Ouch my finger :/

[natv]

Just under a week with our new guy, he's 7 months old.

So... The first few days he didn't really bite. He would gently bite before stepping up, which I figured was for balance or to test that I wasn't going to pull away.

But... Last couple of days... I thought he was just going to do that 'test' bite, but he slowly clamps down and keeps biting with more pressure, REALLY HARD.

I read in a post here one method of ignoring the bite and he'd possibly eventually stop the biting.. But I can't take the pain and he broke skin. If I hadn't yelled out a large owwwww! he'd literally have a chunk of the top of my finger in his mouth.

Now I'm scared to do step-up with my hand and use a stick instead.

Should I just keep using a stick until he's older? Or are there things I should try?

Thanks
Nathalie

 

[Codybird]

I'm in the same boat with a young galah. He's testing the limits of what his beak can do, and I'm worried that he'll really start biting. Most resources on the net tell us that negative reinforcement doesn't work, and yelling at them will do nothing. My plan right now is to try and redirect that urge to chew by presenting him with a toy or stalk of broccoli.

You may want to look up clicker training or touch training where you teach the bird to touch the end of a chop stick and then immediately praise and treat him. The theory is that's the gateway to training a bird to behave well. There's lots of youtube videos out there, for example this one:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkI9PvOsjS0"]Building Trust With Your Bird - YouTube[/ame]

I'm curious if what other people out there who have been through training a young parrot have done in this scenario too.

 

[CathnPoe]

Ooh, yeah. Poe's 5 months and has already pierced my boyfriend's lip, hand, finger and chin. (He doesn't like him much)
He doesn't bite me so much, but still offers some nasty pinches.
They're at the age when they're testing their boundaries.
If you get bitten. Don't leave or offer a dramatic response. A stern "ow" and then putting the bird on the ground provides a time-out-from-positive-reinforcement. However, if your bird is biting to get you to go away, then you don't want to be leaving him or else he just got what he wanted and learnt biting is an effected means to an end.

As Codybird said, distraction is effective.

As he's young, you want to take advantage of it and make stepping-up the best thing in the world. Using a stick is okay at first, but you don't want it to have to stay that way.
Say "up" EVERY TIME you want him to step up. Bird's like consistency otherwise we become confusing creatures to them and they're less likely to want our company or know how to react.
Bribe him to step up with a seed or grape or warm cooked pumpkin. Then click or say "good" or whatever when he steps up and offer the reward.
Rinse and repeat.

Until then, look out for the body language. The "vulture" look as I call it; ruffled shoulder feathers and slick head. That overall tense look and the "piss off" eyes that are quite obvious despite no pinning being detectable with the dark irises.

In summary - ignore bite = good. Walk away from bite = bad. Distractions are good but training an alternative behaviour is better - such as waving at you and you leaving will train him to wave rather than bite.

Until then.... wear a thick glove or something. You don't want to have to dart your hand back and forth and make the whole thing a game.

Best of luck, no idea if this will help.
Poe's great with me but a little bugger with my family. So at least I can say it worked for the person who implemented it, but it didn't generalise.

 

[LoveMyParrots]

New parrots that are brought home for the first few weeks are most likely to bite out of fear. Is he hand tamed and hand raised?

The reason for the first few days that he didn't bite is because he was too scared to, and when he is a bit used to the environment, they tend to start to show their aggression.

Some parrots go through a bluffing stage, thats where they will bite. I know alexandrine, macaw, and some conures go through that, not too sure about Eclectus though.

The best thing to do is to avoid the bite, watch closely to his body language, eye pinning, feathers, etc.

But if he does bite, let him bite you. Eclectus have big beak and I know it's really hard not to react, but if you do, you will be teaching him to bite! One way to get him to let go is to push into the bite, it will make him loose balance and he will let go. Or distract him wih your other hand or a object, like a stick.

Also, don't get very scared and nervous when handling him, parrots will know that you are scared of them which they might act even more aggressive. So just be relax and normal, it will really help.

And once he is starting to trust you (which is gonna take a little while), he will less likely to bite.

Good luck

 

[Featheredsamurai]

A good way to distract your parrot when they bite is to take them into a new room, the new scenery will distract them and they might stop. Another way is to keep a can of coins around, when they are biting you shake the can behind your back where they can't see it for a moment and it will surprise them. They'll wonder what the noise is but they won't think it's from you. I don't use the coin method though.

The best waythough is to block the bite. When you think they are going to bite ball your hand into a fist and present the back of your hand. This way you aren't pulling away, and you won't be in pain trying not to yell.

Also clicker and touch training is awesome

 

[Thingamagigs]

My technique is probably controversial at best so I am not making a recommendation but sharing my experience.

I have never done it for any species other than my galah, but I can't imagine why it wouldn't work for other species. I use the same sound a galah makes when they are expressing their displeasure at the action of another, merely communicating to her in her language.
It has always worked for my galahs and I am not entirely sure why I never attempted it with any other bird species. It just felt right so I went with it. I use it sparingly, whenever she does something I can't distract her from sufficiently. But I have always attempted to at least partially communicate in the way my pets do, some of my dogs commands were based on their own behaviour or understanding of my posture.

 

[natv]

Thanks all. He was hand raised I believe. I have bought a book on clicker training so I'll be going through that.

I don't know if its aggressive biting, you may be right about him just testing his limits, especially since the bite doesn't seem like a lash-out, and it's a slow bite.

I like the time-out on the floor idea but this biting happens when I'm trying to do step-up so he's not on top of of his cage or off his perch yet at that point.

I'll try the pushing idea and as a backup the distracting with my other hand, and I guess if needed get some leather gloves

 

[njgray21]

You have not had him very long at all and it could just be a matter of he is not comfortable with you yet. I have had my female eclectus since mid November. For almost the first week I had her I didn't try handle her much at all. I just talked to her and fed her treats from my hand. I watched her body language to let me know when she wanted more interaction.

Is your boy doing anything right before the bite with his body that might indicate he does not want to be messed with. A good way to prevent bites is to read the body language and leave them alone when they don't want to interact. Your boy is still very young and very new to your household. Take it slow, you have plenty of time to establish a great relationship with him!

 

[mtdoramike]

When wanting your Ekkie to step up, don't offer your hand, OFFER YOUR ARM instead. Also, don't ask him to step up, demand it by yelling STEP UP as if your ordering him to do it. Also if he seems reluctant to do it after that, put your other hand behind him and push his butt as your ordering him to step up. I do this from time to time with both my birds so that they remember who is in charge.

Yes, Ekkie's bite hurt and will break the skin. They can break chicken bone legs with their beaks. BUT, with that being said, you should never yell out OUCH or let them know that they hurt you. I show both my birds that I'm angry after they bite me by dumping them off either on the their playstand or cage and refusing to interact with them for a while and when I do interact with them I use a stern voice until I feel comfortable that they won't try that again for a while.

I hope you haven't bought into the notion that birds even trained birds don't bite. Birds do bite and will bite. I'm not one of these people on the forums who says "my birds never bite me" If these statements are true, either they don't interact with their birds on a regular basis or they don't own a bird or have a very short memory.

 

[njgray21]

When wanting your Ekkie to step up, don't offer your hand, OFFER YOUR ARM instead. Also, don't ask him to step up, demand it by yelling STEP UP as if your ordering him to do it. Also if he seems reluctant to do it after that, put your other hand behind him and push his butt as your ordering him to step up. I do this from time to time with both my birds so that they remember who is in charge.

Yes, Ekkie's bite hurt and will break the skin. They can break chicken bone legs with their beaks. BUT, with that being said, you should never yell out OUCH or let them know that they hurt you. I show both my birds that I'm angry after they bite me by dumping them off either on the their playstand or cage and refusing to interact with them for a while and when I do interact with them I use a stern voice

I gotta respectfully disagree with the above. Maybe on an adult but this is a baby that the OP has only had a week. Yelling at him to step up or forcing the issue will only serve to make the biting worse IMHO.

There are a lot of different styles of handling a biting bird. I don't think there is necessarily any absolutes on how to handle it as each bird is different. But with a new baby I think slow and easy is the best approach. Just my 2 cents

 

[Doves1]

Don't let him bite! Trust me I have a Scarlet and if he bit to mean it I wouldn't have a finger left. I've had to be VERY strict with him and biting, every time I feel a bit of pressure from his beak it's a sharp rap on the beak with my knuckle, not hard enough to hurt him of course just enough that he doesn't like it and backs off.

You can't fear their beaks, if you do you will never handle them. You need to disapline them or they don't know it's wrong.

 

[CathnPoe]

It comes down to the individual bird.
Rapping on your bird's beak could invoke further aggression or instill a fear of hands. Even if it's not hard, you're wanting your bird to enjoy the sight of your hands and want them cuddling and offering affection. You don't want your hands to be associated with actions that annoy/provoke/ or otherwise provide negative retribution.

Pushing into the bite works really well.

I have to agree with njgray21 in that as your boy isn't lashing out in frenzied aggression, you don't want to turn into the scary-monster-person so early in his development and sever the delicate ties you are so carefully nurturing.

You want a bird that wants to be with you because it loves you, not because it fears the repercussions of making a choice incongruent with your own. If he really doesn't want to be picked up, fine. But don't leave with biting being reason you left... yada yada, accidental reinforcement, yada yada.

Sorry, felt the need to re-post.

 

[Fleabane]

Not sure how much help I can be as I'm also a new Ekkie owner

Haribo, as we have renamed Harry, is apparently about 2, we know little about his background as we rehomed him through a breeder.

We have had him just over a week, the best advice I had was to let him settle into his new home and cage, building trust through sitting next to the cage and hand feeding something he really enjoys - for Haribo that's a millet clump.

Haribo likes to "test" you by implying he will bite, a slight lunge, a little growl, beak slightly open, if you remain calm, don't pull back or squeak, he then steps up - it's almost his way of checking how much to trust you

If he really doesn't want your hand in there, he takes your finger in his beak and pushes you gently out of his space or cage!!

They are clearly very sensitive and cognitive birds, thinking about everything, work with that, praise them, treat them and watch them, they are very good at body language and the first few weeks is a time to learn what they are saying

My last bit of advice - dont listen to those that say you must be dominant, use the first two weeks to enforce whose boss, make them do this and that etc etc. In my humble opinion it doesn't work for an Ekkie - time and patience is the key and anyway as a flock animal they need to belong not be dominated

Most of all enjoy your new friend

 

[BeakersBro]

My advice in general for biting:

Whenever he bites, immediately put him in his cage for 5 minutes.

No need to scold him or discipline him in any other way, as he simply won't understand the connection, and you'll just scare him.

After several days of this repeated behavior: bite ---> cage, he will understand the connection and stop doing it.

However, in the odd case that he simply doesn't like you and is biting you on purpose in order to return to the cage, I would suggest getting him a separate "time-out" cage with very few toys and certainly no treats in there.

EDIT: Oh one other thing. When people say "ignore the bite", I doubt they mean "keep your finger there and allow him to keep biting it". Obviously, shake your finger and do what you have to do to remove your finger from his mouth. To me, "ignore the bite" means don't allow him to see you reacting in pain or fear. Just take the bite in stride; pretend it doesn't bother you; and calmly put him in his cage as if it's an after-thought.

Basically, he's a tiny little bird. And you're a gigantic human. You're like over 9000 times bigger than him. He might indeed be able to hurt you, but he doesn't know that. Don't let him think biting has any effect on you, and he'll soon give it up as a useless endeavor.

 

[BeakersBro]

Rapping on your bird's beak could invoke further aggression or instill a fear of hands. Even if it's not hard, you're wanting your bird to enjoy the sight of your hands and want them cuddling and offering affection. You don't want your hands to be associated with actions that annoy/provoke/ or otherwise provide negative retribution.

Yeah exactly. All the bird is going to associate is hand = scarey. In fact, he'll probably want to bite your hand even more because it's a defense mechanism.

 

[Featheredsamurai]

When wanting your Ekkie to step up, don't offer your hand, OFFER YOUR ARM instead. Also, don't ask him to step up, demand it by yelling STEP UP as if your ordering him to do it. Also if he seems reluctant to do it after that, put your other hand behind him and push his butt as your ordering him to step up. I do this from time to time with both my birds so that they remember who is in charge.

Yes, Ekkie's bite hurt and will break the skin. They can break chicken bone legs with their beaks. BUT, with that being said, you should never yell out OUCH or let them know that they hurt you. I show both my birds that I'm angry after they bite me by dumping them off either on the their playstand or cage and refusing to interact with them for a while and when I do interact with them I use a stern voice

I gotta respectfully disagree with the above. Maybe on an adult but this is a baby that the OP has only had a week. Yelling at him to step up or forcing the issue will only serve to make the biting worse IMHO.

There are a lot of different styles of handling a biting bird. I don't think there is necessarily any absolutes on how to handle it as each bird is different. But with a new baby I think slow and easy is the best approach. Just my 2 cents

I agree with some of what you said. I don't believe in forcing a bird to step up unless you absolutely have to. I always ask Rosie to step up, or I tell her I'm going "bye bye" so she knows she has to come on to go with me if she wants to be nearby me. If your bird doesn't want to step up don't force them, just walk away. A young bird does need to be trained, but you don't have to force them.

I strongly believing in letting your bird have choices, my Galah never ever bites me hard. She knows she can communicate with me without using her beak in a aggressive way. and I can read her body language to know when she wants her space (last breeding season she was very aggressive in the mornings) If she doesn't want to step up she puts her head down and presses her upper mandible against my hand, when she does this I either pet her or bring my hand away and try one more time. I don't think of Rosie as my pet, she's my companion who is a amazing intelligent wild animal I have brought into my home. When a bird feels like it can make some of it's own choices in daily life they truly open up and are much happier.

 

[natv]

Thanks guys!

 

[sodakat]

When wanting your Ekkie to step up, don't offer your hand, OFFER YOUR ARM instead. Also, don't ask him to step up, demand it by yelling STEP UP as if your ordering him to do it. Also if he seems reluctant to do it after that, put your other hand behind him and push his butt as your ordering him to step up. I do this from time to time with both my birds so that they remember who is in charge.

Yes, Ekkie's bite hurt and will break the skin. They can break chicken bone legs with their beaks. BUT, with that being said, you should never yell out OUCH or let them know that they hurt you. I show both my birds that I'm angry after they bite me by dumping them off either on the their playstand or cage and refusing to interact with them for a while and when I do interact with them I use a stern voice until I feel comfortable that they won't try that again for a while.

I hope you haven't bought into the notion that birds even trained birds don't bite. Birds do bite and will bite. I'm not one of these people on the forums who says "my birds never bite me" If these statements are true, either they don't interact with their birds on a regular basis or they don't own a bird or have a very short memory.

Holy cow, are you serious? This from a super moderator????

 

[Doves1]

I agree that certain birds will connect a slight rap on the beak with being scary and it won't help. In that case you could put them back in their cage with no treats. Treats are an excellent way of training, no bite = treats, bite = no treats and time out.

Again their are a few birds out there, like mine, that don't think it's scary. They just know not to do it because I'm going to get an uncomfortable rap on the beak. Your going to have to try different things to see what works.

 

[Pugtato]

When wanting your Ekkie to step up, don't offer your hand, OFFER YOUR ARM instead. Also, don't ask him to step up, demand it by yelling STEP UP as if your ordering him to do it. Also if he seems reluctant to do it after that, put your other hand behind him and push his butt as your ordering him to step up. I do this from time to time with both my birds so that they remember who is in charge.

Yes, Ekkie's bite hurt and will break the skin. They can break chicken bone legs with their beaks. BUT, with that being said, you should never yell out OUCH or let them know that they hurt you. I show both my birds that I'm angry after they bite me by dumping them off either on the their playstand or cage and refusing to interact with them for a while and when I do interact with them I use a stern voice until I feel comfortable that they won't try that again for a while.

I hope you haven't bought into the notion that birds even trained birds don't bite. Birds do bite and will bite. I'm not one of these people on the forums who says "my birds never bite me" If these statements are true, either they don't interact with their birds on a regular basis or they don't own a bird or have a very short memory.

I disagree. I consider Kippy to be my companion and friend, and I believe that there is a mutual respect between us. She can make her own choices and I in turn will respect them. Yet, at the same time she is able to infer when I am "asking" her to do something and when I really need her to do something through simple body language and tone. I never have to reinforce my dominance, because the issue never arises.

Does she bite me? Yes, but very very rarely and when she does it is always for a major identifiable reason. For example, a few weeks ago I went back to college after being on break. I had spent every second with her for weeks, and she was visibly and vocally upset with me when I was suddenly gone for 5-8 hours a day. She was stand-offish to me for a few days which peaked in a tantrum of sorts, in which she was VERY VERY angry with me one day for going to school. She was MAD and it was obvious when I came home that day. She was loud, destructive, and visibly upset which are three things Kippy just isn't. I willingly offered up my finger after she refused my attention and she chomped down. It hurt physically and emotionally (that was my friend hurting me), and it was hard not to move, speak or retaliate while the little green banana was looking me in the eye and chowing down with glee. But it seemed to make her feel better in the long run, she never offered to bite me again, and we have been back to being two peas in a pod ever since.

This may sound stupid to some people, but to me it was a logical solution. I had made her feel lonely, sad, and rejected. In turn she treated me like the bad friend she saw me as being. Once we had made our peace, had our "fight" we were good to go. I consider our relationship to be more of a friendship than a owner/pet relationship and therefore I may view this issue differently.