Perjo talks, but now sinks...?

[DRB]

Perjo started talking this week, very exciting. Said "what" quite often and her version of hello, more like "hewwo".

But yesterday and today she seemed to almost fall off the top of the cage door. It didn't worry me yesterday but today it hit me, maybe something is wrong. Her vet check up last week the vet noticed some minor picking/plucking at some flight feathers. He said it wasn't a big deal but we just have to wait for feathers to grow back. But today after pikcing her up after she sank quickly to the ground I pulled her up quickly to force her to flap and her right wing seem to have noticeable less surface area than the left. She has not been acting different, I have not seen an unusual amount of wing feathers on the ground or in her cage. So I'm kind of baffled. But ultimately looking for the best perspective and advice moving forward.

Obviously I have to wait for new feathers to come in, and no idea when that will be with any significant accuracy. Meanwhile what should I do? What precautions should I take? What should I look for to monitor a plucking situation developing?

I'm bummed b/c she was becoming a pretty solid pilot and we would practice flying a few times a week. She was a very confident pilot. It already seems as if she's unsure of herself

 

[texsize]

Falling off the cage door IMO is a major red flag. I would take her in to the vet right away. If avian vet not available any vet that will take/look at birds.

good luck.
texsize

 

[AmyMyBlueFront]

I agree with Wes!!




Jim

 

[DRB]

I probably misstated falling off, I just meant to convey she ends up going from the cage door to the floor quickly, not that she falls off of it.

 

[DRB]

She just seems to be unable to generate the lift she was generating a week ago, yet wings don't appear that much different when folded at her side's. Only noticed the difference when I forced her to spread her wings open.

 

[texsize]

Do you think that she is wanting to go to the floor? Is that what she is aiming for?

My Bella has steadily improved as far as flying goes. Her primary flight feathers are still a bit short on her right wing. http://www.parrotforums.com/congo-timneh-greys/68269-flying-clipped-wings.html.

I don't know what would cause her to go backwards in the distance she can fly.
texsize

 

[wrench13]

How would you characterize the fall:

a) Controlled crash
b) Uncontrolled landing
c) Just a fall - every ccccbird has to learn at some point
d) A bit of every thing above

 

[DRB]

How would you characterize the fall:

a) Controlled crash
b) Uncontrolled landing
c) Just a fall - every ccccbird has to learn at some point
d) A bit of every thing above

Not seeing them taking place live and only hearing the wings flap and seeing the end of the landing it is hard to say. I don't believe she is losing her balance in a concerning way. Maybe she slipped b/c they sometimes get a bit too playful, or maybe she was attempting to make a coordinated jump and it just didn't go well.

What makes me feel concerned is how her right wing definitely has less surface area, and she seems to have a damaged wing feather every 2 weeks for the past 2 months, which either falls out from aggressive flapping or she pulls out. I'm just not sure how well she can fly short distances or keep her altitude up enough to not sink quickly right now.

You know how difficult it can be to get them to cooperate to get a nice photo of their wings spread to share with the forum for better analysis.

 

[DRB]

I can't stress enough that behavorially she is fine, she has been in a good constant day to day state of emotions and activity. She's a happy bird when she is eating, whistinling and now saying a couple words and roaming around her cage actively. She has been doing all these things like usualy the past week since the vet.

This could be a one time thing, maybe she was tired yesterday, but my biggest concern is long term and knowing how to properly monitor plucking as their is no remedy for not having proper or enough wing feathers, time is the only remedy and that could take months and months depending on the molt schedule.

 

[SailBoat]

A single major loss or a loss over a couple of weeks of the ability to fly at a level seen several weeks prior is something to be concerned about.

Parrots naturally loose flight surface feathers in very precise patterns and schedules so that the Parrot never losses the ability to fly during flight surface molting. The loss of enough feathers on a specific Wing to cause the loss of flight is not being driven by a natural process.

Young Parrots can have accidents that will damage feathers. To loss enough feathers to result in the loss of flight should have a pile of feathers at the sight of the event. The most concerning is the medical possibilities. The first is an infection of the Feather root(s) or an infestation. Like the accident, their should be a collection of full Feathers. If found, they need to accompany your Parrot to the CAV (certified avian vet) ASAP! The second is self-inflected by the Parrot. There are several forms of Feather distrustion. That form that leave little evidence is commonly referred to as Barbering. Regardless of the type of Plucking, the sooner your Parrot is seen by a CAV more likely they are to determine if it is medically driven or not.

Double check under furniture, etc... to assure that you didn't miss the collection. Get back into your CAV - ASAP!

FYI: With this information, you may want to revise your evaluation!

 

[DRB]

He did tests and said parasites could be a driver for such plucking, but he said we were in the clear in that regard.

 

[SailBoat]

What? Could be a driver? But in the Clear?

Okay - This is really your general discussion about your Parrot's funny activities over the last couple of days and 'is not' a discussion about what underlining issues that may be causing them, correct?

That all being true - nothing like the antics of a young Parrot to fill in the day.

Enjoy!

He did tests and said parasites could be a driver for such plucking, but he said we were in the clear in that regard.

 

[DRB]

What I'm saying is he saw her wings, was not pleased, but was not alarmed. The check up was clean, nothing to suggest parasites or anthing to drive the plucking. But he doesn't want to see it get worse, nobody does. He didn't use the word barbaring, maybe to a vet it's more or less the same, especially considering he firmly stated that if a bird wants to pluck it will pluck. Much like if they don't want to eat they don't want to eat. No matter how bad we don't want that to happen or the measures we take.

If I see this concering flight issue continue before Monday I will certainly contact the vet.

As a first time parrot owner I'm focusing on her right wing and lack of feathers and surface area, this is a learning opportunity for me AND a chance to protect Perjo from something happening even an accident now that I have seen this change in flight from her at the moment.

 

[DRB]

I don't know if it's cool to mention vets by name or not or against site rules, he's a very experience avian vet. Has a great repuation from what I have read and learned. So I don't think his perspective from the visit last week needs second guessed or questioned.

:shrug

 

[Billdore]

Thats cool that Perjo has started talking its a riot what they manage to come up with. Hopefully Perjo is alright, I just had our first vet visit. No tests just a listen to her heart and lungs. Beak trim and nails trimmed. Have you changed any of her toys out recently maybe she got scared or maybe she needs a change in toys (getting bored.) Sounds like she was having this issue before the vet visit right? And the vet said to just keep an eye on things? Have they gotten any worse since the visit? Try this stuff I noticed an increased growth in Timnehs nails and beak (could be from eating a better diet than she was though.) Avi glo Another members vet recommended it so I gave it a try my vet said it was fine to use. got it from amazon, use sparingly the label says use a ton but it should last a long time.

 

[SailBoat]

There is no rule that I am aware of that limits mentioning a Vet that you are satisfied with. I am aware that one of the Forums has a list of Vet names and I have seen individuals add their Vets to the list. If you list your Vet, I would recommend that to speak to them in that regard and assure that you provide their experience /education in Avian Care. Example: Certified Avian Vet, Avian Qualified Vet, Larger Animal Vet with Avian Experience, Small Animal Vet with Avian Experience, etc...

Any Vet will tell you that once the Parrot leaves, the client is in charge and any change can only be observed by the Client. If a charge is noticed, especially to the worst - call! In addition, your Thread notes changes since the last visit, not flying as well, or something like that, right?

Interesting Thread.

Enjoy!

I don't know if it's cool to mention vets by name or not or against site rules, he's a very experience avian vet. Has a great repuation from what I have read and learned. So I don't think his perspective from the visit last week needs second guessed or questioned.

:shrug

 

[DRB]

So I was gone for about 5 hrs this after noon. Let Perjo out of the cage and she ate a little bit like usual and then sat on a door perch. She stepped up for me and we sat and had some treats. I took her over to her travel cage and had her "jump" to it, that is my trigger word for some indoor flight exercises. She seemed a bit reluctant to jump and reached and stretched so she could grab it instead of fly to it.

Then I took her back to the cage and attempted to put her on top of the cage door (the spot she perches on the MOST when the cage is open) and she acted apprehensive. I tried again a minute later, and she leaned away quickly. I then put her on another perch on the outside of cage that is 8-10" lower than the top of the door. She was fine stepping there and sits there still. She's quiet but not strangely quiet.

My gut and knowing my Perjo I sense she is a bit unsure of that cage door now and might not have a lot of confidence in being up there. Yet she walked around the top of the cage for 5 minutes this morning. Also note it is 7:30pm EST and she has been up since 7:15am, so being tired has to be taken into consideration a little.

I'm going to call the vet now he is on call for the weekend.

I need peace of mind.

 

[DRB]

Vet says he has to rule out medical causes at this point due to the recent check up.

Could only be 4 causes, anatomical, medical, diet and behavior. Also educated me that molts aren't on a schedule. Just b/c a molt happens at one time of year in one instance doesn't mean it will happen at a set interval the next molt. So if she is missing feathers that have caused this change in flight that over the next 3-6 weeks if her flight returns to normal and I see more feathers than it was due to lack of feathers. If she returns to normal flight in that time frame and has the same feather arrangement she does now then we tackle that issue at that time.

Basically whatever is going on, if anything b/c again it doesn't mean she didn't just have a freak instance of uncertainty or etc b/c I didn't witness the entire episode each time, will be going on all the time and not just during flight. Like being drunk, you're not just drunk when you're behind the wheel of a car, if you're drunk you are drunk no matter what you are doing at that moment.

 

[SailBoat]

As I stated above, an Interesting Thread!

 

[DRB]

Perjo hasn't even acknowledged the top of the cage door for the second day in a row. Incredible creatures, she knows that something.....OMG, as I literally type this she makes her way up to the top of door cage. Unbelievable.

My approach to the next 3-4 weeks is limited time to get herself in trouble, finish building her low to the ground improved PVC playground.

Damn little ****, I think she might be able to read what I type on the keyboard!