Blue Front Amazon

[SparkitusRex]

I have had an Orange Wing male Amazon named Picasso for about six months who is a dream. He complains a lot and sometimes very loudly, but he has never ever bitten me, he just nibbles. I even hold him without a towel when we have his nails and wings done, and he's really mad, and doesn't bite. He was a rescue that was ignored, and didn't take much work to get to be hand friendly.

Now, however... comes the hard one. I just acquired a Blue Front Amazon (also male) as a rescue, some guy just trying to get rid of the bird. Apparently he had four female Amazons and this male was getting into breeding mode and getting progressively more aggressive, and setting off the females as well. So this boy, I named him Van Gogh, well... he seems to have come from an interesting background.

So basically I have a couple questions.
When I went to pick him up, he wouldn't allow anyone to pick him up, but you could pick him up with a stick. He will let you scratch his head, pet his back, the whole shebang, but the moment I stuck my hand in front of his feet, he bit me. Really really hard, much harder than Picasso ever did, and to boot he wouldn't let go at first when I pulled my hand back. So I figured maybe he just needs some working with. To be honest, even if he is NEVER hand tame, I still love him. I would like to have a friendly bird but if not, I can admire from afar.
So when we got him home, well here's where it gets interesting... he swears like a sailor. He argues with himself in different voices that sounds like mimicking people fighting (we have a low stress household, don't ever fight and certainly not in front of the bird). He seems to be getting better in the week that we've had him; yelling less and whatnot. However, he is still using a lot of profane language with people who walk by the cage.

So my questions are basically, what would I do to correct not biting hands? He doesn't ever bite the stick. Just hands. And I have to admit, I know it hinders progress, but I'm a little afraid of him. If I wear a glove, he's terrified. So that is not an option. It seems like he's not aggressive based, but fear based biting.
Also how would I (possibly try to) correct some of the foul (no pun intended) language?
He seems to be calming down, as I said we're a low stress household, also he is away from the females so he seems to be doing the breeding behaviors much less often (foot kicking? What is that about??).
Also, sometimes when he's in his cage if I talk to him he'll start running in circles on his perch, back and forth. Is this a sign of a STRESSED bird, or one who is just having fun?
He doesn't seem to be plucking. He has taken a few more feathers than he should have out from under his wings, but that seemed to be an immediate thing after we moved him to our house and he doesn't seem to be doing it anymore.

Sorry for the long post, and thank you for any answers you can give regarding my sailor bird...

Edit: Also to note, right now Picasso and Van Gogh don't seem to particularly LIKE each other, but we have a wrought iron playstand that follows me around the house that they hang out together on. They don't fight, they just kinda ignore each other. So there's no stress there. I've even heard them whistling at each other.

Edit again: Picasso and Van Gogh are both said to be somewhere between 2 and 5. So adults, but not really older birds. Also, granted, this is what people on craigslist said. I'm sure they'd never lie...

 

[mtdoramike]

Where are you located may I ask?

 

[SparkitusRex]

I am in the Orlando, FL area.

 

[mtdoramike]

I thought so, because I saw that same Craigslist ad for the Blue Front Amazon in which they specifically said the bird cussed up a blue streak. Welllll I might have embelished it a little. But if not mistaken it was in the ad. I think the seller said it was 3 years old, but not 100% sure on that.

I've been looking for a Blue Front Amazon myself and that is why I kind of remember seeing the ad. I was really tempted when I read it, but I'm going on vacation for a few weeks shortly so I didn't want to have to try and find boarding for a second bird until I get back.

I'm located in Mt. Dora, which is about 25 miles north of the northern most part of Orlando. Now as far as the cussing, I think your stuck with that. Once a bird learns a word or a phrase, it's with them for a long, long time. So if you host church chior rehersals at your home, your bird will be teaching them all kinds of new language.

Folks are really irresponsible when it comes to owning a bird like an Amazon that will pick up words in a heart beat. It's usually words most emphasized during conversations that they hear. Then again, some people actually teach them bad words and then later re-home them. Most people wouldn't want a foul mouthed bird, but to me it's something you have to tollerate if you want to keep the bird. Kind of like a 3 legged dog, you wouldn't shoot the dog because it only has three legs.

I would suggest sticking a sign on the front of the cage that says "WARNING, FOUL MOUTHED BIRD". Then if someone asks, tell them it was a rescue from a bar down at the docks hahahahahaha. Now had it been my bird, my wife would have said "Yep, that bird has been hangin around you WAY to much."


MIke

 

[SparkitusRex]

I don't know if this was the same bird, or maybe he advertised him differently, because he never said anything about the language on the ad I saw, and when I went to pick him up the bird was talking but the guy's house was really loud. When I asked what the bird was saying, he said he didn't know and never really listened to the bird. Which I would have believed only because Picasso's extent of talking is "hello" and even at that it's garbled. So I figured maybe this bird was the same.

I don't mind his vulgarity, I just would eventually like to correct it if I CAN. In the meantime/longrun, whatever happens to be the case, I find it hilarious. I just wonder how it'll be if I ever have children... since Amazons live... forever... lol.

Like I said, he seems to be yelling less as the stress reduces in his environment. First couple days we were woken up at 7am by a screaming match with himself. I haven't heard him screaming at himself in a couple days. So it seems to be mildly improving.

 

[mtdoramike]

Was this the ad where the guy was going into surgery on his back and could take care of the bird anymore, but yet had a couple of female Amazons, which was causing the newer one to become aggressive?

I also saw another Blue Front that the guy kept listing and relisting and finally dropped the price down to like $275.00 I think. If not mistaken, this is the one with a few cuss words, but not sure, it's been a bit since I saw the ads.

 

[SparkitusRex]

Well I guess that shows how long he was trying to sell the bird... I picked him up for 250, and it made mention of everything else you said but not the cursing. I guess he figured that wasn't a selling point.

 

[mtdoramike]

He started out at $375.00

 

[Lesleybird]

Hi, Amazons are a challenge because their bite is worse than a larger parrot's bite. I know, I have three amazons, two large cockatoos and a new macaw and the amazons bite is the worst. What the owner at one of my favorite bird shops said is that she will wrap her arm and hand several times around with a thick towel to get a biting bird to step up out of the cage. I think that you could let it get used to this and gradually get it to stand on your arm in time.

Get the best selling parrot behavior book "Guide to a Well Behaved Parrot" by Mattie Sue Athan. She is a parrot behavior consultant and I have used her books to train all of my parrots to behave. With the amazon let him see you say step up to the other amazon on the stand and see you giving it treats and attention to the other bird. If it is fear that is making the bird bite then you may be able to get it to go stop biting in time. You do not know if there has been abuse in the first home that gave it a reason to fear the human hand. Do you know if it was ever handled before? There is something that Mattie Sue uses in her book called the wobble technique for training parrots not to bite the hands/arms. If a parrot bites hard you need to swiftly pull your arm away so that the bird drops to the ground, if the reaching for the hand/arm with the beak a simple wobble of the arm will help it to learn, but you need to get the book to do it right.

As for the bad language, ignore the bird when it talks bad. This means don't even say "bad bird" because this is giving the bird attention when it speaks foul. Reinforce good language by turning to the bird and repeating the same words or say good bird, or give it a treat. Give it attention for the good and don't give any attention for the bad. Don't even look at the bird when it is talking bad, don't look at it or speak to it until it says something acceptable. Good luck, Lesley

 

[ScottinVentura]

I would say that at some point in the past, your new bird learned to fear hands and it'll take a while - and a lot of patience - to get him past it.

If it was me, I'd start by just getting him used to my hand. Don't try to pick him up, just put it on the perch near him. No fast, threatening moves, just rest it there, as close as he'll tolerate without lunging. Gradually move it closer over time to desensitize him to your hand being there. Gradually move it close enough that you can touch and stroke his toes. Let him know there's nothing threatening there.

A friend of mine had a parrot that wouldn't step up on hands, but always stepped up on a stick and he wanted me to help train his bird. It turned out his bird was fine, it was the owner who had to be trained. I watched him try to pick up the bird, and the bird started to step up, doing what Boo does all the time - he grabbed the owner's thumb to steady himself as he stepped up. The owner freaked and pulled his hand away. The bird had already started to shift his weight and so he was stepping onto nothing. Enough times like this, and the bird learned his owner's hand was just a tease and wasn't stable enough to step onto. It took time before the bird trusted him again, but he gradually learned that the owner wouldn't pull his hand away (and it took a few bites) and his hand would stay steady and not knock the bird off center. Within a few weeks, he was stepping up like a pro, and the owner didn't think he was going to be bitten every time the bird put his beak around a finger. Sometimes they're just handy things to hold onto, like a branch would be.

 

[Conurekidd]

Bfa have the the biggest mood swing iv experienced.

All advise given is everything I as going to say. So I won't take up space lol.
But will say becarful for the amazon tricks. Sam will act to step up just to latch his death grip to my finger. Then he pulls in the bite. But I think he's playin sometimes too because one time he just hung upside down from my finger and was nibbling. But last time I let Sam nibble on me and he went and chomped it. Hurt so bad.

Time and paitents is the key to a trusting amazon.

 

[lordburrito]

that's right Conurekidd!!! I always know, when my blue front is streching her foot to bite me (or play with my fingers... ) ... or to step up... All you need is time an patience to get to know your birds body language... it's so much easier then...