the big question on whether to cage birds or not.

[spaced]

i was just telling a mate that i'm thinking of getting a parrot, and he said he could never cage a bird. this is probably the most common critisizm with having pet birds, i imagine?

i must admit in the past i wasn't sure whether i felt good or bad regarding having a bird as a pet, and therefore caging it and not letting it fly.
however i feel ok about it now. i plan for the bird to have free-range of my home, so it will be able to fly around, although hardly enough to raise a sweat.
plus i've read of people training their bird to fly outside, so this is something i will investigate.

how do you answer people who say to you that it is cruel to have a caged bird? did you have any problems about this before getting your own bird?

 

[Aussie Ben]

wow this is a sensitive topic. I'll be careful what I say so no one gets angry lol .

Firstly, I think regardless of all these controversies like caging, harnessing and wing clipping, the most important thing is that the bird is 'happy'.

I don't like to think of my birds cages as 'prisons', but more like 'sanctuaries' where they can get some time out. Both my birds will head to their cages if they have had enough and thats cool, they can have their space. I know the whole 'sanctuary' thing is a bit of a sugar coating - yes the reality is we are locking our birds up, but mostly for their safety. As long as the cage is big enough, there is enough enritchment inside, the bird gets enough out time and is HAPPY, then I don't really see much of a problem with caging. I would LOVE to have uncaged birds but unfortunately space, money and time do not favour this option for me.

In terms of flying your birds outside, again I find nothing wrong with it, however I always recommend harnessing. Many people think its cruel, but we do it for the same reasons we harness dogs, for their safety and the safety of people around us. Plus what is worse, having a bird that can fly outside safely on a harness or having a bird fly away and perish in the unfamiliar environment? If you ever get to the stage where you have a good enough relationship to free fly, go for it, but for now I will stick to harnessing.

Anyway thats my two cents

 

[spaced]

thanks mate.

i know what you mean about the cage being like a safe place. my pet rats are able to climb out of their cage at any time. in truth though, they seem to prefer being in the cage than wandering around the house.

what exactly is harness training? i gather it is the bird being able to fly while you hold on to the end of something like a leash?

 

[Aussie Ben]

Yes its basically a leash for birds. The bird should ultimately be flight trained (recall and circuit trained) indoors before he ever makes it outside. Wearing the harness is actually a behaviour in itself and needs to be trained. The harness offers your bird the freedom of flight without the high risk of getting lost. (But there are always risks with any sort of outdoor activity, so it needs to be taken into consideration).

I will be getting one of these soon The Parrot University Aviator Harness its probably the highest recommended harness out their.

 

[Auggie's Dad]

We cage our children, why not our pets?

 

[HRH Di]

We cage our children, why not our pets?

Is that wrong? :54:

Seriously, the only domesticated animals kept as pets - as far as I know - are dogs and cats...and cats are really just barely domesticated.

Everything else is a "tamed" animal. And there is a significant difference between domesticated and tame. I've honestly never had anyone ask about this, except crazy PETA people who want to do away with companion animals all together.

Our birds are only in their cages when they can't be properly supervised this is for their own safety since we have quadrapeds. But if we're home, they're out. Jade is the only one of our birds who doesn't like going into her cage - we're working on that. Max, Ruby and Popcorn are usually ready for some quiet time when it's time to go to bed.

(Disclaimer - crazy PETA people are different from reasonable people who fight for animal rights. Either group may or may not be members of PETA.)

As for harness training and free-flying, both are doable. Our breeder free-flies her Scarlet macaw and 4 of her Red-fronts. Personally, I'd only do it with a harness. However, most birds don't like harnesses so it takes a while to get them used to it.

This link is to a website of a parrot guardian in Colorado who takes his RFM rock climbing. http://www.jaredworkman.com/merlin.htm

 

[SharonC]

I would never cage a wild bird. All my birds, and I assume most pets, are bred for pets. They have not known a life any other than what we give them. Sometimes, people view cages as prisons??? My birds all seem go to their cages, as a safe and comfortable place to be...

 

[antoinette]

We cage our children, why not our pets?

LoL we even have our kids on leashes,

 

[Mrspy]

I think it is for their own saftey really. Let one of those peta people do the same thing with a cat in their house and then one day she'll find blood and feathers on the floor. Do you know how hearbreaking that can be? Especially for small birds like mine the house can be in their case very dangerous. Cages are also their place where they can hide from reality(it's true!!) I don't have a single ounce of trouble getting Peeps back into the cage, in fact since he's so small and after he's been out for a while he WANTS really bad to get into his cage. So it's not a prison, it's a saftey precaution. It's their home really, i don't think they know it's a cage, it's all they've ever known.

 

[spaced]

thanks.

i suppose my friends comment about not caging birds because they can fly, was probably more about the flying bit, not so much the cage, i didn't explain it correctly obviously.

i think[i didn't ask him] he probably equates pet birds with wild birds in a way. meaning that wild birds can fly for miles and have freedom and were meant to fly, whereas the pet ones do not have a chance to be like that.
mind you, you could argue that a pet dog cannot act like a wolf anymore, which is stupid!

i'll tell him about harness flying next time i speak to him, see what he thinks of that, see if that alters his opinion.

btw, i myself agree with what everyone has said regarding caged birds.

 

[Aussie Ben]

Well the best we can offer any bird born in captivity is careful outdoor flight. The best most of us can offer is flight inside the house. If we let them fly for miles outside they would not survive. Captive animals of any kind will always be different to animals in the wild. We just need to educate ourselves about what we can do to substitute natural behaviours that what we can't mimic in captivity, so they are happy and healthy .

When you tell your friend about harnesses, be sure to tell him they are intended for safety, not for control.

 

[Birdamor]

I don't have a problem answering that kind of question because I don't believe in caging, period. Not dogs (crates are cages by another name and I only use them for puppymill or severely abused rescues as a temporary training tool -they feel very insecure and the crate, which is kept with the door open all the time, makes them feel safe), not cats (God forbid!) and not birds. I do keep some birds in cages but it's only for their safety due to fragility (tiny finches and canaries) or safety (the ones with a handicap that impairs their flight), the rest don't have cages.

As to outdoor flying, I don't agree with it, too risky for my taste.

 

[Auggie's Dad]

I don't have a problem answering that kind of question because I don't believe in caging, period...
As to outdoor flying, I don't agree with it, too risky for my taste.

Here's my problem: you don't let your birds fly outside, and you don't keep them caged. So where are they? Limbo?

What's the difference between a house and a cage?

I'm sorry but it's absolutely foolish to be so against any containment in principle while you also are in denial about keeping your pets contained!

If you want to talk about appropriate enclosure sizes, great. But this hypocrisy is ridiculous.

 

[apatrimo94]

Oh boy. Not to get in between, but let's cool off a little before inappropriate words are used. Sorry to be rude like this, but some people just have their own opinions and values with their birds and we have to respect that. Plus, I get uneasy and uncomfortable when I see people get a little angry or upset on something like this, which is Birdamor's own way of keeping his birds and AD, you have your own way. Please, can we be a little more repectful to other's ways, and it seems like Birdamor's birds are doing fine however he's raising and caring for them.

 

[Mel]

Once upon a time in a land far away we lived in caves, animals roamed free and were used for food with the leftover bits for weapons or clothing - how the world has changed eh? We fence our yards, lock our doors and put our kids on leashes

 

[HRH Di]

Wow, this is getting a little philosophical...Personally, I feel that if I'm going to keep exotic birds as part of my family, I need to do what my conscience tells me to ensure that they're safe and happy. My birds are in cages when we can't be there to supervise them and ensure their safety. The cages are the largest cages that are practical for our home. I'm an adult human confident in my level of intelligence and compassion. So, if you don't agree with my methods, that's kind of your problem not mine as I'm not directly impacting your life or your ability to make your own decisions.

 

[SharonC]

Well said!

 

[Aussie Ben]

I second, well said HRH :smile049:

 

[Birdamor]

I don't have a problem answering that kind of question because I don't believe in caging, period...
As to outdoor flying, I don't agree with it, too risky for my taste.

Here's my problem: you don't let your birds fly outside, and you don't keep them caged. So where are they? Limbo?

What's the difference between a house and a cage?

I'm sorry but it's absolutely foolish to be so against any containment in principle while you also are in denial about keeping your pets contained!

If you want to talk about appropriate enclosure sizes, great. But this hypocrisy is ridiculous.

No need to get insulting, I will gladly clarify any doubts you might have.

Where are the birds? In a room.

What's the difference between a house and a cage? There are more but, IMPO, the most important one is size. If I was to be confined to one place, I would much rather it was a large room rather than a small one.

I am not against all containment, obviously. I am against caging. There is a difference between the two. If there wasn't, zoos would still keep all animals in cages like they used to but they don't because they've found that larger, more natural habitats are healthier and kinder. I follow the same principle.

 

[Beilana]

Parrots in the wild live in small nests burrowed in trees, smaller than a lot of the cages we provide for them. This is their safety zone, if there was a big storm thats where they would go. Cages provide the same sense of safety it seems for our fids IMO.