Choosing a Grey.

[Allan Gibbs]

Here's the situation. I'm visiting my parents in Phoenix, Arizona and the local pet store has 3 month old African Greys that are for sale. These babies are still young and being bottle feed. I don't have experience with baby birds but the idea of hand feeding, bonding, and training an African Grey from a young age interest me. Any thoughts or suggestions? Is 3 months too soon to sell an African Grey? Thanks.

Oh, here's a link to the store. They even have a Tucan. I stopped by yesterday and the Amazon's screaming in concert. I came out with temporary deafness.

Cage World Exotic Birds

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Ironically, my wife (who's not a bird person) fell in love with a Cockatoo who said to my wife, "Pretty Girl, Pretty Girl." My wife never had a bird talk to her before but I had to tell her the Cockatoo was actually referring to itself and not her (my wife).

 

[willist]

My first bird was a 5 week old African Grey, he's now 17 years old, since then I've hand raised a Goffins Cockatoo, and a Greenwing Macaw. I think hand raising a baby bird is the most rewarding part of bird keeping, although its not for everyone. I doubt the store that you mentioned would sell you an unweaned bird, that would be very unusual. I got all my babies directly from breeders. To answer your question 3 months is definitely not too young at least in my opinion. You'll find most people would disagree with me about hand raising baby birds.

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Actually, the store did confirm they'd sell an unweaned bird for the same price as their older birds. I've been doing some research about this and found some interesting issues about stores selling unweaned birds to the public.

The other choices are two 1 year old CAGs that aren't very friendly -which probably means they weren't hand raised?

So I'm not sure if I want to buy from this store but I still had some questions on unweaned birds:

1) What temperature should thier formulas be to avoid a burned crop?

2) How frequently do they need to be feed and watered

3) Is there any trick to unweaning from formula to a variety of food?

Thank you.

 

[_Cass_]

Young and Weaning
Baby Bird Weaning Tips
Weaning Baby Parrots
Weaning Baby parrots

Hope this helped

-Cass

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Thank you! Those are really helpful. My searches were specifically for African Greys which is why I didn't have much luck.

 

[Spiritbird]

From my understanding the hand feeding of baby birds needs a very experienced person. There are many potential complications. If I were you I would try to find a professional hand feeder near you and learn from that person.

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Yes, you're right. There issues like proper temperature, making sure the formula doesn't go into the air way (there's a term for that), and a few other things I've found.

I decided not to get an Grey from that store -at least for now. The choices were either bird that needed to be bottle feed and weaned or birds who were a bit aggressive. I was told they by one person that they were young and still trying to figure things out - but why would they be like that if they were hand feed like the other ones they had for sale? Another sale person told me they just got them. So, I didn't think either of the two choices were a good one.

 

[Spiritbird]

AG If you are really wanting a well adjusted hand fed grey I can refer you to a renound breeder who is in Fla. She breeds them and then places the chicks with a certified hand feeder in various states to feed them until they are old enough and weined for sale. Just send me a PM and I will respond.

 

[Allan Gibbs]

AG If you are really wanting a well adjusted hand fed grey I can refer you to a renound breeder who is in Fla. She breeds them and then places the chicks with a certified hand feeder in various states to feed them until they are old enough and weined for sale. Just send me a PM and I will respond.

Hi Spiritbird. Sorry, I missed your last comment until tonight. I'm kind of sold on the "unfortunate CAG" one of the pet stores I visited. I don't really want to give them business - but I feel sorry for this poor bird.

I found another "Avian Resource Center" (they don't want to be called a pet store) called Parrots Naturally* in Los Angeles and I like their approach to selling their birds. They have a female CAG that just ended the weaning process and will be available in about two weeks. I like their approach because they will not sell a bird until a few weeks after it's been weaned -which is the opposite of the store I saw in Phoenix, Arizona.

Their pricing is really good too: $1,000 vs. the $1200-$1350 their competitors are charging, however, I would need to go through a screening process before they'd sell me a bird -just to make sure it's going to a good home and that I know what I'm doing.

Logically, the young CAG from Parrots Naturally is the most logical choice but I do feel sorry for the CAG at that pet store. I guess it depends if I can spot and health or psychological issue with "the unfortunate one" tomorrow.

*Parrots Naturally: L.A.'s Premier Bird Store

PS: Thank you for all your help in searching for the right Grey. I really appreciate it.

 

[antoinette]

Read through all the above posts, sure is a tough decision.
I would be so confused, which one to take and from where.
SB has given fantastic suggestion and advise.
Good luck

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Thanks for the support. I'm so excited I can't sleep.

 

[antoinette]

Bet that you can't sleep at all.
No matter how old, or how long you have had a bird for, the excitement never goes away........
When teaching Mishka a new word or sentences and tricks, it plays on my mind that night. The next morning, I can't wait to uncover her. Then the games begin........
Try sleep .........

 

[Spiritbird]

One more pearl of wisdom. A grey should be allowed to fledge before the first wing clip right around the weining time. It is very important for the confidence of the bird. All the research I did on greys validated this point. Enjoy the bonding.

 

[jacarual]

The place you're thinking of does have the better options by only selling when it's weaned. What is the price for the unfortunate one? Have you offered them a lower price that you are willing to pay? Good luck to you!

 

[Allan Gibbs]

The place you're thinking of does have the better options by only selling when it's weaned. What is the price for the unfortunate one? Have you offered them a lower price that you are willing to pay? Good luck to you!

Well, it's been a long day.

I went to the store that's offering a 3 month old CAG that will be fully weaned and socialized in a week. There was a possibility that I could have taken the home today but the owner wanted to meet me first. After about a good 45 minutes, they asked me to come back next week. They didn't want me to take the bird home today because "it's tramatic for the bird" and they wanted me to come back a few times to the store to bond with it. The problem is this store was about 30 miles away (about an hour with Los Angeles' weekEND traffic). I decided to pass on this bird because I know it's going to go to a good home. That store will ensure it.

I then traveled across the city to the store where the unfortunate one was. Turns out his name is Moe and well, I bought him from $950 and also got a large cage that has the potential to hold both Moe and my Sun Conures. Just as a reference, the first store said they would sell her for $1,000 but the pricing board at the store listed $1,200. I'm not sure how much it would be after the "bonding sessions."

So, right now, Moe is getting use to his new environment. The store told me he was a good bird and they've had him since he was a baby. I think they were really sad to see him go. The one warning they gave is that he's very protective of his cage. And yes, it's true. I got nipped about three times making fine tuning adjustments to his cage and giving him some food. He actually drew a little blood too. I've basically left him alone for now (which he should be) with the cage door open so he can explore his area himself. In the last few minutes, he's calmed down and will "step up"......but I'm still a little cautious of him. I know it will take a few days for him to begin to adjust to the new environment and about 3 months for him to feel at home. Ironically, when he's away from his cage, he's fine.

And yes, I'm a little scare of him because, until Moe, the Sun Conures where the biggest birds I've ever handled.

 

[Spiritbird]

Do you have them in different rooms? You should quarantine the new bird for a month at least. If you are feeling any fear at all of the new bird he will be able to tell and bite you all the more. Just take deep breaths and relax before approaching him. Are you going to change his name? My bird is a bit cage agressive also and I put a perch on the inside of the door so that I can open the door when she is on the perch and the biting will not happen. Keep us posted.

 

[Allan Gibbs]

Do you have them in different rooms? You should quarantine the new bird for a month at least. If you are feeling any fear at all of the new bird he will be able to tell and bite you all the more. Just take deep breaths and relax before approaching him. Are you going to change his name? My bird is a bit cage agressive also and I put a perch on the inside of the door so that I can open the door when she is on the perch and the biting will not happen. Keep us posted.

There's still in separate cages but I don't have the space for separate rooms with out my wife saying, "You're making this place into a zoo!" So, I need to consider the flock leader.

Also, is it too late to change his name? I don't really like "Moe" but I think he may be use to hearing it.

Actually, the first bite was because I let him bite me on my pointer finger. I thought, like young birds do, he was exploring the world with his beak. I didn't think he'd draw blood. I then my reaction to that gave him the impression biting makes the hand go away.

So, I remembers seeing some YouTube videos on bird biting and one worked pretty well. I beleive it's from Chet Womack with My-bird tips.com. (I'd post a video but my work blocks YouTube). He demostrated pointing or curling your fingers towards your wrist so that what's exposed is the back of your fist. It makes biting harding because the flat surface of the back fist make it harder for the beak to pierce the skin. This teaches the bird that the hand isn't going away. One thing I noticed is that it looks like a larger birds beak (think of the crane fist for martial arts practioners). I tried it this morning and it worked well. After a few attempted bites, I think Moe realized I was just giving him food and water and calmed down and let me finish the morning set up.

So, does it take about 3 days for the intial stages of the bird's anxiety ("okay, he's not going to eat me") to subside and about 3 weeks for a bird to know the "routine" and about 3 months until the bird feels like they're part of the flock?

 

[Spiritbird]

You know every bird is different. If Mo is not used to people touching him, not used to foraging and toys, normal household sounds and a proper diet then it may take several months. The old saying haste makes waste may apply here. Good luck and thanks for keeping us posted.

 

[Allan Gibbs]

It's been a few days since Moe has come home and things are working out pretty well.

I did have several bites on day one fine tuning the cage. The pet store said Moe was very friendly outside the cage but very territoral inside. I'm glad to say he's just starting to overcome that. He will let me put food and water in the cage or make rearrangements without becoming agressive. For the past few days, he would walk away from my hand when trying to get him to "step up." And that was fine, I left him alone. As of last night and this morning, he's willing to step up -even when in his cage.

I think he's fighting his natural fear and instinct to bite inside the cage because he did bite me today. He was eating while sitting on top of his side-mounted food bowl and I added some food very close to him and hit bit me. I admit that I got bit because I was testing how close he would let me get -especially while eating. I learn with dogs you never interrupt them when eating so I supect it's the same with birds. I gave him a little tap on the beak and said, "No" and continued to add some lettuce and he refrained from biting.

Once thing I do notice is his appetite. In the pet store, they primarily gave his seeds and apples once in awhile. Moe's did is now primarily apple, carrots, and lettuce and supplemented with seeds and peanuts. He seems to have a really healthly appetite and seems to spend a lot of time eatting. I guess he likes the menu. I did notice that after a few feeding on day 2, his fear of me when down and now he knows him I come home he's going to eat.

I've spend some time on Tuesday and Wednesday, having Moe perch on my hand and take him outside to the patio. Just so he doesn't get use to being in the cage - or he can get use to NOT being in a cage.

I don't think Moe can talk although he does whistle when he see me -and it's becoming more frequent. But on Tuesday night (day 3), I had the light off and was on the computer when I heard a "hello" in a swakey voice. He's never repeated that. One store told me that parrots can talk - when they want to. Maybe he'll say something else as time goes by.