Argh - not one of my flock, but of natives. Country rocked, and somewhat conflicted.

[itchyfeet]

**Please note, images and video of dead birds in story**

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/106068860/dead-kea-aviary-like-a-pig-crate-expert-says

 

[LordTriggs]

"a bigger cage would kill them" those people should be locked up

it's clear they are abusers and are trying to hide their tracks

 

[Kiwibird]

Honestly, these people don't strike me as abusive or neglectful, they strike me as old school in their care ideas and perhaps in need of some education. I do not know enough about keas to make a judgement on the size of the enclosure they require, but for an outdoor setup and the size of the birds, it didn't look that small to me. I believe they are ground dwelling, hence a lack of perches. But the birds should have had some kind of toys or other things to do, which I did not see in the video, but it looks like they had an indoor and outdoor space of a seemingly decent size. It seems as though overzealous bureaucrats scared these poor, older birds to death after the trauma of having blood samples taken. Parrots can definitely die from stress reactions to traumatizing events. Also, they do have a point about older parrots being set in their ways, especially regarding environment. While I doubt the owners claim that a larger enclosure would have outright killed them, I could believe it would have caused them a great deal of unnecessary stress and fear if the birds were happy with and felt safe in their home of 40 some odd years. I also understand not wanting the same bureaucrats who probably killed your bird to steal their bodies and probably never return them to you so you can bury them.

 

[ChristaNL]

24m3 is not really very large for a couple of large-ish and usually very active parrots. They are used to have moutainranges at their disposal, fly a lot, climb a lot.

The kea are being killed of in the wild (in their nests) by stoats etc. in *huge* numbers (it's not just the kakapoa that they almost kill off) and with the weird climate changes they are struggling as a species anyway.
So not finding out the cause of death... is a luxury they cannot afford!


It may sound crude (talking about someones beloved pets here) but they really did the living parrot-relatives an injustice.
They could not only have figured out what killed the birds, but also how their health really was and if they were still fertile or not, if they were male&female or not... (looking at organs tells a lot more than just a bloodsample; think density of bone, individual organhealth, brainplaques etc etc)

(I had to leave D. / my second CAG/ behind at the university clinic after she passed - also for the benefit of other suffering birds who might be there after her / so yea, I know what it is like to know your best friend will be cut to little pieces after you say goodbye. But after what she went through... how could I not!?)

Somtimes the need to know (and help save the species) trumps "we need to grieve".
So no...I am not with the family on that one.

I am very sorry these beautifull birds no longer fly/ hop around.
(and yes, that probably could have been handled differently)

 

[texsize]

Very mixed emotions here.
I would not take kindly to someone coming in my home and against my will taking blood from my flock.
My mother-in-law had her parrots taken from her home by the government (Colombia) after having them for 35 years.

Were the kea being cared for in the best fashion? Maybe not, but it was what they were use to. Moving them to a new environment no matter how well intentioned might be to much for an older parrot to take. Was the stress of the blood test enough to do them in?

Unfortunately I could not make out alot of what was said in the interview because of there accent.

 

[SassiBird]

"They were at the stage of life where one bird was showing the other where the food was and where to roost."
I took it to mean that on of the birds was near blind and changing the environment would be cruel/lead to death.
Who knew best - the owners or the experts?

 

[MonicaMc]

I can't help but under if the family killed the keas because they did not want to be separated from them. After the birds had a force exam (against the wishes of the family), maybe the family thought that the next step was taking the birds away? Therefore, in their jealousy to keep them, they killed them, then refused necropsy so that no one would ever find out what caused their deaths. If the cause of death was intentional, they would probably be fined by the government.

I dunno... seems too much of a coincidence if you ask me... and these birds do fly! They've been known to fly to farmers flocks of sheep and eat the sheep alive in the middle of the night.... which has lead to many farmers shooting the birds and causing a decline in the species.

 

[LordTriggs]

I can't help but under if the family killed the keas because they did not want to be separated from them. After the birds had a force exam (against the wishes of the family), maybe the family thought that the next step was taking the birds away? Therefore, in their jealousy to keep them, they killed them, then refused necropsy so that no one would ever find out what caused their deaths. If the cause of death was intentional, they would probably be fined by the government.

I dunno... seems too much of a coincidence if you ask me... and these birds do fly! They've been known to fly to farmers flocks of sheep and eat the sheep alive in the middle of the night.... which has lead to many farmers shooting the birds and causing a decline in the species.

EXACTLY my thoughts. Even then they had experts say to them "yo your birds are stressed, bored, and exhibiting behaviors akin to parrots starting to lose their minds. Even if one of the pair had poor eye sight the other could show them where the food and water is in a new aviary much like they were already doing so. Yet the family didn't bother, they just said 'nah they happy' despite multiple people telling them the contrary.

The other thing that makes me feel it MAY be a purposeful killing of the birds is if it was because of the blood sample taken wouldn't you want to know? So you can hold those responsible to account for it. Also correct me if I'm wrong but surely if the stress of the situation killed them wouldn't that have happened while or immediately after the blood as taken? Not the next day.

I don't want to say they purposefully killed the birds out of jealousy, but I can say without a doubt these people were willfully ignorant (being informed of stuff and refusing the info because they disliked what they were told)

 

[itchyfeet]

So some of your responses cut deep! But obviously this is close to home, and I did choose to post the original story. Different lenses sometimes help us to process the information more wholesomely I guess. And on that note...for those knocking the couple for not providing the birds for necropsy, this article may be of interest...
https://www.stuff.co.nz/oddstuff/10...but-was-easily-distracted-by-womens-stockings

 

[ChristaNL]

Thank you- that wat a fun read.


And there is a *huge* difference between a necrosie to find out everything possible about health etc. and finding out your (confiscated) pet has been turned into a museumpiece...


Anyway- what is done has been done.... but I am convinced the pub-parrot had a better quality of life than the pair living isolated in a concrete corridor.


And I will never understand people who are completely closeminded when it comes to taking better care of their pets!
(I cringe in retrograde when I think back on how my first parrot& budgies were kept - we did our very, very best, and did not know any better and I still feel guilty about it!
Now we have the internet and so much more choice in exchanging ideas, ordering things from all around the world (or find local alternatives).
That your parrot has been in the same situation for 40 years does not mean it is the best place he/she could be in, it is that easy.)

 

[MonicaMc]

Joe's beak did not appear to be a normal/healthy beak, but he himself looked healthy. 45 years? Wow, that's a good long time!


Went back and watched the video about the other two and over an hour for blood work? I'm sorry, but that's ridiculous... the birds should have been sedated if it was so stressful to get bloodwork.


I know that things in New Zealand are far different than in the USA... my sister has told me that some vet offices look just like homes, and I've seen some of these, too! (I visited some years back - have pictures of keas, kakas, antipodes island parakeet, kaks, etc *loved* the pigeons, too!!!) A professional practice being done in a home. Something like that would be highly frowned upon by many here in the USA - but there is at least one vet that does it... only, it's not his home. He travels around and sets up shop in one of his client's homes and does procedures on the kitchen table. Other birds are also brought in for health checks and the like. For some people, he's the closest vet they can see - *WHEN* he travels to their area.


Thinking about how Joe was stuffed though.... ugh... I remember watching a documentary where people will have their dead animals stuffed so that they could always have them by their side. I think some people even took it too far and would have their animal killed just to become a taxidermy pet... I can't imagine having one of my own pets taxidermied... and as I attempt to see if this is still in practice I find a company that freeze-dries your pets....


If DOCs had the same plan for the two other keas, I guess I wouldn't blame the family for not giving DOCs a chance to do that...




Regardless, I have no doubt that the family loved and cared for their keas. I mean, both were thought to be around 43 years old, so maybe they were doing something right?

Reading about how their aviary was "too small" just makes me think about the multitude of *pet* parrots kept in tiny cages and their wings are clipped so they have no easy way to get rid of all of their pent up energy... thus end up displaying some abnormal behaviors.


It's a lot to think about... and either way, whatever happened, it's a sad story. Maybe it wasn't the fault of the DOCs? Maybe it wasn't the fault of the owners? Maybe, just maybe, they were poisoned which also is a likely possibility, although I don't know what they could have been poisoned by outside unless some ruthless and heartless person fed/injected them with something to cause their deaths.