redness on dominant foot?

[mrs.pants]

so yesterday mr pants noticed the bottom of our caique childs dominant foot is a bit red? hes with the boy all the time so this is a brand new thing.

theres no sign of injury or tangles. hes not limping and still grips strong. he hasnt shown any symptoms of it bothering him in the slightest.

we made a vet apt for him when we first got him but thats still not for a bit since they were booked solid for weeks at the time. i dont think its an emergency (and our e-vet here is HORRENDOUS).

my thoughts were more cleaning (he has one dirty perch that isnt in his cage ever but he uses it when hes out sometimes). we clean once a week and spot-clean on the reg, so maybe twice big clean? and more varied perches. we still use some of the smooth "starter" perches so im thinking we gotta go all wood. he slides up and down his bars a LOT but idk if that would do anything?

any other thoughts/suggestions?

 

[Laurasea]

If you used vinegar to clean and it wasn't diluted enough, and or you didn't re wipe and dry. Well it burns as it is acidic. I experienced this once and in a day or two was healed. Now I re wipe with just water and then dry...

 

[mrs.pants]

thats good to know for the future! i was planning to use the vinegar but right now we just use hot water.

 

[chris-md]

I’m not inclined to blame vinagre in this case. Especially appearing on the dominant foot could be a sign of bumble foot, and requires a vet intervention before it gets worse.. What is the perch situation like? What kinds of perches does he have?

 

[mrs.pants]

i thought maybe it was bumble foot too but its not a centralized red like a sore its more like a uniform covering under his foot.

perch wise we got a generic bar perch, a smooth "branch" and one made of wood that begins with an M i cant spell or pronounce lol. hes on this one a lot cuz its in his favorite spot. its also the thickest perch. he can grab it but not all the way around. hes also got a wood & rope ladder perch he loves.

we were gonna get him some different more natural ones.

 

[chris-md]

I will get Him to a vet to officially rule it out. Bumblfoot is notoriously hard to treat because you can’t keep them off their feet to allow healing.

If there’s even a CHANCE it could be it, you need to know one way or another. The worse it gets, the harder it becomes to correct.

 

[Brittany0208]

Is there a way you could post pictures of the foot?
I have a one-legged bird who has Grade 1 bumblefoot and even with everything in his cage being padded, along with me treating it with medicine, it's something he'll probably deal with for the rest of his life.

 

[mrs.pants]

mr pants mentioned he also has red dried fruit in his food but i dont think that would do it? he does eat apples as well.

we have a warranty and can bring him in to a pet store vet, i was just hoping to avoid that because after working in pet stores i dont exactly trust them. but his cav appointment isnt til the start of december so i may not have a choice.

 

[chris-md]

My personal opinion only:

I’d personally wait for the CAV. Couple reasons:

1) because...CAV... and

2) it’s JUST long enough to let any further symptoms show without REALLY being long enough to let it truly progress. if it’s something temporary and not BF (dye from food, for example), it’ll go away and you’ll have your answer. Essentially, it’s just long enough to get a firm “no, not bumblefoot” without letting possible bumblefoot get much worse.

In the meantime, as noted above, photos would help.

 

[Laurasea]

Feel both feet. If the red foot is hotter than the other, you have an infection.

 

[mrs.pants]

see to me they both feel the same. not cold not hot just warm like theyve always been, but mr pants thinks it feels warmer. which is weird cyz ill say something is really hot and hell say it isnt so idk.

in any case we went back and they told us to dilute iodine in water til its like green tea then dip his foot in it for the next 5 days? i mean ill do it fine but im glad well be seeing a cav soon :/

 

[EllenD]

Is there an actual wound or open skin? It's hard without actually seeing his foot, a photo would help tremendously, but if there is no actual open-skin then soaking it in diluted Betadine isn't going to help...It sounds like Bumblefoot to me too, very much actually (assuming that there isn't any open-skin, wound, etc.). I highly doubt it's any type of infection either if there is no open skin or wound...And the only thing that really causes what you're describing that pops-up this quickly with no actual open-skin or wound is Bumblefoot.

Bumblefoot is pretty easy to diagnose visually if you see an experienced Vet who has seen it before. The problem is that the only way to heal Bumblefoot is to keep pressure off of the foot for an extended period of time, and how do you do that with a bird who has to perch all day long, every day...It's a tough one, and it can happen even if you have all kinds of different perches for him. Some birds (and all other animals) just sit/stand constantly in such a way that that they are always putting a lot of pressure on just one spot of their foot or feet, no matter what it is that they're standing on.

I once saw a Vet who actually cured Bumblefoot successfully in many, many animals by building little "cages" or little "booties" out of casting material. They took a package of casting fabric and cut it into a bunch of very thin strips. Then they put each strip in water to start it hardening, and then they molded the strips around the foot in such a way that they made what looked exactly like a "caged bootie", and of course once it hardened the bird couldn't get it off. It's hard to describe, but the bootie actually did look like a cage around the foot, and the bottom was hard as a rock because it was casting material, and they started making it at the top, on the leg above the foot, and then worked downward, so that it was able to harden up top first, so by the time they got to having to build the part around the bottom of the foot, the top was already hard, so they could attach the pieces around the bottom of the foot in such a way that the foot wasn't actually touching the bottom of the cage bootie. So the foot was suspended and there was a space between the Bumblefoot area/bottom of the foot and the hardened bottom portion of the cage bootie. And because it was hard as a rock, anytime the bird put it's foot down to stand, he was actually standing on the bottom of the cage-bootie, but the bottom of his foot was suspended in the air above the bottom of the bootie...It works wonderfully well, the did it on a bird, a rat, a guinea pig, and I don't know what all else, but it worked perfectly. The bird could still perch on the other foot, and kept the foot with the cage-bootie on it up, and could still put it down and put all their weight on it because it was hard as a rock, and the bottom of their foot didn't touch anything for over a month. Healed right up...

 

[mrs.pants]

not sure what you mean by open skin? theres no wound, nothing wrapped around it or anything, the skin itself is just red mostly toward his toes.

we did go ahead and do an iodine dip (which he was very not fond of lol) and it seems to have reduced a lot of the redness but it was hard to keep him in for too long.

this was the best pic i could get of his foot (he's perched on his food cup), its not as red as it was which we're happy about! we're gonna dip him again tomorrow and see how it goes.

 

[Laurasea]

Bumblefoot (ulcerative pododermatitis) is a bacterial infection and inflammatory reaction on the feet of birds.

Nice pic. Glad it seems to be getting better, betadine soaks are a nice approach. Does he have any rough perches that might be new to him and made him sore? If it's nit extra warmth, abd he is not holding it up all the time, then hopefully he will get over it very quickly.

 

[mrs.pants]

he reaaaally didn't like it lol. but i dont blame him cause he's only just getting used to misting and suddenly were dunking his foot in water. it woulda been better if we just filled a tupperware and did that but we didnt wanna stress him out too much.

the only rough perch he has is the grapewood perch, but we legit just bought that one today. his only new perch which is mostly smooth is the manzanita perch.

he had a rope ladder that had rougher planks but that one is away until next week when we rotate everything out again. His other perches are all smooth wood either single bars or one smooth branch.

he does jump up on his chewy toys a lot and nearly all of them are shreddable and big so he likes to sit on them and tear them to pieces.

 

[Laurasea]

You can just soak a paper towel in the betadine solution and hold it on the foot if that is easier. Oneing I forgot to add is that bumble foot is usually caused by a problem on the opposite side or foot of the bird causing them to learn more weight on the good foot...then that leads to the increase in pressure making the once good foot bad... Lol too much info but it never hurts to check the other side to see if he is holding that one up or has any swollen joints.. but I think your guy just had something irritant on that foot. But I would love to see a beautiful shot of the whole bird just cuz I want a golden conures!!

 

[mrs.pants]

You can just soak a paper towel in the betadine solution and hold it on the foot if that is easier. Oneing I forgot to add is that bumble foot is usually caused by a problem on the opposite side or foot of the bird causing them to learn more weight on the good foot...then that leads to the increase in pressure making the once good foot bad... Lol too much info but it never hurts to check the other side to see if he is holding that one up or has any swollen joints.. but I think your guy just had something irritant on that foot. But I would love to see a beautiful shot of the whole bird just cuz I want a golden conures!!

Good suggestion! much less traumatic than holding his foot in water lol. i was able to trick him into standing on it. the red seems more pinkish today, hoping it goes away altogether.

would yall say I should have more rope perches? would those be better on his feet?

Here you go! he had pumpkin for the first time and tore it to shreds lol.

 

[Laurasea]

So cute!!!!!!

 

[TiredOldMan]

I'm personally not a fan of the cotton rope perches. If going rope I would prefer hemp, sisal, or seagrass.

IMHO natural wood of varying diameters with knots and all the other imperfections are best.

JMO so it's worth what you paid for it.

 

[EllenD]

Okay...Well it's not Bumblefoot, that's a good thing (if the only red area is that one right under his toenail)...It looks like somewhere he sits often has a spot on it where his toe wraps-around that is irritating it, OR he actually may have gotten his toe/toenail stuck in something, or he actually could have chewed on that too, no way to really know, but that looks like it is infected, especially since it's right next to the toenail.

The Betadine soaks are good for that, make sure he doesn't drink any of it, lol, and you may also want to put a bit of antibiotic ointment on it after the soaks too, like Neosporin. If that doesn't totally clear it up or if the redness/swelling spreads down his toe or into his foot then he needs to get to his CAV, but it doesn't look too bad.