Let's talk about caiques and conures a bit!

[Kisota]

Hello!! I'm a relatively new member, itching for info.

I'm doing a lot of bird comparisons at the moment, because I'm in the market for one. I'll try to be brief.

My living situation:
- small apartment; don't currently have a lot of neighbors. Live with very long-term boyfriend.
- we have space for a cage. I think with a bit of rearrangement we could fit a pretty darn big one in here, but that would be something we'd have to talk about.
- work ~8 hours a day. May vary a little because I'm a grad student and my schedule varies by day and semester. Other than work, we spend quite a bit of time at home watching movies, videogaming, and just hanging out.

My preferences for a bird (I know from experience how much individuals can vary! My cockatiel was a slapstick, cuddly, curious goofball and my sister's was an attention-loving little Godzilla with a kind of huffy attitude):
- CUDDLINESS. I love birds that nuzzle and roll on their backs and love to be touched. This varies a lot by individual, I know, but I am definitely going to give huge preference to species that tend toward being very hands-on and cuddly.
- Boldness/outgoing personality. My experience with tiels was that they are sweet and mellow but not always the most brave and outgoing with new things and people. I can deal with mischief; I would like a pet that will be more willing to check out new things and new people. I also have to consider that we won't likely stay in this apartment forever, so a bird that can handle new stuff and change may do better.
- Playfulness. I know a ton of people who like mellow and contemplative birds. I can definitely understand the appeal. Maybe it's just my personality, but I find energetic, bouncing, bobbing, toy-thrashing little guys more appealing.

Things that may all be important given my living situation:
- typical noise level
- ability to entertain itself while we work full-time away from home; I have high hopes for training, socialization, and just... general attention when I'm around. But there's no escaping that we'll be gone about 8 hours a day. I know that's not ideal for any parrot, but I don't want to bring home one that is especially prone to health and behavioral problems that could be caused by alone time.

Right now I've been leaning toward green cheek conures, and I've found them really cute and appealing for years. But they seem to get mixed reviews from people. Some people seem to ADORE them and others find them nippy, difficult, moody, erratic, just harder to deal with.

Caiques are very appealing to me as well, because so many people seem to say that they're good with new people, playful, and bold. I also like the moderate size of them (bit easier for harness and flight training, too) and the ridiculously cute solid, stocky way they're built. Oh, and the noises overall seem less irritating, though from what I understand, the volume can be awful? I also worry more about a high-energy caique being unhappy with my living situation. But they're really winning me over and making the decision trickier.

I've looked into Pois, which seem charming but just don't have the same outgoing friendly energy to them. I've also investigated Hahn's macaws, pionus, and eclectus parrots.

I'm planning on getting in touch with a local breeder who has green cheeks, both types of caiques (at nice prices - 500 for a black headed?!), Senegals, and Hahn's as well as many other parrots. I'm also hoping to get up to a bird fair later this month and chat with people who have more experience, maybe get to handle some birds. I'm keeping a very open mind as of now. Who knows what might seem right to me in person? That's why I'm trying to find ways to really meet and interact with some more birds.

But I'd love to hear more from people who own these birds, particularly caiques and green cheeks. I'm trying to get a little comparison and contrasting going to figure out what is my preference as well as what will fit best into my life.

Thanks!!

 

[shawn]

i dont have a bird yet. but i was also debating on getting a caique or conure. wanted the conure at first cuz it was cheaper and also pretty. but upon reading more. they are a lil noisy for my taste and house. so now i am going to get a caique. just waiting for a bird show in march to get one.

but based on your situation and what you describe. a caique is def for you. playful, stocky good looking. they can easily entertain themselve when you're away. just leave a bunch of toys for them. they hop around. they are more of a climber then fliers. they lay on their backs. they are cuddley, and loves attention.

no personal expierence yet. but based on this site and research this is what other people will tell you. so i would def spend extra money and get a caique.

 

[ParkersMom]

I work sometimes up to 12 hours a day and my BH caique Juno does just fine as do both my BF amazons

 

[thekarens]

Since you live in an apartment I'd recommend the green cheek. It would fit your requirements and is quieter than the caiques

 

[ParkersMom]

Juno isnt very loud but then again I have 2 amazons

 

[Kisota]

Thanks for the thoughts so far! I really enjoy both types of bird, though I think the green cheek is a little less... risky given my living situation. A little easier, as well, in terms of housing and such.

I really hope I can find the opportunities to interact with and handle both sorts of birds. Try to get a feel for whether one just clicks with me a little better.

Any other thoughts would be wonderful! Is cross-posting allowed here? (IE, could I post this thread to the conure forum or Questions and Answers as well?)

 

[mtdoramike]

Caiques are fun birds, but the price is what drew me away from them. Here in central Florida if you can find any caiques, they would run you almost as much for one as a baby Blue & Gold Macaw. I found that I could get the same personality in a Senegal for less than half the price here, which would be around $350-$450.00 depending on where you bought it.

 

[jugoya]

If you aren't bothered by size..
Energetic birds come in the form of one of the smallest, aka the Parrotlet; perfect for a small apartment quiet and FUN.

I want one.. lols but I can't afford to keep another bird.

Not YET anyway.


Another choice is another species that's becoming more popular again. White Wing parakeets or the Beebee parrot.

Small cuddly and energetic; with a BIG attitude in a smaller body with a quieter call than a conure.

Also you could look into quakers if you can have one in your area :3
Energetic little fluff balls though they have about the same noise level as a caique.

 

[Kisota]

Caiques are fun birds, but the price is what drew me away from them. Here in central Florida if you can find any caiques, they would run you almost as much for one as a baby Blue & Gold Macaw. I found that I could get the same personality in a Senegal for less than half the price here, which would be around $350-$450.00 depending on where you bought it.

Yikes, that's pricey! Yeah, it seems like caiques aren't generally very affordable, but are pretty well recommended as mostly good natured parrots. Although I -am- trying to keep my costs down, it's cool I can get them for 500-600 dollars around here. I do worry a little about noise, though. That's why I'm only looking at Pyrrhura conures, although I know they can make their fair share of noise. And the caique cost is still a chunk higher, especially when you add in the cost for a larger cage.

Cockatiels tempt me a little, because I don't mind their whistly calls and their voices are so cute. I loved my cockatiel. But I'm looking for something with a more interactive and bold personality.

If you aren't bothered by size..
Energetic birds come in the form of one of the smallest, aka the Parrotlet; perfect for a small apartment quiet and FUN.

I've heard good things about parrotlets, and they've been recommended to me before. But good gosh, they're tiny! I prefer something a little more solid, especially since I want to do harness training and such. I'm frankly a little worried it might be difficult with the little tiny conures I'm looking at, even. Really teensy birds move with that sped-up, twitchy flighty way. It for some reason makes me a little anxious... I guess I find them harder to handle?

We had a budgie for a while before I brought home my tiel, and I was so relieved by how slowly and clunkily the tiels moved in comparison to the zippy little budgie. I know a lot of the birds I'm looking at are energetic, pretty fast-moving smaller birds, but they still move with a little more weight and predictability, it seems like. Less flitty.

Another choice is another species that's becoming more popular again. White Wing parakeets or the Beebee parrot.

Small cuddly and energetic; with a BIG attitude in a smaller body with a quieter call than a conure.

Thank you so much for this suggestion, Jugoya! You know, I've been doing lots of research, but I've never even heard of this bird before! They look very sweet. I'll keep my eyes open!

As for quakers... I'll have to give them a little more of a chance. My first impression of them was to be a little intimidated, and I don't know why, but for some reason, that dry noise they make is much harder on my ears than most bird noises are. It's just such a chaotic noise... They are a nice size, though, and I know a lot of people who like them lots. (As a sort of less important side note, I also just do not find them cute or attractive to look at - no offense intended to quaker owners!! Your babies are all very sweet and cute, but just don't grab my attention either in looks or behavior the way conures and caiques do).

I can have a quaker here, but they're not allowed to be free-flighted. I've heard rumors that doesn't mean you HAVE to wing clip... but that the bird must be restrained. In any case, I'm likely to move out of state in the not-too-distant future, so it may be best not to buy a bird I might not be able to bring with me. How heartbreaking would THAT be?? :C

Should I crosspost this to the conure forum and see if conure people want to weigh in as well? Or maybe in the Questions and Answers instead?

 

[Jowelbg]

Did you see the thread where a member measured the decibel level of different birds?

http://www.parrotforums.com/general-parrot-information/33087-parrot-noise-levels.html

In case you need a comparison (they always help me),

Near total silence - 0 dB
A whisper - 15 dB
Normal conversation - 60 dB
A lawnmower - 90 dB
A car horn - 110 dB
A rock concert or a jet engine - 120 dB
A gunshot or firecracker - 140 dB

We love our 2 Caiques. Our current apartment setup has ridiculously thick walls, so the noise isn't a problem. The only thing I caution you against is the cuddly statement. Bunsen & Beaker are very hands on. They love to wrestle, and they want to be involved in everything you're doing. They aren't cuddlebugs, though. There are some cuddly Caiques on this forum, I don't think it's a given with this species, though.

Ours are very adventurous. Over the summer, my wife takes them to her junior high dance camps, and they play well with all the kids. They definitely have the energy level you're looking for. It's basically all the joy and trouble of raising an ADHD child.

Let us know what you decide!
-Joel

 

[Kisota]

The only thing I caution you against is the cuddly statement. Bunsen & Beaker are very hands on. They love to wrestle, and they want to be involved in everything you're doing. They aren't cuddlebugs, though. There are some cuddly Caiques on this forum, I don't think it's a given with this species, though.

Ours are very adventurous. Over the summer, my wife takes them to her junior high dance camps, and they play well with all the kids. They definitely have the energy level you're looking for. It's basically all the joy and trouble of raising an ADHD child.

Let us know what you decide!
-Joel

Thanks for all the info, Joel! That dB thread was really fascinating. I wonder if the smaller conures can reach that same ear-splitting volume, or whether they just tend to make the loud noises less often? Either way, makes for a good comparison. I wish noise wasn't an issue. So long as it's not frequent tantrum-style screaming, I don't really mind bird noise. But my neighbors (and even my boyfriend) may feel otherwise. He's a cat person, though... while I like dogs and parrots, so that may say a little about us, haha.

Now, I know cuddliness depends a lot on the individual. But now I wonder whether conures or caiques are more likely to enjoy being held and scratched and flipped over and snuggled? Any thoughts on that, anyone? I don't know whether I'm getting biased information, but it seems like it's more common than not that green cheeks really like being scratched and burrowing and even laying on their backs and being petted. I'm sure I'll love whatever bird I end up with, whether or not it wants to be hardcore cuddled, but those types of behaviors are definitely my preference.

As far as whether caiques are more likely to cuddly or more likely to be not-so-cuddly... I guess I don't know yet!

 

[Birdman666]

Caiques are quirky birds. They may be cuddlebugs. They may drive people off...

They will probably be fine, if handled.

And actually, either bird would be pretty much the type of companion bird you are looking for. Socialization and handling is the key though, to either species.

Conures are pair bond birds, so if allowed to over bond, you can have aggression and biting issues with anyone who is not their person... so again, it all comes down to sociaizing them properly.

 

[treckel]

I love my green cheek conure!

 

[legal_eagle]

GCC's are generally among the quietest of parrots, and generally like being touched and cuddling.

 

[punkindave]

The only thing I caution you against is the cuddly statement. Bunsen & Beaker are very hands on. They love to wrestle, and they want to be involved in everything you're doing. They aren't cuddlebugs, though. There are some cuddly Caiques on this forum, I don't think it's a given with this species, though.

Ours are very adventurous. Over the summer, my wife takes them to her junior high dance camps, and they play well with all the kids. They definitely have the energy level you're looking for. It's basically all the joy and trouble of raising an ADHD child.

Let us know what you decide!
-Joel

I'd agree 100% with this.. While they are all quite sweet and like being handled and played with, I would only call one out of our 4 Caiques "cuddly". As to noise, one of them has a loud (relative to the others) call out. When excited they can all get loud, but only one has a voice that I would consider overly loud.
Of course it's nothing compared to our cockatoo "fire alarm"!

 

[dskidd]

Unfortunately, I can't help you with comparisons of different bird species as all I have are caiques. (I'm beginning to wonder if they actually ARE birds. They sure don't seem to think so. But that's a topic for another day...)

I will say that I personally don't find Eliza and Henry to be that noisy at all. Sure, they'll squawk when I get home, but they're just excited to see me. Once I let them out, they just make their kissing noises and general chatter. Granted, when they do squawk, I talk loudly back to them (like we're having a conversation), but that's one of the fun things about having them.

In the interests of full disclosure, I live in a house rather than an apartment. I would probably be a lot more sensitive about the noise issue if I were sharing walls.

As many have said, much of the behaviors are determined not only by each individual bird, but how you interact with them. Eliza is definitely a cuddle bug. Henry is not a snuggler, but that doesn't mean he's aloof. He likes to be with me at all times, just not necessarily cuddled up. And when it starts getting dark, they both love getting under my neck and curling up together to sleep, which is incredibly sweet. (Not to mention the resulting crick in my neck means my chiropractor has been able to upgrade his golf clubs.)

If I tried to write down how much I love Eliza and Henry, I guarantee there wouldn't be enough terabytes on all the servers in the world to contain it all. So keep in mind I'm slightly biased towards caiques!

That being said, I applaud you for approaching this so diligently and doing all the research. I think it's a safe bet that whichever bird you choose is going to have a very happy and fulfilling life. I'm really looking forward to the updates on your decision-making process, and--of course--the decision itself! (Plus photos!)

All the best,
Derek

PS Is this the wrong time to mention that Joel and I keep our birds fairly docile by giving them full access to the liquor cabinet? Yeah, it probably is the wrong time to bring this up. Forget I said anything...

 

[SoCalWendy]

Senegal's, can be cuddly. Mine isn't, but the potential is there. Rio definitely has her moments when she wants interaction. She will hop on to my lap and loves scratches. She will grab her own beak or her head with her foot, which a the most adorable thing I'd ever seen. Clearly she wants scratches. Then there are times when she just wants to sit with me, all content with not much interaction. The good thing she can and does entertain herself. I have left her for up 10 hrs with no problem. She is relatively quiet compared to some others. But she also has her moments when she is very vocal. I live in an RV, thin walls lol... She doesn't seem to bother anyone. She also has a cage outside, so on warm sunny days I will put her outside for the day, I have never gotten any complaints from neighbors. She has picked up so many wild birds sounds from her times being outside. Her activity level is perfect for me. I have fibromyalgia. Often I am very stiff and in pain. So I am glad she can entertain herself, and I love to watch her play. Right not she is sitting on her orb which sways back and forth her stand is right next her it. She can easily go back and forth. She will swing to her stand, using her beak she will crap hold of the stand and use it to make herself swing and spin on her orb. Too funny.

 

[Birdman666]

Did you see the thread where a member measured the decibel level of different birds?

http://www.parrotforums.com/general-parrot-information/33087-parrot-noise-levels.html

In case you need a comparison (they always help me),

Near total silence - 0 dB
A whisper - 15 dB
Normal conversation - 60 dB
A lawnmower - 90 dB
A car horn - 110 dB
A rock concert or a jet engine - 120 dB
A gunshot or firecracker - 140 dB

Next things on the list:
Jet Engine noise (Idle)
Jet Engine noise (Full Throttle)
The Amazon Alarm Call
The Attention Seeking Macaw
And the Screaming Squawkitoo

 

[dskidd]

Did you see the thread where a member measured the decibel level of different birds?



http://www.parrotforums.com/general-parrot-information/33087-parrot-noise-levels.html



In case you need a comparison (they always help me),



Near total silence - 0 dB

A whisper - 15 dB

Normal conversation - 60 dB

A lawnmower - 90 dB

A car horn - 110 dB

A rock concert or a jet engine - 120 dB

A gunshot or firecracker - 140 dB

Next things on the list:

Jet Engine noise (Idle)

Jet Engine noise (Full Throttle)

The Amazon Alarm Call

The Attention Seeking Macaw

And the Screaming Squawkitoo

Followed by:

Saturn V launch (measured within 100 feet of the launchpad)

Eliza and Henry when they hear the microwave go off

 

[Kisota]

(everything!)

Wow, thank you for writing this up. Very helpful! And the neck-cuddling sounds absurdly cute. I agree that it seems like how you handle them affects how they want to be handled pretty strongly.

Thank you, everyone! It's a lot to consider.

Another complicating factor may just be availability. I was thinking about that recently. The breeder in town has caiques, but I'm guessing there's probably a hefty wait list. On the other hand, they have greencheeks way more often. Several breeding pairs.

I do wish we lived in a house, so I'd be able to make the decision based more on which bird really suits me best and less on "what can I get away with here without complaints." I guess there's always the possibility of looking into another bird in the future if I just -really- want one. (Who knows what my partner will put up with, though? )

I got some more information from the breeder. We're going to go in on Saturday and hopefully talk to someone in a little more detail. Unfortunately, they're busy on Saturdays... but it's just too hard to find time during the week. Hopefully it'll be a satisfactory visit anyway.

A lot of this will also depend on what my partner is okay with. He's given the ok to having a bird, but I'll want to go with what he feels comfortable with, as well. That's part of the reason I want both of us to get a little experience handling different birds. If he thinks caiques are huge, chunky, intimidating dinosaurs, I wouldn't want to pressure him with that.

He is definitely amused by the bird videos I've been playing for him on Youtube. And he often doesn't form much of opinions on these things. But I'll have to pry out some preferences!

This is a great thread. Thanks also for the thoughts on Senegals! They are very pretty and intense-looking birds. I like the purring noise they sometimes make, too.

Whatever happens, I'll keep you all updated and there will definitely be pictures! Heck, I might try to take some at the breeder's and at the bird fair even. We'll see.