Sudden Aggression

[stiles]

Hello everyone! I've been visiting this forum for a while and reading up on conures because I am a new conure owner myself. 3 weeks ago I rescued/adopted a 5 year old pineapple conure. From day 1, he was extremely cuddly and very sweet and was super excited every time he saw me. He always wants to be on my finger and likes me wrapping my hands around him and falls asleep. He is a little bit cage aggressive and will nip when I touch his food/water bowls, but he never bites hard and it's more just him letting me know he doesn't like that. I've always been able to put my hand in his cage and give him head scratches and pet him and he's never had an issue with that.

However, starting about a week ago now, everything changed. I was really worried he wasn't being stimulated enough and might be bored so I try to interact with him whenever I have time. I was standing in front of his cage and decided to try playing with him. He has these bells that hang off of these plastic chains and I was ringing them to get him to interact with it (kind of like how cats like playing with the toy on a string). He absolutely lost it and lunged at my hand and ripped a hole in my finger. At this moment, I knew I messed up. I knew he was a bit cage aggressive and me touching his stuff really triggered him. Ever since then, I can no longer go anywhere near him. If I'm anywhere near him, he will try to attack me (I've gotten 6 more holes on my hand just in the last couple days trying to change his food/water). I don't make any noise when he bites and just bite my lip to take the pain and I never yell at him either. I do give him a stern no biting but it doesn't do anything. I just shake my finger to get him to lose balance so he unhooks from my flesh.

My heart is breaking because my sweet little birb seems like he hates me now from my one mistake. I've looked through the internet for anything I can do, but nothing has worked so far. At first, I just left his cage door open and let him come out on his own and the first two days after the incident, he would climb out and climb to the side of the cage like he wants me to pick him up. I would let him on my finger and he was fine and he would rub into my finger for scritches. When he went back into his cage I can't get him out again obviously because he doesn't want me near his cage (it's his territory so I understand). The third day was completely different though. He climbed outside to the side of the cage again like he wanted me to pick him up, but this time the MOMENT he got on my finger he started tearing into my hand and ripped 2 new holes on my hand. I put him back into the cage and shut the door so I could go patch myself up.

I have spoken to friends who are also conure owners and even spoke to the rescue as they raise 25 parrots. They told me to just give him his space and that he will come back around eventually. I was told to just ignore him and leave him in his cage (door closed) for a couple days and just change his food/water and do not interact with him at all. It's been 5 days now and every time I go near his cage to change his food/water he just poofs himself up and has this angry look and then he just starts aggressively ripping at his toys like he's telling me to back off). Instead of getting better, I feel like he's just getting more and more angry. Today I decided to let him out (used a spare perch) so he could stretch his wings a little. The moment he got on the perch he ran straight for my hand trying to bite it. Luckily I switched hands and grabbed the other side of the stick before he could get me. I left him on his playset for a while and eventually he flew back to his cage.

I'm completely at a loss now and don't know what to do. I feel like I completely broke my little buddies trust. Every time he sees me now he's just trying to bite me through the cage grating and as each day passes I feel like he's just never going to trust me again. I know parrots are tricky animals and take a LOT of patience and time to build a strong bond with them, but I'm not sure what to do because I can't even touch him anymore. (Also in case anyone asks, yes I have brought him to an avian vet and he is perfectly healthy, a healthy weight, feathers are good, poop is good, eating/drinking like normal, very active inside his cage climbing around and playing with his toys. I also give him 12 hours of sleep every night).

If anyone has encountered this before and has managed to get their conure to go back to being their normal cuddly selves, I could really use some advice. It kills me to have to keep him locked in his cage and I want nothing more than to shower him with love and scritches. I'm starting to forget what it feels like to have him cuddled in my hands and it's making me really sad.

 

[GaleriaGila]

Welllllllllllllllllll... first... just take a few deep breaths and relax. There's plenty of time and space to work on this. You're just getting started. Good for you for reaching out.

As a real softie, I will offer the following.


I suspect that if you're going to contain some of those behaviors, you'll have to clip wings (did I miss anything about whether he's clipped or not?), and I don't want to do that, so I put up with the consequences of flighted-and-fearless! It's a very personal decision...

I have reduced biting to almost zero over the decades... not because I've changed the bird, but I have changed me. And a lot of that has involved giving up on a lot of my desires/expectations. After years of battle, I "compromised". I don't do stuff that gets me bitten. I NEVER do stuff that makes him mad... I don't touch others when he's out; I rarely try to get him to step up onto my hand first. Hand-held perch first, then hand. In some ways, I swallow my disappointment at having such a little monster for a pet, but he is what he is. I ALWAYS wear my hair down when he's on my shoulder, so all he can bite is hair. Really, I don't involve hands much... he doesn't like them. He seems to think the real ME is my head, perched on a weird moveable tree with questionable appendages.

Since he's fully flighted, the ONLY way I get him into the cage is to toss a chile pepper in and he flaps in after it. So food reward is a necessity for me. Time-out doesn't exist in the Rb's kingdom.

I have had some success with using the "earthquake" technique for biting. When he bites, give your hand a swift shake... it should make him let go. The idea... every time he bites, a mysterious earthquske shakes him up. Some people feel this is mean and/or engenders lack of trust. The same can work for clothes biting... give your shoulder a shake, or jump! For me, it has helped.

But please... listen to and try all the good advice you'll get here. Chris is very wise.

Don't compromise until you know you've done your best. Then just accept and love whatever/whoever your bird turns out to be.

Parrots aren't always easy pets, and each one is a special unique being.

Even after all these years, I sometimes find myself putting myself or my bird down... stuff like...
I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PUT UP WITH THIS OR THAT.
WHY CAN'T HE BE SWEET AND NICE, LIKE THOSE OTHER BIRDS?
PEOPLE NEVER UNDERSTAND WHY I PUT UP WITH THIS.
Stuff like that.

But...

Finally, I accepted that I have an amazing half-wild being who shares my life! It's magic enough for me!

Enough rambling from me. Let's see what members have to say.

Good for you, for reaching out.

P.S.
5 days is a nano-second in parrot-adjustment time!

 

[BoomBoom]

Hi there! I need to get off the computer in 2 minutes so I will give a quick response:

First off, you didn't do a mistake with the bells. If it wasn't the bells, it was going to be something else. Parrots fixate on a random something as their nemesis. Maybe they think it's trying to kill them or you. Maybe they're jealous of it. Sometimes that's just how it is. As humans of the flock, we have to find a way to adapt to the situation. Understand that this behavior in our conures is heightened by hormones, especially when they're going through puberty. With that, I leave you with the following advice:

1) Identify what triggers a bite or aggression. Bells? Colored nails? Now avoid those triggers so the bird has no reason to resort to aggression.

2) Offer other activities to stimulate him. Multiple play stations around the house, toys lying about, training sessions, etc. You probably already do some or all of these.

3) When you get bitten, express pain with a shriek, the way wild birds would. He needs to understand he hurt you. Then calmly look him in the eye, say 'No' and walk away. In my case, since my place is bird-proofed and safe, I walk out the room and close the door behind me so he can not follow. I come back in 5 to 15 minutes. This is a form of shunning and will show him that you disapprove of the behavior without traumatizing him.

4) Reward good behavior. Verbally or with a treat when he does something you like. Especially when he expresses HIS disapproval not with a bite but with a beak nudge or a light beak tap. He will learn beak nudges or taps through pressure training.

These are what worked for me when my sun conure was going through his first hormonal rage / puberty. He has grown out of the biting and has become mellow after he passed the puberty stage. I imagine the same for your bird. I read about your friends' advise. I don't really agree with ignoring him for such a long period of time. At some point, the parrot would not remember that he did something wrong, he will just think that he's being punished for no reason. I don't advise clipping wings as a form of behavior adjustment. This will just frustrate the bird and may lead to other problems.

Lastly, you would have to accept that out parrots are wild at heart, and sometimes they won't be 'perfect.' I put perfect in quotations because to me my bird is perfect, even with his flaws. We just have to, as their caretakers, adjust, adapt and understand. Sorry if this sounds preachy, I don't mean to be. I wish you the best of luck. Cheer up! You can certainly do this.

 

[BoomBoom]

Finally, I accepted that I have an amazing half-wild being who shares my life! It's magic enough for me!

I just read Abigail's response. Pretty much this! Keep sharing your progress, you will get plenty of great advice from folks here. Regards to your baby!

 

[stiles]

Thanks for the advice! I've tried pinpointing what may trigger this aggression and so far I've come up with nothing. I haven't changed anything about myself. As with the bells he doesn't seem to bite with the noise, he rings it himself throughout the day and he loves playing with it. When I'm out of the room I can hear him making happy chirps and happily playing with his toys, but the moment I'm in the room with him he goes dead silent and just glares at me. I'm still keeping an eye out though and watching him for body signs so I know when I'm doing something he doesn't like.

I do have multiple stations in my apartment for him to enjoy himself and keep himself occupied, but he doesn't really like them unless I'm near them cause he just wants to stay near me. I will definitely try everything you guys have mentioned though. I know there is a little love bug inside my rage monster right now and I love him regardless of how he ends up!

 

[Jen5200]

My first two conures were 2 & 5 when I adopted them. We went through a brief honeymoon phase where they were very lovey all the time (about a month). I didn’t know what was happening at the time. Then my green cheek started biting me every time he landed on me (and he always wanted to be on me). I started wearing a hoodie with the hood up and wrapped my fingers with band-aids lol. I did lots of reading and realized that we might have hit a point in our relationship where I was going to have to set some boundaries and I needed to work on our trust. I put a short perch on the outside of the cage where he would normally exit - and let him come out to the perch on his own before I approached. I limited my in-cage interactions to take away that possessiveness aggression. I also carried a small perch for step ups if he was acting “bitey”. I did lots of praise and a tiny treat every time he stepped up without biting and quickly set him on a play stand to take away the opportunity to bite me and turn the interaction negative. I went for short, good interactions and they gradually increased over time. Another tactic that I used for a long time - if he bit me, I put him on the back of a chair or on a perch and turned my back on him. Just for a minute or so, and then I would carry on like it was a new interaction. Take heart....it will improve with time . I can say that my little green guy and I have a good relationship now and he rarely bites (I was very convinced that my fingers would be nothing but scars at the rate he was chewing on me at the time lol).

 

[Flboy]

Welcome and awesome! Remember, you are the outsider! It is NEVER the fault of the parrot! You have transgressed! In my opinion, your answer is here!
http://www.parrotforums.com/training/57935-brainstorming-biting-parrots.html
My JoJo attacked me two weeks ago. First time ever!! Why? He saw me packing a suitcase and realized I was leaving on an other trip!
Really, really, really! It is never the fault of the parrot!

 

[ChrisYNA]

I don't know if this completely applies in your case, but I will tell you that my bird has certain triggers I must avoid. Things that for some reason anger her. Bells - any toy with a bell - she will attack and, if I am holding it, she will bite my hand. Maybe your bird dislikes the bell, so remove it. Put it on your bed near him and see if he fights it.

It is up to you to figure out things to avoid.

My bird would think I was stealing her food and would charge to bite if I was touching her bowls. This is normal behavior in many parrots from what I understand.... until you earn their trust. My bird trusts me with her food/bowls now and understands that I bring her more, not take it. You'll get there.

Yes, birds can be territorial, so don't invade her cage/home at this time, unless you have to. If you want to put more food in there, do it while she's out of her cage and maybe even in another room.

Advice I read many times on this forum, one that I agree with, is that ignoring pain when bitten and not reacting is not a good idea. Screaming and going nuts isn't a good idea either (I was very guilty of this). You need to be somewhere in between, as in not scaring the bird and creating an enemy, but at the same time letting him know that it hurts and that he shouldn't do that. It took a long time, but my bird now avoids biting me and lets go if she grabs on too tight during playtime if I say "NO" (tone of voice is probably important.. not loud but somewhat stern) and try to calm her down for a few seconds (shhh, shhh). She hesitates and stops. I'm pretty amazed I got to this point. She knows she can hurt me and does her best to avoid it. Birds can be very emotional and I don't think they can control their emotions as well as we can. So we have to help them.

For the moment, it seems she is not fully trusting of your hand, so you'll have to get some training here. In the Behavior section I just posted a video from BirdTricks. If you want to try that, then go ahead. I never did that myself for the biting issue.. it came naturally, but I would also stress doing things like feeding her favorite treats from your hand and, little by little, getting her desensitized.

Lastly, 3 weeks is a very short time to develop a bond. This make take months, so keep at it and don't get discouraged. And keep him out of the cage as much as you can. I'd get angry myself if I were a bird and had to sit in prison all day.

 

[ChristaNL]

I tend to go with Jen: he is testing boundries!
(not harbouring any resentment etc.)
Chris and Boomboom have a great points about identifying the triggers and wortking with/around the biting.


Good sign actually: he is feeling at home and is relaxed enough to start figuring things out and wanting to have things his way.

(so: job well done, first phase complete!)

This is the time to teach him the house rules "no biting"
(easier said than done, I know - my macaw still 'misunderstands' / probably because I am not clear enough on the matter ... bitepressuretraining is not something done in a single afternoon - unfortunately - but the basics can be understoot really, really fast. Both you and the bird btw )
There have not really a set pecking-order like they have with chickens, but oh boy they sure know who is boss! The one that gets the favorite food first etc., the one they move over for.

So... do you want to be the one they respect (and not bite)?
LOL this sounds really agressive etc. - it is not about being the big bad super-dominant wolf or anything, but it *does* mean "hey- you do NOT bite me, you little so-and-so, play nice, it is SO much more fun! Come see! "
(and since most parrots are all about fun...
it almost always works out - not counting the deeply traumatized ones, but your little one sounds just fine!)
.

 

[Akuma223]

Thanks for the advice! I've tried pinpointing what may trigger this aggression and so far I've come up with nothing. I haven't changed anything about myself. As with the bells he doesn't seem to bite with the noise, he rings it himself throughout the day and he loves playing with it. When I'm out of the room I can hear him making happy chirps and happily playing with his toys, but the moment I'm in the room with him he goes dead silent and just glares at me. I'm still keeping an eye out though and watching him for body signs so I know when I'm doing something he doesn't like.

Random question, how big are the bells? Are they reflective enough that he can see his reflection in them and maybe think its another bird? I know its reaching a bit but my parakeet Klobi was super possessive of his bells and would stare into them and "preen" them, sometimes would get really bitey and mad if we touched them. We sandpapered them so they'd be less reflective and after that he was less possessive of them and wouldn't get so upset at us for touching them.

Again I know its a big reach but may it be the bells?

 

[EllenD]

Welcome to the forum! I'm sorry you're going through this, but it's not an uncommon issue to go through at all, especially with a newly re-homed, adult bird that has only been with you for less than a month. So the first thing you need to know is that this is very common, it's not rare at all, and it's almost to be expected in your situation. The next thing you need to know is that his behavior change had absolutely nothing at all to do with you touching/playing with his toy. Had you not done that in that moment, whatever the next thing you might have done would have resulted in the exact same response from him. So please don't keep blaming yourself or thinking that you "broke his trust", etc. That's only going to keep you discouraged and feeling guilty, like you could have prevented this from happening...I agree with the sentiment that "It's never the bird's fault", that is very true, but the only way you should be feeling guilty in this situation is if you had physically abused the bird, or screamed and yelled at the bird, or thrown something at his cage or hit the cage, etc. Otherwise, this is just a part of incorporating a parrot into your life, home, and family, and this too shall pass.

I don't know the history of your bird's prior life, you may not know much either, but something you need to keep in-mind about the above-mentioned "triggers" is that a lot of the time they have to do with something that someone else did to him/around him. Either way, you've only had him for about a month, right? That's no time at all in parrot-time, and any time you adopt a bird and bring it into your home it's going to be a long, gradual process...a marathon, not a sprint. It's perfectly normal to feel the way that you do right now, as people we immediately take this kind of thing personally and it hurts us, and that's okay. But birds don't work that way, and this is all just a normal part of the process of bringing a new bird into your home. So becoming depressed, losing hope, thinking that it's hopeless, etc. after only just a month is something that you need to work through quickly, realize that this is normal, realize that you've hardly even begun, and then you need to "Hit the Reset Button"...

The reason he was acting so loving, cuddly, being snuggly, giving kisses, etc. for the first 5 days that you brought him home from the Rescue was simply because it was just the first 5 days! He had been in a Rescue for however long, or in his prior home for however long, and then suddenly he was moved out of where he was for a good amount of time, away from the people he had gotten used to seeing every day, the room he was in and seeing every day, probably other birds that he saw and heard every day, put into a car, and moved into this new home, in a new room, with a new person. This obviously causes the bird a combination of anxiety, stress, confusion, and frankly the poor bird is simply just nervous and scared at the beginning of being in a brand-new home with a brand-new owner that he doesn't know. And the fact of the matter is that you were obviously very sweet to him, kind to him, loving to him, you provided him support and made him feel safe while he was very much scared to death at what was going on, and honestly this made it very easy for him to settle-down and feel safe and secure in his new home very quickly...So what you saw during the first week he was with you was him looking to you for comfort, which you more than provided, it got him over his fear and anxiety, and then BAM!!! He was like "Okay, this place isn't bad, this guy is nice and I like him, I don't feel scared anymore, let's see what we can get away with!!!" That's exactly what happened and why it happened when it did.

So now, as already mentioned, he's testing his boundaries, seeing what he can get away with, and pushing you as much as he can. You don't know what his normal routine in his prior home was, you don't know how much direct attention he got, you don't know what his prior owner(s) did as punishment, etc. So when I say that you "Need to hit the reset-button", I really mean that...Totally forget that first 5 days after you brought him home! You need to start right now, from scratch! Today is the day that you've just brought him home, because now his real feelings and natural behaviors are not being masked by the extreme fear and anxiety of just being put into a new home with a new person. And yes, he's displaying severe cage-territoriality, which again is totally normal, it's his "safe-place" in this new home, especially if it's the same cage that he was in at the Rescue or in his prior home. So you need to totally and completely respect the fact that it's "his cage". I have a hand-raised/hand-fed Quaker who I got as a 12 week old baby, who is now 3 years old and who is extremely closely bonded to me, and who I can touch anywhere I want, hold, scratch, hang upside down, etc. and she hasn't ever done as much as even nip me...but ANY TIME I stick my hand in her cage to even feed her she goes right for my hands (and this is first cage she ever had, keep that in mind, it's not like she was re-homed to me or anything)...That's just something that you're going to have to fully-accept and is not going to be negotiable.

You do however need to figure out what you are going to start firmly saying (not yelling, but firmly and strongly speaking) and then doing any time that he bites you, and I mean any time that he bites you. You must be consistent and continual in your behavior in order for him to change his own behavior...Now, you stated that "he likes to be in your presence", so this is good, he feels safe and secure with you in the same room as him. So I too suggest that you use the "Shunning" method of training them not to bite, as to many birds not paying any attention to them is worse than anything else...

First of all, try your best not to show any fear you have towards him, as he can sense this. The only way to stop him from biting you and hand-taming/training him is to just jump right in there and do it, and yes, you're probably going to get bitten. I don't know if he's flighted or not, you haven't mentioned anything about him "flying away from you", but keep in-mind that chasing him around the room, especially with a towel, is the quickest way to move backwards...I would not ever try to get him to step-up for you inside of his cage, I wouldn't even attempt to put your hands inside of his cage at all while he's inside it as well. That's his space, his safe-place, so it's important that you respect that. In fact, I think you'll find that if you can get him into a room separate from his cage and shut the door so he can't see his cage at all, you're going to find that he's probably much less aggressive towards you, as he's not worrying about protecting his territory. So if you can feed him while he's out of his cage that's the best way to do it....So simply open-up his cage door and wait for him to come out on his own...and remember, even when he's standing on his cage, it's still in his "safe zone", so don't expect his behavior to change a whole lot. However, he does need to learn that he needs to step-up for you when he's standing on his cage without biting you...So open up the door, let him come out on his own, and and soon as he comes out of his cage on his own you need to both verbally praise him and then reward him with his favorite treat (btw, whatever his very favorite treat is needs to be ONLY given to him for training rewards, never any other time). So as soon as he comes out of his cage on his own you start saying "Good Bird!!! What a Good Bird!" or whatever it is you want to say, and given him one of his favorite treats...and if he won't take it from you without biting, then don't even try, because that's going to create confusion, so simply set the treat down in front of him so he can go and get it. If you can set something on top of his cage for him to stand on, like a flat platform or a little play stand so that he will just automatically come out of the cage and crawl right up to it, and then you can easily just set his treat for coming out of his cage on the flat surface, because if he bites you right after you're praising him for coming out of his cage and you have to use negative-reinforcement right away, confusion will happen...

After he eats his treat and gets his verbal praise for coming out of his cage on his own, then you're going to ask him to "step-up" for you while he's standing on his cage...Now if he does it without biting you then you need to make the biggest deal ever about it, praise the hell out of him, and give him a bunch of his favorite treat, then put him back down on his cage and try it again...However, this probably isn't going to happen, lol, and if/when he bites your finger/hand as you put it down and ask him to "step-up", you need to immediately either shriek or say "Ouch", as he needs to know that he hurt you, and then you need to say whatever it is that you're going to say to him every single time he bites you. Make it simple, something like "NO BITES!", and say it firmly and strongly, but don't yell or scream at him aggressively, you don't want to scare him, but simply let him know that he was bad, that he can't be biting you, and that you're angry. And whatever you choose to say to him when he bites you, this is what you need to say to him every single time he bites you..that's why "No Bites!" is a good phrase (BTW, this can be a big deal, be sure to ALWAYS say the words "Step-Up" to him BEFORE you extend your finger to him, so he knows why you are extending your hand/finger to him! If you do it in-reverse and extend your hand/finger to him and then say "Step-Up", that is pretty much ensuring that he's going to bite you before you even get the words out).

Part #2 below...

 

[EllenD]

Part #2:

Now comes the really important part, the "Shunning". After you cry out in pain and tell him "No Bites!", you need to immediately set him down, literally turn your back to him, totally ignore any noises he may make and don't respond to him in any way at all, no eye contact, etc. Pretend he's not there. And then walk away, out of his sight, for 5 minutes or so. You don't want to walk away for too long, as he'll forget why you left, or lose interest in the whole process, and he'll just stop caring that he's in trouble in the first place. So after 5 or so minutes you can walk back into the room (btw, if he starts crying/screaming while you're out of the room, totally ignore it and do not respond to him at all, do not make a single noise, just let him scream and stay out of the room...in fact, if he does start screaming after you leave the room, it's best if you wait to go back into the room until he stops screaming, as you don't want him to learn that screaming causes you to come to him...Green Cheeks aren't known for this, so 5-10 minutes out of the room is usually more than enough to get them to stop, if they even start). Then when you go back into the room you just pretend that it never happened, and ask him to step-up again, and if he bites you again you do the exact same thing, etc. And you keep doing this until he again steps-up for you off of his cage without biting, and you get to praise and reward him...

It's so important that you are completely consistent, you don't ever give-in, and you stick to the game-plan. They tend to learn very quickly that they can't stretch the boundaries beyond what they have, and typically denying them attention drives them crazy.

Another question is what room of your house do you have his main-cage located in? Is it located in the room of your house where you spend most all of your time when you are home? If not, then you need to relocate it to that room so that he's in your presence, even if you're not giving him direct attention. They do not usually do well when they know that you're home and can hear you, but they don't see you, plus he needs to get used to being around you without you giving him attention, this will make him feel secure, safe, and this will result in him entertaining himself. So if you are usually in the living room watching TV, reading, playing video games, on the computer, etc., then that's where his main-cage needs to be. And don't worry about him sleeping at night in the room while you're watching TV or making noise, they do just fine as long as you cover them with a sheet/blanket. It's extremely important that he's in your presence as much as possible in the near future, that he can see you, hear your voice, have you walking past his cage all the time, etc. The last thing you want to do is put his main-cage in some back or spare room where you don't spend most of your time at home.

Just hang-in there, again, this is totally normal, it just takes a lot more time and patience, and it will happen. He's already shown that he likes you, he feels safe around you, etc. Now he just needs to figure-out the boundaries, the routine, etc. in addition to slowly developing a close, strong bond with you, which it really does look like he's going to do.

 

[stiles]

Akuma223 - The bells are really tiny toy bells.

EllenD - Thanks for all that information. I will definitely start trying what you said. Chelly is flighted because I wanted to give him the freedom of going wherever he desired in my apartment. His cage is in my living room (where I pretty much spend all my time unless I'm taking a nap/sleeping). I've already started with the shunning approach. Whenever he bites me, I give him a stern "No Biting" and I set him down and I turn my back and go to my bedroom for a couple minutes (while I patch myself up) then I return. It just gets really frustrating that I pretty much have to get bitten to continue training. He bites super hard and draws a lot of blood every time and its really painful, but everyone on this forum probably knows the pain of a bite. I know it's a lot of work and I'm ready to put the time in, it's just really hard to not show some fear knowing that I'm 99% sure I'm going to get bitten. It's like I'm approaching him with the mindset that I'm about to feel a lot of pain. I feel lucky sometimes when he's just biting where I have a bandaid on because atleast that doesn't hurt but I can pretend it does, but he's quick to find the non bandaid'ed spots (which are slowly decreasing because my hands are full of holes right now).

 

[stiles]

Just a little update. I've been making an ouch sound and putting him down and saying "No Biting" in a stern voice and turning my back and leaving for a couple minutes before I return. I actually got to pet his beak a little bit before he tried to bite me so that's some progress. It was the only time though, every time after he continues to poof up and look really angry when I get near. It's really stressful because I can't help but feel scared when I get near him. Like if he even makes a tiny move I reflexively flinch and pull my hand away.

 

[ChristaNL]

He- you are only human!
Getting bit is not nice- so don't blame yourself.


Find something that makes you feel safer, if it's armour you need - get that!
Gloves are a hotly debated topic, but if it helps you to do things in/around the cage and feel safer .. go for them!

Of course you do not really need gloves, but you really need the sense of "it's going to be allright" and if something simple can help you...

Your bird reacts to your bodylanguage anyway- so if you can relax and gain more confidence, use it

It's like taking on a bully without fighting him, just by stop being a potential victim.

(I had to do the same with Sunny - she really looooves to lunge and make holes and has learned in the past she gets her own way if she does - so now and again I have to tell me: "it's no biggie, the doctor is still in, so if you end up needing stiches ... there is help" just to rattle myself out of being intimidated by her. The moment I stop being afraid of potential harm is usually the moment she stops pushing.... a huge relief, I can tell you!)

Fight the fear - not the parrot!
the parrot will follow your lead




(if you need me: I am that old little green being, living in a swamp and teach fledgling jedi's )
Sorry, I had to add that - it was getting a bit too not-longer-down-to-earth and I made myself nervous

 

[ChrisYNA]

Many birds are afraid of gloves (including mine), but if your bird is OK with them, fine... if you see the bird get this terrified look on its face and open the beak for a bite, do not use.

 

[stiles]

My issue right now is that EVERYTIME I'm near him he suddenly fluffs his feathers up and gets into an attack stance. He gives me this look like "don't even try to touch me". He's starting to come out of his cage more often now and I'll bring his basket over to let him perch on it and leave the basket on my coffee table. When he's on his basket I'll be sitting on the couch. If I'm leaning back on the couch his feathers go down and he's more calm. But when I sit up to try to talk to him he instantly fluffs up again. Should I still be trying to pet him while he's fluffed up (because he pretty much is guaranteed to try to bite me)? I feel like that would just annoy him more, especially if he's already showing me signs that kinda tell me to back off. Though his feathers are never not up when I'm near him anymore so I don't know what the "right" time to try to attempt to pet him is. I've been mostly trying to give him his space and not be too close for comfort, but I will continue to talk to him in a soft voice and hand feed him some grapes or bananas time to time, which he is okay taking from my hands without trying to bite me. I've tried the glove and it freaked him out so I immediately stopped that one. I've tried just wrapping my fingers in bandaids but he doesn't seem to like bandaids on my fingers either and will aggressively attack them.

Another behavior I'm curious about is when I first enter the room, he will aggressively tug on these bells hanging from these plastic chains and then make this high pitched screech and then just stare at me. He'll do it a couple times (but only when I'm in the room, he never does this when I'm not in the room. I'm in a 1 bedroom apartment so I can hear all the noises he makes). The way he tears at his toy seems like he's angry, but I'm trying to figure out if he's angry or if he's just trying to tell me something.

I'm having a lot of trouble figuring out the "right" timing to try to interact with him as he always just seems really annoyed and on the defensive when I'm around. I'm sure he probably can sense my fear as well. I don't exactly want to force myself on him, but I'm also concerned that if I just continue to give him his space (which I've been doing for the past 1 1/2 weeks now), he's never going to get comfortable around me.

 

[ChrisYNA]

Do you yourself want to be touched just because someone else wants it?

Why should a bird let you touch him when he's not in the mood. It's up to the bird. Mine loves me and some of the time I try to pet her, she'll pull her head away and that's that.

I would get rid of those bells. They could be very annoying to him. Do what I suggested.. removed them and place them somewhere else near him to see if he still attacks them. Mine goes nuts. She absolutely fights any bell.. not funny fight, but angry fight like the bell was annoying the hell out of her. From what you describe in your posts, I get the feeling the bird does not like those bells.

The fluffing up part is interesting. Remember there are two types of fluffing. One is the bird is completely relaxed and the other with the pinning eyes and the open tail, that's the 'don't mess with me' fluff. But if he angry fluffs up when near you then maybe he's not ready to trust you or you somehow screwed up to lose the early trust. This is a 5 year old, right? Something might have happened in his past that he now needs more time to befriend a new human. I wouldn't push it. I'd give him 2 more months to see if he opens up to you, but continue what you're doing with the space and the hand-feeding.

 

[ChrisYNA]

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-atQv2UIds"]Bonding With a Caique Through Trick Training - YouTube[/ame]

 

[ChristaNL]

I think that is really the question: is he afraid and defensive or is he just (succesfully) bluffing.
The fact that he eats from your hand makes me think it is the latter - he is not really afraid of you, unsure maybe, but not mortally afraid.

Why not juse desensitising steps instead of trying to pet him?
(he just might see your petting attempts as possible attacks (ChrisNYA made a good point: birds are not always into wanting scritches)

Just get near him as far as you can without the fluffing up etc. happening, reward him (look the other way to reduce tension, whistle, compliment him etc.)

-> Looking at him intensely to gauge his recation equals staring and staring in most species *is* a threat, so you might unintentionally bring this about all by yourself.
Look at him not straight on but more sideways, using one eye only just make all the difference!

But rewarding him when he is not bluffing could be the only thing he really needs. Just get him (back ?) in the habbit of being chill around you without you trying to do anything "to" (aka with) him.
.