Hello! Introduction and Asking for Advice and Guidance

[noodles123]

Not all birds respond to cuddles in every setting with rush of destructive hormones, leading to unwanted/destructive behaviors. Highly dependent on the individual, species, temperament, and methods of interaction.

I've cuddled three species of cockatoos, (Goffins, Moluccan, Citron) Timneh Greys, two types of Macaws, (Greenwing, Blue & Gold) Eclectus, and Amazons without resultant sexual confusion and subsidiary behavioral distortions.

My 35 years of living with parrots have taught reverence, caution, and deliberative analysis of cause and effect. I honestly cannot identify behavioral issues with my flock as consequence of inappropriate cuddling. Not to say it does not and cannot occur, simply beware rigid, unyielding stereotypes.

True, but it also depends on the person doing the cuddling (as a cuddle from one is not the same as a cuddle from another), length of cuddles, age of bird, environment, presence or lack of other birds, level of bonding, number of humans in a home, etc etc...It's a fact that certain touching is sexual to them (even if you don't notice a change in your bird)...These changes can happen within days or years, but it's cited frequently by avian vets etc

 

[Scott]

Not all birds respond to cuddles in every setting with rush of destructive hormones, leading to unwanted/destructive behaviors. Highly dependent on the individual, species, temperament, and methods of interaction.

I've cuddled three species of cockatoos, (Goffins, Moluccan, Citron) Timneh Greys, two types of Macaws, (Greenwing, Blue & Gold) Eclectus, and Amazons without resultant sexual confusion and subsidiary behavioral distortions.

My 35 years of living with parrots have taught reverence, caution, and deliberative analysis of cause and effect. I honestly cannot identify behavioral issues with my flock as consequence of inappropriate cuddling. Not to say it does not and cannot occur, simply beware rigid, unyielding stereotypes.

True, but it also depends on the person doing the cuddling (as a cuddle from one is not the same as a cuddle from another), length of cuddles, age of bird, environment, presence or lack of other birds, level of bonding, number of humans in a home, etc etc...It's a fact that certain touching is sexual to them (even if you don't notice a change in your bird)...These changes can happen within days or years, but it's cited frequently by avian vets etc

Precisely why handling generalizations are helpful to newcomers, obdurate prohibitions are stifling. Touching a bird around cloaca or belly regions inappropriate and stimulating, other zones such as wings or back highly individual. Fact is not every bird is perpetually hormonal and aroused.

 

[Laurasea]

Sluiceaway,
You can see we are a great group, very passionate about parrots!

So when you decide to get a parrot, you hsve a whole new family here!! And you will never run out of new things to learn or new ideas to try!

I learned tge importance having a scales weight checks, sprouts, and yogurt here!@ to name just a few!

 

[sluiceway]

What about the extreme noise and the rabbits?

This is something we're considering, and is why we're looking at the quieter species of parrots (we don't mind constant noise, just the screeches).

Thanks for the update, you seem potentially ideal!

A few search engines to determine veterinarian specialties:
https://www.aav.org/search/custom.asp?id=1803
https://lafeber.com/pet-birds/find-an-avian-vet/
https://abvp.com/animal-owners/find-an-abvp-specialist/

Turns out my vet is not Avian Certified! My mom seems less concerned with this because of how passionate our vet is, but I'm not too sure.
How important is it to be certified versus not, and if so, any advice on convincing her?

You need to think about your idea of a parrot and what you want.

Some species like to cuddle, some like a little contact, and some really don't like to be petted in general. They still love you and love to interact with you, hang out on your, but just prefer you don't get handsie ...lol while other species never seem to get enough head scratches. Its usually the allopreeners that lije petting, like conures, quaker, Amazon, while Eclectus, IRN, CAG ( some like a little cuddle) aren't that into you having your hands on them .

I'm definitely a cuddle person, so that was important in my research of species of parrots, when I was choosing.

IRN are stunning, some can be excellent talkers, but most don't want petting, still want to be on shoulder or maybe even give a kiss. Not raised right and tamed to hand , can hsve a huge fear of hands. SilverSage has excellent articles on her web page!!! She is a member here and a breeder. So go through and read her articles!!
She breeds IRN, green cheeks, and cockatiels.
Home - Silver Sage Aviaries

This links to her article on finding the right seller.
FINDING THE RIGHT SELLER - Silver Sage Aviaries

Laura brings a great point! I have cuddly and more isolationist species, love and respect them all. But I strongly prefer tactile interaction, nothing for me like a cockatoo!!

Laurasea- you know I respect you and this complaint isn't about what you said in general, it's about word-choice-


I just have to comment on "cuddles"-- while some like being touched more than others, this term, "cuddle" really gets to me. A bird (like a U2) is often sold on the basis of this frustrating phrase and it is often that very trait that leads to their undoing. Adult parrots (and young ones, for training purposes--babies are the exception) should be petted on the head and neck only (excluding medical necessities which merit more touching). A bird that wants to be touched and held all the time can become very frustrated when you don't provide that, but when you do, you trigger hormones and broadcast yourself as a sexually available mate.. but one who cannot truly be with them in that way....You see people who say, "my bird let me cuddle it and was the sweetest, but now he screams, plucks and won't let my wife come into the room."....That is what cuddles can do. It is a balancing act, but if an ad for a species describes that species as "cuddly" beware of the seller's motives and what that implies long-term when said bird is taken from the people it is bonded with or when it reaches sexual maturity and that touching +expectations become inappropriate and unsustainable. At a species level, it is mating related and at an individual level, it usually is as well...


It's trickier to have a bird that likes to be touched a lot because then you have to use all of your will power not to give in and snuggle, knowing that no matter how cute it seems, it is not healthy for your bird.


You should not cuddle birds and when one wants to, saying no is VERY hard, because to humans, it seems innocent...it isn't entirely.

Not all birds respond to cuddles in every setting with rush of destructive hormones, leading to unwanted/destructive behaviors. Highly dependent on the individual, species, temperament, and methods of interaction.

I've cuddled three species of cockatoos, (Goffins, Moluccan, Citron) Timneh Greys, two types of Macaws, (Greenwing, Blue & Gold) Eclectus, and Amazons without resultant sexual confusion and subsidiary behavioral distortions.

My 35 years of living with parrots have taught reverence, caution, and deliberative analysis of cause and effect. I honestly cannot identify behavioral issues with my flock as consequence of inappropriate cuddling. Not to say it does not and cannot occur, simply beware rigid, unyielding stereotypes.

True, but it also depends on the person doing the cuddling (as a cuddle from one is not the same as a cuddle from another), length of cuddles, age of bird, environment, presence or lack of other birds, level of bonding, number of humans in a home, etc etc...It's a fact that certain touching is sexual to them (even if you don't notice a change in your bird)...These changes can happen within days or years, but it's cited frequently by avian vets etc

Precisely why handling generalizations are helpful to newcomers, obdurate prohibitions are stifling. Touching a bird around cloaca or belly regions inappropriate and stimulating, other zones such as wings or back highly individual. Fact is not every bird is perpetually hormonal and aroused.

I'd like to be hands-on in the sense of giving (head and neck) scritches, playing, and training. A bird that likes to watch us go about our activities while sitting on our shoulder/or nearby would be lovely, as well. Cuddling is of course, nice, but by no means necessary. And from what you've all said, it's probably not the best thing for someone inexperienced like myself to do.

So long as the bird is willing to be touched (to an extent) and is curious, that's personally enough for me!

Sluiceaway,
You can see we are a great group, very passionate about parrots!

So when you decide to get a parrot, you hsve a whole new family here!! And you will never run out of new things to learn or new ideas to try!

I learned tge importance having a scales weight checks, sprouts, and yogurt here!@ to name just a few!

I'm glad you're all so passionate! It means I came to the right forum!

 

[noodles123]

Some cockatiels like to be touched more than other birds, but again, you have to be super careful with hormones (these guys are the cool/more easy-going relatives of cockatoos, and cockatoos have some intense hormones)...but all birds will bite etc if things move too fast or if you miss their cues.



The "sit on a perch and watch" thing is SUPER tough...I grew up with a grey that was SORT OF like that, but it's not really anything to bank on. Additionally, while no species is guaranteed to like contact, the stereotype of greys is somewhat less tactile, but again, it just depends...Ours loved my uncle the most and would let him do a lot (the rest of us, NOPE-- not until she was much older..as in 30).


I would not bank on any bird just sitting on a perch etc-- You have to station train and that is not fool-proof.

 

[Laurasea]

I PM you with some species info. Hopefully you could read, even tho you might not be able to reply yet.

Ps Noodles your message box is full again, social butterfly!

I'm excited to see where your parrot journey takes you! You are already ahead if myself when I git my first parrot over 20 years ago!! Which all your research and joining the forum.

You can totally cuddle. Its just back petting, or belly petting that is a big trigger. Head scratches, beak rubs usually so wonderful. I kiss mine on the head or beak and rub their bent heads that rgey do when begging for a rub.

 

[noodles123]

I PM you with some species info. Hopefully you could read, even tho you might not be able to reply yet.

Ps Noodles your message box is full again, social butterfly!

I'm excited to see where your parrot journey takes you! You are already ahead if myself when I git my first parrot over 20 years ago!! Which all your research and joining the forum.

You can totally cuddle. Its just back petting, or belly petting that is a big trigger. Head scratches, beak rubs usually so wonderful. I kiss mine on the head or beak and rub their bent heads that rgey do when begging for a rub.

LOL- thank you Laurasea!

 

[Scott]

Turns out my vet is not Avian Certified! My mom seems less concerned with this because of how passionate our vet is, but I'm not too sure.
How important is it to be certified versus not, and if so, any advice on convincing her?

Depends on the situation and experience of your "exotic" vet. Avian certified vets receive specific education and training, purchase specialized equipment, have in-house pharmacies stocked with appropriate meds. On the continuum of quality, there are "exotic" vets more capable than the least qualified certified avian practitioner. Ideally, your family vet can manage most issues, has the knowledge and integrity to recognize limitations, refer to specialty practice if needed. Many meds prescribed for birds are commonly used with mammals and widely available.

 

[sluiceway]

Some cockatiels like to be touched more than other birds, but again, you have to be super careful with hormones (these guys are the cool/more easy-going relatives of cockatoos, and cockatoos have some intense hormones)...but all birds will bite etc if things move too fast or if you miss their cues.



The "sit on a perch and watch" thing is SUPER tough...I grew up with a grey that was SORT OF like that, but it's not really anything to bank on. Additionally, while no species is guaranteed to like contact, the stereotype of greys is somewhat less tactile, but again, it just depends...Ours loved my uncle the most and would let him do a lot (the rest of us, NOPE-- not until she was much older..as in 30).


I would not bank on any bird just sitting on a perch etc-- You have to station train and that is not fool-proof.

I PM you with some species info. Hopefully you could read, even tho you might not be able to reply yet.

Ps Noodles your message box is full again, social butterfly!

I'm excited to see where your parrot journey takes you! You are already ahead if myself when I git my first parrot over 20 years ago!! Which all your research and joining the forum.

You can totally cuddle. Its just back petting, or belly petting that is a big trigger. Head scratches, beak rubs usually so wonderful. I kiss mine on the head or beak and rub their bent heads that rgey do when begging for a rub.

Depends on the situation and experience of your "exotic" vet. Avian certified vets receive specific education and training, purchase specialized equipment, have in-house pharmacies stocked with appropriate meds. On the continuum of quality, there are "exotic" vets more capable than the least qualified certified avian practitioner. Ideally, your family vet can manage most issues, has the knowledge and integrity to recognize limitations, refer to specialty practice if needed. Many meds prescribed for birds are commonly used with mammals and widely available.

Part of the joy of caring for an animal for me is learning their behavior, so thank you for the info! Yeah, hormones will definitely have to be something I watch out for/be sure I react properly to.
And thank you, Laurasea, for the DM. I can't reply yet but the info is greatly appreciated!

Cute! Yeah, a lot of what I've read on here says to avoid back/belly touching. That doesn't really bother me to be honest, since if I want to cuddle like that I have our rabbits.

I'll have to look into what our vet uses and the equipment there the next time our buns go (they go monthly for wellness checkups--since one has GI issues and the other was adopted with an unknown history).

I've been looking into local bird rescues, since I think getting an adult is probably better for us. Before I start reaching out to them to see and interact with their birds, I have a few questions if it's not too much trouble.

Is it possible to house a bird outside of the hub of the house since I'm consistently home all day? Or would that be stressful?
I mean, would having the cage and setup in my room and getting the bird out whenever I can in the rest of the house be appropriate or not? I'm fine bird-proofing (I intended to animal-proof my room anyways) and setting up play areas in my rooms, I'm just wondering if being there most of the time and not in the living room where they could watch us would be detrimental to the bird's health or not.
Another worry is that the living room, where we mainly congregate when we're all home, has a lot of bunny fur in it.

 

[Laurasea]

Most parrots want to part of all the activities, they are flock and social creatures. If your wanted to set up cage in your room, but have them out with you and family at play stations . But staying in your room by themselves, would make them unhappy.

I have found what works for me wonderfully. And that is useing ceiling hooks, and fishing line rated fir 25 or 50 pounds i can't remember, then attach to big spiral ropes perhes, or hoops, or swings. I attach stuff to shred chew ext to them. Some I have attached food and water dishes to. This freed up floor space, gives them their " furniture " is way less expensive than this big floor play stands, and lots if fun for the burds. Mine are flighted, abd move between their areas. A couple will twist and sway a little when they land on them sbd tgey really like that, others I have made more stable . One I made like a jungle gym in the air, parrots can be very money like in how they love to climb, dangle, jump.

I feel I made you over worried about bunnies. I'm going to ask my avain vet what she thinks.

BTW we are often the doom club here lol. Because so many sources of information on parrots only give the postive, oh so sunny, incomplete information. And parrots are social flying primates, fragile, messy, ect , and as our current topics suggest have hormonal times, some birds handle it and you hardly notice. ( most of mine have fallen into thst, so far anyway. ) Some are more vocal, some are moody frustrated and very vocal and might become territorial abd aggressive. One of mine was a screaming mad mess near his cage during breeding season.

 

[Laurasea]

Ok I heard back from my vet. Yes there is risk but likely will not be a problem. Recommend lots of hand washing, keeping burd stuff clean. Many people have other pets that can carry Pasteurella, and have no problems. She would not let that stop you from getting a parrot. A good habit of washing your hands between species.

My mom was asking why I go through do much hand soap lol. As during tge pandemic it was hard to get a hold of at times and I was always asking them to get me some . Finally she was like what is going on at your house??? I explained I always wash my hands before touching the parrots or after touching the dogs. She understood, but said her and my dad had many laughs trying to figure out how I was going through 3 times the amount of hand soap they were!

And for Christmas they gave me a box of hand soap as a joke. Ha I told them I was thrilled to get it@!