Mold in basement and cleaner issue

[noodles123]

So I have a leaking coal shoot in my 1800s basement and my dehumidifier stopped working (unbeknownst to me). The walls in the coal shoot have some questionable mold on them (it's like a little 8x8 room without electricity--walls were treated with a paint but that is chipping off. A small portion of the leak is coming from the brick/dirt portion of the wall, but that is a small area compared to the rest). I have sprayed the walls with 3% hydrogen peroxide but a week later and it looks a bit worse (did it again just now). It's not TERRIBLE-- like...I don't think this is a SUPER serious situation, but it could be over time if I don't get it fixed.

They sell a couple products intended to have residual blocking action on the mold. I am VERY uncomfortable using chemicals, but I know mold can also be really bad...

Here is one that someone told me to use (without the bird in mind): https://www.wetandforget.com/wet-and-forget-indoor.html

here are the ingredients...ugh...
Octyl decyl dimethyl ammonium chloride .025%
Dioctyl dimethyl ammonium chloride .010%
Didecyl dimethyl ammonium chloride .015%
Alkyl dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride .034%
Other Ingredients 99.916%

Called the company and the only pets that are mentioned or maybe evaluated specifically under "safe for pets once dry" are dogs, cats and rabbits--the others aren't mentioned at all (so it doesn't say is is or isn't safe).

1. If I use this in the smallish coal room, open the doors with a fan and keep my AC off for a few hours, is that too risky (normally I would say HECK YES TOO FREAKING RISKY)..Just worried about the mold.

2. If I find a place for Noodles to go while I spray the walls (and do the same thing in terms of airing things out), how long until I can bring her back in? She stays on the first floor, so this is the floor below her, but my furnace etc is also down there, so air circulates.

I do have an air purifier running in the basement, as well as 2 in her room..but I am still smelling the "dirt" smell from the basement, so I know it circulates up (the floors are dirt in some rooms BTW)..

Took samples of mold for analysis which will happen Weds BTW.

 

[fiddlejen]

Okay... just kind of reaching for ideas here, and with no thought at all to the chemical which you just listed...

I know that bleach is supposed to kill mold. What about cleaning those walls with Comet? I mean obviously that would be a lot more work than just spraying them down with something. I occasionally use Comet in my toilet and it does its bleach-type job but does Not give off Much odor. Where, any other bleach-based product would have a strong fume.

(*Not* saying Comet is always safe - Maybe it is, but I don't have to test. My house layout is Long and separated (could actually be two entirely separate apts quite easily); I run bathroom fan & don't let any bird near bathroom for quite a while after such cleaning. Due to allergies I am sensitive enough to be certain that using Comet makes *less* fumes than other bleach-type products. Less enough for other uses, such as your coal chute? Not sure.)

If you could run a fan to the outside whilst cleaning, you Might be able to use Comet safely. --Also, Comet is CHEAP, compared to most cleansers. You could try cleaning, say, a corner, whilst running a fan, to see if it seemed safe to you, without investing more than a dollar or so.

...Anyways. Just a brainstorming-type suggestion, not really knowing your layout etc. Obviously this Might or might Not be Feasible Or Safe for you to try.

 

[SailBoat]

Stop! You have the cart before the horse here!

- Stop the moisture access first!
- Provide exterior air to the area and remove the basement air to the outside!
- Let it dry out for at least three days!

Now, have the area inspected by a professional abatement group!
Note: Most Home Owners Insurance covers such inspections and with the common heavy rains of this Spring near everywhere in the Eastern half of North America you should not get much push back.

You may find that abatement is covered or at least a good part of it should be.

Mold is easy or demanding to get eliminate; If You Know What Type You Are Working With.

 

[noodles123]

Stop! You have the cart before the horse here!

- Stop the moisture access first!
- Provide exterior air to the area and remove the basement air to the outside!
- Let it dry out for at least three days!

Now, have the area inspected by a professional abatement group!
Note: Most Home Owners Insurance covers such inspections and with the common heavy rains of this Spring near everywhere in the Eastern half of North America you should not get much push back.

You may find that abatement is covered or at least a good part of it should be.

Mold is easy or demanding to get eliminate; If You Know What Type You Are Working With.

samples will be looked at under $30,000 work microscope lol (microbiologist friend ). He knows molds etc.

I am not really sure how to get the moisture etc out without letting the outside in...I have a LOT of wildlife in my yard but I also live in an area where crime is on the higher end-- NOT terrible, but I'm on the cusp of some very high-crime areas, it's kind of block-by-block here. Theft is not uncommon- I get packages stolen etc. My basement is also large (maybe not all in all, but lots of rooms), and I don't want to funnel the mold spores into currently uninfected areas of the downstairs-- it is currently (at least visually) confined to the coal room....
The de-humidifier was doing an amazing job for a long time...so much for that...I'm not even sure if it is broken or if it just cannot keep up...but it seems odd that the downstairs should be at 55% when that is same as upstairs...(would prefer 40% is basement and 45-50 on main floor..not sure about the 2nd floor because I have only looked at humidity in basement and 1st floor)...Upstairs doesn't seem to be having issues, but it is cooled by window units because, again, very old...seems okay everywhere but coal room but the germ-phobe in me is getting REALLY anxious about spores etc.

We aren't totally off lock-down here either, so even census people etc have not come around yet lol (that was due April)

The moisture is partly coming from the ground-- I empty tubs when it rains-- TUBS...but, it's got dirt walls with brick and paint to seal it in. The majority of my basement (EXCLUDING the dear old coal room) is pretty well-painted/coated, but that room is sketchy.
I have a dirt-floor "cold-storage" room, but it's like 100 feet away and it seems dry....This old house...
The coal room may end up just getting filled in, but that is an undertaking..I mean, it's charming in theory, but it's totally useless due to the lack of electricity and leaking...Sad

**It's also VERY humid here in the summers..** My parents' house is an hour away, and they moved there after I was done with college, but I spent a summer there and the humidity NEVER dropped below 70%!!!! Granted, that's an hour away..you get the idea.

 

[SailBoat]

A Vent for a dryer is about 4" (100 mm) in diameter opening with an outside flapper. Some also have screens that can be pulled to clean out the 'lint,' but will keep bugs and other little things out in this application.

A bathroom fan can be placed and piped to it and will pull air from that specific room and push it outside. Since there is no hot air involved, flexible dryer pipping can be used and held together with large hose clamps.

Everything can be had at your local hardware store, plus how to information from their staff.

Basement humidity is based solely on the dampness on the walls and floor. If you have mold, you are commonly over 55% at 65 - 68 degrees F.

 

[fiddlejen]

The de-humidifier was doing an amazing job for a long time...so much for that...I'm not even sure if it is broken or if it just cannot keep up...

I am certain you have Already checked this -- but just piping up Just In Case..

My house has a basement which our prior landlord got "waterproofed" sometime around 2000. (After severe flooding from a Noreaster came within micro-inches of ruining the furnaces, and did ruin washer-dryers and most everything in storage...) The waterproofing includes a sump pump & french drains, along with waterproof paint etc.

It also includes a Big ole dehumidifier. Which has been chugging along in a corner for years. Last year, I noticed it was running more than usual, and took a glance. The top seemed bowed-in. Looking closer I saw the top was actually a huge Filter. It was all Clogged up, and the shape was deforming from trying to pull air through it.

((I think my prior landlords used to change the filter on a regular multi-year basis, as I know Marsha had mold allergies. I pointed it out to my new landlord, and it eventually got replaced.))

Anyway. I am Sure you've already checked this. But just to mention -- IF maybe your dehumidifier's filter maybe isn't visible or etc. -- a clogged filter would be an easy fix. (Not for the coal chute, but for the dehumidifier, going forward.)

 

[SailBoat]

The de-humidifier was doing an amazing job for a long time...so much for that...I'm not even sure if it is broken or if it just cannot keep up...

I am certain you have Already checked this -- but just piping up Just In Case..

My house has a basement which our prior landlord got "waterproofed" sometime around 2000. (After severe flooding from a Noreaster came within micro-inches of ruining the furnaces, and did ruin washer-dryers and most everything in storage...) The waterproofing includes a sump pump & french drains, along with waterproof paint etc.

It also includes a Big ole dehumidifier. Which has been chugging along in a corner for years. Last year, I noticed it was running more than usual, and took a glance. The top seemed bowed-in. Looking closer I saw the top was actually a huge Filter. It was all Clogged up, and the shape was deforming from trying to pull air through it.

((I think my prior landlords used to change the filter on a regular multi-year basis, as I know Marsha had mold allergies. I pointed it out to my new landlord, and it eventually got replaced.))

Anyway. I am Sure you've already checked this. But just to mention -- IF maybe your dehumidifier's filter maybe isn't visible or etc. -- a clogged filter would be an easy fix. (Not for the coal chute, but for the dehumidifier, going forward.)

Wow, French Drains!! Near unheard of now a days!

 

[noodles123]

The de-humidifier was doing an amazing job for a long time...so much for that...I'm not even sure if it is broken or if it just cannot keep up...

I am certain you have Already checked this -- but just piping up Just In Case..

My house has a basement which our prior landlord got "waterproofed" sometime around 2000. (After severe flooding from a Noreaster came within micro-inches of ruining the furnaces, and did ruin washer-dryers and most everything in storage...) The waterproofing includes a sump pump & french drains, along with waterproof paint etc.

It also includes a Big ole dehumidifier. Which has been chugging along in a corner for years. Last year, I noticed it was running more than usual, and took a glance. The top seemed bowed-in. Looking closer I saw the top was actually a huge Filter. It was all Clogged up, and the shape was deforming from trying to pull air through it.

((I think my prior landlords used to change the filter on a regular multi-year basis, as I know Marsha had mold allergies. I pointed it out to my new landlord, and it eventually got replaced.))

Anyway. I am Sure you've already checked this. But just to mention -- IF maybe your dehumidifier's filter maybe isn't visible or etc. -- a clogged filter would be an easy fix. (Not for the coal chute, but for the dehumidifier, going forward.)

I looked this morning and previously--- it's pretty new..I bought the dehumidifier to replace the old in December and it got really good reviews..ugh...I will post some pictures so you guys can see what I am working with here-- it's a pretty big space and the issue is in that room but I don't want it to spread.

As far as I can tell, there is no filter...

I did set the function this morning from "dehumidify" to "dry" (which is intended for laundry etc) BUT maybe it will drop percentages enough to buy time (and tell me if it is broken or just not keeping up). It seems to have dropped it a few percentages in a few hours...so we shall see...

 

[noodles123]

back to coal room- dehumidifier and air purifier- 54 percent in this pic

You can see the partially dirt wall in the coal room

coal room is way across the room here--so you can see what I am up against

picture from cold-storage room w/ dirt floor (no mold)--across the large room, you can see the cave that is the coal room

looking into coal room (the black on walls is not ALL mold- it's cement that was painted over).although, there is some mold in there for sure..

I didn't take pictures of the room that attaches the basement to the outside, but there is another, so funneling air is tricky...it's the only one that goes straight outside down there.

 

[SailBoat]

Have seen far worst cases...

Looks like you have a moisture problem on the lower section of the walls, which is common with older style foundations. As heavy rains filter down within the soil of the exterior of the foundation it is common for water to gather near the home as that is where the soil had been disturbed to set the foundation walls.

- The costly means of repairing /solving the problem is to dig fully around the home to the base of the foundation, repair the joints, seal the outer wall, place a drain style spacer membrane around the foundation, place drain pipe at the base (piped to a sump pump) and backfill with crushed stone base above the drain pipe according to local code and than back fill.

- On the interior, there are a couple of interior foundation wall sealers that can be brushed on the walls that will 'help' to keep moisture out of the basement. If you plan of living here for five or more years it is worth applying multiple coats (1 along the top 1/3, 2 along the mid-section, and 3 coats along the bottom 1/3 of the wall). If you are leaving sooner; 1 coat and run.

FYI: Check to see if the area along the outside of your home is not lower than the yard in general. The goal is to have the rain water flow away from the home.

 

[noodles123]

The rain flows away for sure-thank you- it is sloped with drainage pipes too.
Would filling in and blocking off the room solve the issue?
I am afraid to harm the bird and it's hard to figure out what to do with her during covid- paint will off-gas for months so that isn't the safest, but neither is mold, so I'm stressed lol.
Also- none of those pictures really show the mold/mildew, but the colors that have developed are grey/black, purple and yellow (which could be salt of some sort of mineral I suppose)...It isn't COVERING the walls, but it's definitely noticeable when you see that some of the speckles are NOT dips in the cement/paint and actually mold (or whatever it is).

 

[SailBoat]

The rain flows away for sure-thank you- it is sloped with drainage pipes too.
Would filling in and blocking off the room solve the issue?

If you have 'flowing' water into that room from the exterior of the foundation, maybe! The concern is that you could turn it into a slow filling 'holding tank' and only increase the problem.

To fill in the room would require making /cutting drain /flow opening in the three outer walls (from floor to near top of fill) and sealing the interior wall within that room before filling. Along the top (above ground level) you will need to cut vent openings that will allow air above the fill area to reduce mold growth in that area.

Seal coating sounds like a real pain, but it can be done is section as time and money are available starting from the area of greatest problem and working up and away from there.

I'll check at my local hardware store to see what they are recommending now-a-days.

 

[SailBoat]

Well, I was allowed to wander around our local hardware store and was not surprised with the number of old standby products like DryLock Waterproofer Latex basement wall coating, Penetrating Sealers, and the newest (as seen on TV) Liquid Rubber products.

A short discussion with one of the staff members and I was provided with some great advise. The more intrusive the water problem the more expensive the needed product. The newest members are the Liquid Rubber products that can be applied on a wet dripping wall. The Penetrating Sealers can be applied to a wet wall, where a product like DryLock can be applied to a damp wall.

In all cases, a stiffer brush is used to clean the wall and floor area near the base with a goal of removing as much loose particles as possible. If your surface is very rough with deep spaces between the brick, one can use a 'hydraulic' concrete, which is applied much like plaster in a hole in a wall. Start at the base of the wall and work up in stripes back and forth. Take care not to add too much water to the concrete powder.

I have used the hydraulic concrete with DryLock with great success in recovering a coal room. The hydraulic concrete was placed against the unfinished, wood framed, poured concrete walls with a bit of extra effort in those areas with cracks and holes. The DryLock was used at the floor wall area, wall cracks, and in and around the two, metal framed coal access windows. It was a small coal room (humor) at 12' x 20'. Took a couple of years, but well worth the space gained.