up!


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[LordTriggs]

I would agree with the others. Try and pull back, give them a couple days in the cage. I'd say 2 days where you only put your hand in for feeding and water. Talk to them or read a book for those days, not looking at them. They get used to you that way. Next day start working on getting your hand on the cage without them freaking out, whilst still reading, looking away. Glance over occasionally but no staring as that's a predator habit. Then (some of the others who know me here know what I'm going to say) you need to take the food bowl out of the cage and put your hand in its place with a load of seed in it or any treat that they like. I found Raisins and little apple pieces are good! And then just continue that book (hope it's a long one) with your hand in there. After a bit of them being wary they will come over, associating that spot of the cage with food. When you feel them hop into your hand give them some praise then go back to the book. When your arm feels like it's going to drop off that's a good time to slowly remove your hand, only if your little buddy is off your hand of course. This got my conure from completely wild, parent reared and terrified of hands due to his experience to recall trained within 7 days of bringing him home.

At this point you're ready for them to come out and work on everything else. Keep off the shoulder for now as that should be a reward for a well behaved bird. Get them stick trained first and then move slowly onto hand based stepping up and laddering is an amazing thing for them to learn as it's good to "reset" them.

Beaking at that age is oaky for them, what I find is wait for when things go between beak and bite, you want them to be as gentle as possible even when they're grumpy and hormonal so it's good to get them used to the idea that it doesn't take much pressure for you to get the picture, you of course need to set that limit and be consistent with it, allow them to use their beak to feel around, preen, play and balance themselves but don't let it go any further than a pinch. Each time it turns to a pinch gently grab them and give a stern but calm "no" or "no bite" combined with a grumpy look, then put them on the ground facing away from you. This all has to be done pretty quickly, but also gently of course. They soon learn that amount of pressure means they get told off and put on the floor and you're removed from their eyesight, none of which they like very much. Rio would fly back to me pretty quick after but by that time the bit is gone from their mind. They operate on a 1 to 1 reward system, so I would praise the flying to you. They'll understand flying to you and being nice means a treat, but biting means being put on the floor. I never say to use a cage, leaving the room or putting them in another room to be used as "punishment" as it can lead to them biting whenever they want that thing to happen.

Give a try with what I've said and please report back! I'm trying to see if these can be used as blanket taming/training techniques for multiple birds

 

[Pilaf]

Thank you all very much.
GaleriaGila: I might indeed expect too much of him. Maybe I wanted to go to fast.

DoubleTake: I am starting that now. He's in his cage now after biting me really hard in my finger twice this morning. I have also thought about what caused it and I think he might just be over-stimulated.

I have been reading a lot on this forum and other forums. I'm autistic myself and I might take things too literally. I have read that when your bid is playing really sweet and being a very good bird, you should praise him a lot and be very enthusiastic. Maybe I get too enthusiastic with my voice. Besides that right across the road they are doing construction and in the apartment next to us they are doing work as well. Which causes a lot of extra noises as well. So I think that he's just over-stimulated. And maybe I'm just doing things too fast. I learned that a new bird needs to be desensitized but maybe I'm going to fast with showing him to much etc.

Inger: I have learned indeed that it might not be a good idea to have him on my shoulder. When he climbs on my shoulder now, I immediately make him step on my hand, that only works when I lure him with a pellet. But when he's on my hands, he bites my fingers. I try to distract him with toys and it goes well for a while but then within one second he crabs my finger. It goes so fast that I can hardly see it coming.

LordTriggs: I am indeed going to have him be in is cage for quite a while now. The only thing is, as soon as I put my hand in his cage to give him food, he steps on my hand already and climbs on my arm to get out. He's not afraid of my hand or so. I have been teaching him to step on my hand and he also does it when I don't stay 'step up'. (he was hand-fed by the way by the breeder, not by his parents).

He is still very beaky, and exploring things, and he can do it very carefully and soft. But the time from going from very careful and soft to extremely hard is one tenth of a second. Almost no time to respond before I'm bleeding. So I'm getting really afraid to have him near my fingers at all now. I've also noticed that if I am on time, and respond before he digs his beak into my flesh by gently grabbing his beak, it makes him even more excited and dig his beak deeper into my skin.

Also when I try to put him on the floor, he just grabs and bite another finger of the hand I'm trying to put him on the floor with.

I'm not sure if it's a good idea but I was thinking about bandages. Because right now I have so many wounds on my fingers. I'm thinking about putting bandages on my fingers so that when he bites it doesn't hurt that much, and I can more easily train him not to do it, without being in so much pain. Is that a good idea?

 

[LordTriggs]

bandages aren't a good idea. You don't want to dampen the pain as you're going to get a full angry bite in the future when it's hormone time. You also will tech him a stronger pressure is okay and the bandaids could be toxic.

I'm autistic myself so am in the same boat as you. Definitely slow right down, he's ababy and very scared right now. The construction will be a big factor in that, lots of banging and sudden noises will be scary for him. Don't grab the beak, that's the same as someone grabbing your tooth, not a nice experience. Keep fingers away from the face when putting on the floor.

Does he ruffle his feathers up when he's beaking? Or does he start waving his head around before biting? Or lower his head with his beak open? Those are the warning signs. To him that's screaming "go away or I'm gonna hurt you". you need to find what is triggering his biting which with the construction is going to be tricky as that is a factor. never use his cage as punishment though, it will only give you a bird that bites to go in or does everything they can to stay out of the cage. Also remember to be consistent.

Lastly remember to put yourself in his shoes. He's just been taken by a giant to a new place with lots of banging and noises coming from somewhere. He's going to be terrified for a while. So calming down and starting over is the right option. Does his cage have doors just for the food and water bowls? Those are the best way to interact with him without getting him out of the cage.

His biting definitely needs to be addressed now before it becomes ingrained. So no shouting or loud noises when he bites, that's the most fun they can get and find what causes him to bite. There's so many things it could be but I couldn't tell you without seeing in person

 

[Pilaf]

He doesn't ruffle up his feathers before he bites or anything else. I think he just thinks its nice chewy toy and he gets very excited. I recognize the sign right before an 'attack' and that's not it. I think he just still exploring and he just likes the feeling of biting down in my flesh without wanting to hurt me.

He is in his cage now for a few hours already, but he doesn't look happy at all.

 

[Flboy]

Sorry, I just realized I did not send you this link! This is my go to study!
http://www.parrotforums.com/training/57935-brainstorming-biting-parrots.html


The only bite that can't be rewarded is the one that never occurs.

 

[Pilaf]

Sorry, I just realized I did not send you this link! This is my go to study!
http://www.parrotforums.com/training/57935-brainstorming-biting-parrots.html

Thank you very much. I actually read that whole thread already. But I will reread it.

I hope I'm doing the right thing now. Trying to start from scratch, he's in his cage now. And every now and then I'm approaching him to give him some food or to talk to him nicely. He doesn't seem to be very happy in his cage though. I think he wants to be out of his cage.

I don't let him notice it, but it makes me feel sad. I'm afraid that I'm already ruining it, while it was going to great the first few days.

 

[Jottlebot]

Sounds positive. Taking a step back and being patient.

If you're nervous about handling him start with some non-contact bonding. I can't stop banging on about clicker and target training! It really is fantastic!

It's where I started with my parent reared Alexandrine. He also went through a biting phase. I think he found skin fascinating. It's significantly reduced now (after 4 months), but he still isn't happy about fingers. He waves, spins, follows a target, shows me his wings and flies to me all on command now. Can't touch him though, it's too scary for him. It might come with more time.

Can't wait to hear how you're doing in a few days.

 

[Pilaf]

I did just have Echo out of his cage for a few minutes, finally without getting bitten. He had a bath and he did some stepping up and stepping down. I kept the tips of my fingers tightly tugged away though in my hand because I was afraid that he would bite them. I think he just really loves the feeling of biting skin. Maybe should buy a clicker then, I do notice that he gets startled very easily by a sudden noice so I hope a clicker doesn't startle him. How does target training work exactly?

 

[Pilaf]

It has been really going well again with Echo. This morning he bit me a little bit, I said 'no', and he immediately stopped. Now when he applies too much pressure I only say a firm 'no' and he responds very fast. I'm so happy.