At what age do I clip my Amazon's wings?

[sandra67]

I have a 16 week amazon, and he is getting into everything now. He won't stay still on the top of his cage. He want to fly around and sit on paintings I have which I honestly can't allow.

I not only wouldn't want poop everywhere, I have 4 dogs and every time the Parrot flies, the dogs do crazy chasing him.

I am so waiting for the day I can cut his wings.

He is fully weaned now, maybe asks for a feeding now and then but when I do give him formula, he really eats it on its own. No syringe anymore.

 

[Flboy]

I don't have your answer. But clipped or not your dogs will eventually catch your baby!

 

[JerseyWendy]

I agree with David whole-heartedly! (Flboy)

It will be up to you to teach and train your Amazon now that he is fully flighted. Yes, it will be time consuming. Yes, it will be taxing. Yes, it may become frustrating, but training is of THE utmost importance.

More importantly: Train your dogs that your bird is off limits. (Dogs are much easier to train that birds, I promise ) If you can't train the dogs, always make sure they are in a different room when your Amazon is out, or this is an accident waiting to happen. An accident with a very unhappy ending that is.

As long as your bird is flighted he has a chance of getting away from your dogs, but once he is clipped, he will be an open and easy target.

This is an extremely controversial topic, and I'm always preaching that clipping is a personal choice (which it is), however, in your case I wouldn't even dream of suggesting to clip your bird because you openly stated your dogs chase him.

 

[Kiwibird]

If at all possible, keep him flighted! If you really have weighed all the risks and benefits and feel clipping is best, wait until he has learned to fly competently FIRST. You may not always be in the same situation in the future and may want to flight him later on. Our amazon has (to our knowledge, we adopted him as an adult bird) been clipped since his flight feathers came in and never learned to fly. We tried to teach him at one point, but he has no concept of flight and it was frustrating and traumatizing for an adult bird to try to learn. We tried 3 different methods but still failed to teach him how despite our best efforts. We ultimately clipped him again since it's what he knows and is perfectly fine with being.

If they don't learn as a baby, it can be difficult or impossible for them to learn as an adult. If they learn as a baby, are clipped and then flighted again later on, it's like riding a bicycle and something they never forget Please at least teach him to fly before considering clipping and keep his out of cage time safe by keeping "other animals" out of the room.

 

[KevH]

He's a bird why would u want to take that away from him at least if he's flight end he has a chance to get away from ur dogs

 

[Aquila]

If you're adamant about clipping your bird's wings, as you don't like him perching on high up objects, consider a partial clip. This is a little wing diagram. Consider only clipping the first two or three feathers, so your bird can maintain flight still, but not quite reach up as high. Though this didn't work very well for my cockatiel, Amazons are much heavier birds. You don't want to reduce their flight capacity too much because a big heavy "thud" to the ground can cause severe injury.

My best advice is to only clip one feather off each wing at a time AFTER your bird learns to fly completely, rather than a drastic change. All of my birds are flighted, and it's how I believe they should be, but I can't speak for everyone, all I can say is you need to make an educated decision.

Weigh the risks with the potential benefits. But more importantly, you do need to train your bird either way, it goes much further than a quick solution of wing clipping.

 

[Kiwibird]

If you're adamant about clipping your bird's wings, as you don't like him perching on high up objects, consider a partial clip. This is a little wing diagram.

I clip about 4-5 on Kiwi (I think the wing of a zon has a few more feathers than that chart) and take off about half the feather. Just enough if for some reason he ever did try to take flight he would go down instead of up but not so much he would drop like a rock (not that in 7 years he's ever attempted/shown an interest in trying to fly). Ideally, you should take the ability to get lift away, not clip the wings so drastically they literally have no control/can't even glide. You should also ALWAYS clip the same number of feathers evenly on both wings. NEVER clip just one wing or one wing more than the other.

 

[sandra67]

Thanks for all your advice. However, let me clear something up. My dogs are never inside the house when I let the Ricco ( Amazon) out unless, I am holding him.

They are really obedient and do stop on command, which is a great plus.

Regardless on whether or not I have dogs, I can't have a bird flying and pooping everywhere, much less damaging the paintings and furniture. That is definetly a NO NO.

My gray was out of his cage with my dogs around, they didn't seem to mind him since he mostly stayed on top of his cage,

I do have to slowly introduce them and train teach them they need to get along.

Yes, I do agree , dogs are much easier to train than birds

 

[sandra67]

Oh, this bird does know how to fly now…it goes past us and it actually messes up the hair ..hahaha

 

[Parrotlover418]

The answer is never.
Birds can be potty trained, as well as trained not to chew on furniture. Provide destructible toys for your bird to chew on instead of the furniture. Wing clipping is bad for all parrots, but it's especially bad for amazons because they are prone to obesity if they can't get exercise by flying. Wing trimming is an outdated practice that is declining as people learn that it causes more harm than benefits. Polls on birdchannel.com showed that in 2008, 40% of bird owners always kept their pets' wings clipped, but now only 26% do. Here is an anti wing-clipping article I found that I think makes a lot of good points: Aubrie's Animals

 

[RavensGryf]

The answer is never.
Birds can be potty trained, as well as trained not to chew on furniture. Provide destructible toys for your bird to chew on instead of the furniture. Wing clipping is bad for all parrots, but it's especially bad for amazons because they are prone to obesity if they can't get exercise by flying. Wing trimming is an outdated practice that is declining as people learn that it causes more harm than benefits. Polls on birdchannel.com showed that in 2008, 40% of bird owners always kept their pets' wings clipped, but now only 26% do. Here is an anti wing-clipping article I found that I think makes a lot of good points: Aubrie's Animals

This sort of black and white, cut and dried take on this very controversial topic is what has caused threads like this to get shut down and closed.

The statistics mean nothing. That is just a small sample of bird owning population who are online savvy with bird groups. I see lines out the door at the bird store waiting to get grooming and wing clips done, and I know the vets do it all the time. Regardless... my point is, Please be careful to consider that others might have an entirely different individual situation than you. Others have already mentioned they clip for certain reasons. Enough other people I know of here give a light clip, even though it might not be mentioned. By stating it black and white, you may be insulting fellow long time members. Thanks.

 

[sandra67]

oops, I was unaware this was a touchy subject. I personally think that clipping/trimming is for the bird's best safety. It avoid him from flying away, and hurting himself by bumping into walls and windows, but, like I said, that is my personal opinion, and I do respect the other's way of caring for their pets.

I do get it done at the vet's office and I do appreciate your feedback !!

 

[JerseyWendy]

I totally agree with you, Julie! Let me 'gently' remind everyone that wing clipping is a PERSONAL CHOICE, and nobody is to be condemned, talked down to, belittled, or made feel badly about him or herself.

Condescending remarks WILL be removed.

 

[Bandespresso]

if your bird is already a proficient flyer, I would say it is safe to give him a soft clip now. Amazons don't need a very harsh clip to keep them from flying. It is more beneficial to your bird to start with a really light clip and clip a little more if you need it so you are not going from one extreme to another. A clip that is too harsh will be really detrimental to your amazon's wellbeing. Just be aware that he will probably get into everything regardless of his ability to fly...that is the nature of a parrot LOL. Teach him boundaries while he is young so you don't have a sassy troublemaker on your hands later!! My grey has a very soft clip and thrives with it but that is my personal choice for her and my lifestyle (and due to the fact that she has balance issues and she is unable to fly even with all of her flight feathers).

 

[Hawk]

Clipping is a matter of opinion and safety. In your case Your parrot needs to go through the stages of learning to fly. It's not wise to deny them that.

That said, you need to work on training your dogs. I went through the same scenario as you, and lost one of my parrots to my dogs. I have 3 dogs. From that day on my dogs will not touch them. They are now scared to death of them. You can train a dog
not to bother the birds.

My grey and Amazon are both dare devils. They have walked around the dogs, my Grey will occasionally walk up and bite one of the dogs on the butt, then laugh as he bobs his head up and down. My Zon just boots them out of the way....funny as heck.
But all in all dogs and parrots can get along, but that said caution and supervision is always number one rule between the two.

 

[KevH]

No offence to anyone but is anyone thinking of the bird here we welcome them into our homes wings clipped and stuck in or on a cage I'm sorry but taking away something wots so natural for a bird to do is cruel if it's inconvenient coz they poop or chew well that's wot they do there's so much damage you do to a bird by clipping I suggest do some training and buy lots of toys

 

[sandra67]

Sorry Krey, I don't agree with you. My house is not a jungle, not do I attempt to be Jane by living wild and free with birds flying around and poop everywhere.

Yes, you are right. Animals belong free and to do what is natural to them, unfortunately we hunan bring them into our homes and want them to adapt to us. Just like we do with dogs, cats, rabbits, turtles, etc,

 

[Kiwibird]

Regardless on whether or not I have dogs, I can't have a bird flying and pooping everywhere, much less damaging the paintings and furniture. That is definetly a NO NO.

I clip my own bird and am in no way discouraging you from clipping your bird if you feel it is the right thing in your situation, but if you think clipping will keep him from pooping wherever, chewing stuff up and getting into all kinds of trouble, you will quickly find out it doesn't. A clipped bird will compensate for their 'disability' by quickly building different muscle groups and becoming a strong climber instead. They will just boldly climb whatever they darn well feel like instead of flying to it.

By strong climber, I mean the bird can/will climb up anything made of/covered in fabric (leaving little holes), most furniture with any kind of lip or knob, shoe racks, table/chair legs, beds ect... (sometimes taking chips/chunks out from climbing it). Mine has never flown in his entire life, yet he can (and has) climb virtually every piece of furniture we own if he *wants*, he has just been trained not to. Do not underestimate the climbing (or stealthy, sneak off in the 2 seconds your back is turned) abilities of a parrot! Removing the option of flight does not remove the option of being "naughty". He will also still poop wherever until trained not to and will chew things too, even if your right there (until trained not to). Those 'issues' can only be 'fixed' by proper training. Our bird is potty trained, no chew trained, and (after many years) is no longer caged either (and does NOT leave his area unless we move him). I assure you, despite always being clipped, he was a nightmare before he was trained. Those things take patience, effort and probably a few nibbles out of things while training, but training a bird how he should behave in your "flock" is something you'll still need to do, regardless if you do or don't clip.

Edit: I wanted to add, I do 100% understand your position of not being able/wanting to have a bird who rips things he shouldn't up and who poops all over, whatever your personal situation/reasons may be. I know some people don't mind and are homeowners who can turn the blind eye to chewed up baseboards or little green stains on the carpet. As renters, we couldn't/can't have bird related damages of any kind. Yes, parrots will be parrots, but they are intelligent beings who WANT to fit into their human flock, and that desire to fit in and behave like everyone else can be used to our advantage to train them properly and teach them what is and isn't ok. The ability to fly vs being clipped has an entirely different set of factors on which to make the decision on and (IMO) being a way to have them be, for lack of a better word, instantly "housebroken" isn't necessarily one of those factors since it's pretty irrelevant if they can fly or not whether or not they will poop everywhere and chew things.

 

[Parrotlover418]

The answer is never.
Birds can be potty trained, as well as trained not to chew on furniture. Provide destructible toys for your bird to chew on instead of the furniture. Wing clipping is bad for all parrots, but it's especially bad for amazons because they are prone to obesity if they can't get exercise by flying. Wing trimming is an outdated practice that is declining as people learn that it causes more harm than benefits. Polls on birdchannel.com showed that in 2008, 40% of bird owners always kept their pets' wings clipped, but now only 26% do. Here is an anti wing-clipping article I found that I think makes a lot of good points: Aubrie's Animals

This sort of black and white, cut and dried take on this very controversial topic is what has caused threads like this to get shut down and closed.

The statistics mean nothing. That is just a small sample of bird owning population who are online savvy with bird groups. I see lines out the door at the bird store waiting to get grooming and wing clips done, and I know the vets do it all the time. Regardless... my point is, Please be careful to consider that others might have an entirely different individual situation than you. Others have already mentioned they clip for certain reasons. Enough other people I know of here give a light clip, even though it might not be mentioned. By stating it black and white, you may be insulting fellow long time members. Thanks.

Did you even read the article? I think the article makes it clear that the benefits of clipping aren't big enough to outweigh the drawbacks, if not outright false. I know that people clip for reasons, but the article proves many common reasons invalid. If you can think of a reason that this article doesn't talk about, let me know.

 

[gracebowen]

I want to chime in here while I still can. I am a house owner so yes I can ignore the chewed trim. I let my birds fly and generally feel that they should. I did almost clip Jet my male tiel a few weeks ago. I have a female and they are on an egg. The first 2 weeks he would fly over and attack me everytime I walked by the cage. Which was basically ant time I mooved in my room.

I found wearing a hat worked just as well. He was landing on my shoulder biting my ear. Finally he quit. I guess he figured out I wasnt hurting the eggs. They used to have 2 but they ate one.

So yes there are times and situations where clipping is understandable.

Maybe its because they are so small. I dont know. One of my keets came to me with all of her primary flights cut and she still flew pretty well.