Aggressive GCC Not Eating Fresh Foods

[CheekyAlfie]

Hi!

So, I am completely new to parrots. Two days ago, I got a my first one. He is a 2-3 month old green cheek conure from my local pet store (I named him Alfie). The owner had lowered the price from $600 to $200, because Alfie was an aggressive biter and no one wanted him (He was the only one of 32 remaining). Also, it might just be my inexperience, but the owner was pretty rough with him. She would reach into his cage with a towel, and just kind of smother him into the cage wall until she was able to wrap and take him out without him biting (It was for customers to see him). After seeing that, I really did want to give Alfie a good, loving, home. I decided to buy him, feeling bad for him being alone in a shop with a lot of noise and commotion. Anyway, I brought him home. The first night, I set up all his toys and his cage, put him in without much resistance, and went to sleep. He was (and still is) so quiet it scares me, since conures are known to be fairly loud. (He does seem healthy though, his eyes are clear, feet normal, feathers shiny, and poops perfect. He hasn't shown any physical signs of stress.) The next morning, my mother was changing his food, when he suddenly bit her (enough to draw blood) and somehow losing a tail feather in the process. She wasn't mad, I wasn't mad, but I knew that this was going to be a lot of work. I think Alfie's just very scared of hands, maybe because of his previous experiences with them. He will scoot away when I come near his cage, same with both of my parents. He is also refusing to eat anything but the seed mix the pet store provided. I put strawberry chunks in and a pitted cherry into his bowl (along with some of the seed mix), and he stopped eating the entire morning and a little of the afternoon until I realized he wouldn't touch it and took the fruit out. After replenshing the bowl with only seed, he ate voraciously. On one hand, I felt so bad for starving him, but on the other, I knew that I needed to get him to eat healthily. This morning, I tried with blueberry, but it also did not work. He doesn't even try to escape when I open both cage doors, and doesn't eat any treats, so I can't coax him out either. I'm sure patience will eventually do it, but for time's being, I'm just not sure how I can make him trust me enough get on a healthier diet. (He basically won't interact with me in any way physically, hiding at the back when I pass, so teaching "step up" and other taming methods are currently out of the question.)

I'm sorry for the long paragraph, but please help me. I want him to be happy and healthy.

Thank you so much.

 

[noodles123]

Does the cage not have external doors so that you don't have to reach in?

Reaching into a bird's cage before they trust you is a common way to get bitten. That is his space and he is also likely afraid of hands.

You will need to move at his pace and build trust slowly...He is super young, so it's weird that they said he was aggressive...I mean, toweling and grabbing birds is a great way to kill trust and create a bird that bites, so I am guessing that he just never had a good relationship with his care-taker and so he bit because he was being forced into scary situations.....

I have a ton of stuff to post since you are new to birds...Some of it relates to this question, other parts relate to health etc.

When you click this link, you will see a bunch of the same posts I was going to paste here, so just go to the link and read the MASSIVE posts I wrote on there in terms of things you need to know as a new bird owner. I am looking for another link to post on building trust, but do read this one for detail:
http://www.parrotforums.com/questions-answers/83478-my-new-king-parrot-scares-me.html

^^see above

Here's the one on trust: http://www.parrotforums.com/general-parrot-information/49144-tips-bonding-building-trust.html

It's normal for them to take a long time to take to new foods. You never want to cut them off from what they know, even if it isn't the healthiest, so while an all-seed diet isn't healthy, it will take time to transition him to a better diet. Sometimes birds just don't like certain foods, but it can take repeat exposure over months for them to try things or like them (if ever lol). My bird took a year to eat spinach...with multiple weekly exposures.

You will want to look at eventually weaning him to pellets and fruit/veg (more veg than fruit). That first link I posted has a section that lists unsafe foods for them (it's in one of the super-long posts of mine). In the long run, some seeds are fine, but avoid peanuts and sunflower seeds and try to get him to eat pellets instead...but again this has to be gradual. Birds are stubborn enough that some have starved rather than try something new.

If you coming near the cage is stressing him out, try to do it less often. Just let him get used to your presence in the room....like 10 feet away...I am not saying you can't walk by the cage (you should if you need to) but if you have no purpose for going over there and it is stressing himout, let him get used to you from afar. Read from a book out loud, don't get in his face...don't try to feed him by hand yet. DO allow him to see you placing special/favorite treats in his cup if there is a way to do that without stressing him. You want to associate yourself with low-stress, positive experiences. You want him to get used to you and your family. Hopefully, you have his cage in the main hub of your home so that he gets exposed to other people's activities as well. Talk about what you are doing as you do your daily routine--- this will help him learn your voice, but will also help teach new vocabulary which can make them less anxious if they can associate a word with a specific activity (e.g., sweeping etc).

Basically, you want to always be aware of his body language and adjust your actions accordingly.
You shouldn't even consider trying to touch him until he warms up to you some.

He may also be dealing with some cage-bound issues...How long was he in a cage? I know he is young, but I just still think it's weird that the lady said he was a biter...

Has he had a health exam by an avian certified vet?

You really don't want to try to coax him out at this point. You COULD try just leaving the door open and seeing if he eventually will decide to come out onto his cage top...I have a feeling he probably wouldn't come out until many days of this, and if he did, he probably would be too scared to explore much, BUT there is a chance he might fly if startled etc, which is why you need to plan before doing something like this because 1. You don't want him hitting a window or mirror, or fan or anything like that....and 2. because you do not want to have to towel him to get him back in..that should be avoided at all costs. and 3. you want to block off any high ledges or dangerous areas that he might want to hide in/on beforehand. So if you start allowing him to come in and out, you need to do it at a time when you can wait him out (e.g., wait for him to go back to his cage on his own). I did this with my bird when I got her because I couldn't touch her for like 3 months, so I just let her out and she came in and out as she pleased until bedtime...but if they come out, you want to try not to shut them up the second they decide to go back in...at the same time, you want to make sure they like their cage enough to eventually return to it. If you do this, you also would need to let everyone know so that people don't do things like, open outside doors, or burst in with a vacuum etc etc.

 

[CheekyAlfie]

Thank you for replying, I will definitely read the information you provided.The cage does have external doors, and we do not have to reach inside it to access the food. However, he jumped down from his perch and bit when my mother was opening the side door to the bowl. The owner when we were there, joked that Alfie probably bit someone right after he hatched (She got him from another unknown breeder.), so I'm not sure if it was under the breeder's influence or under hers. She really didn't provide any additional details about him or his past...I have no idea how long he was cage bound. The one we got for him is pretty large and spacious, There was a health guarentee from the owner we signed, but no official certificate from an avian vet. I live in a very small town in the middle of nowhere, so this was the only place with parrots available. There is an avian vet about an hour away I am planning to see sometime this week though. And okay, I will try not to disturb him as much as possible and let him adjust fully to our presence. Also, how often should he poop? Lastly, at night when he sleeps, he perches on a perch and rocks a little bit. I don't know if that is normal...I did prepare a sleeping tent for him, but he was not interested in it and did not attempt to go into it.

 

[noodles123]

Thank you for replying, I will definitely read the information you provided.The cage does have external doors, and we do not have to reach inside it to access the food. However, he jumped down from his perch and bit when my mother was opening the side door to the bowl. The owner when we were there, joked that Alfie probably bit someone right after he hatched (She got him from another unknown breeder.), so I'm not sure if it was under the breeder's influence or under hers. She really didn't provide any additional details about him or his past...I have no idea how long he was cage bound. The one we got for him is pretty large and spacious, There was a health guarentee from the owner we signed, but no official certificate from an avian vet. I live in a very small town in the middle of nowhere, so this was the only place with parrots available. There is an avian vet about an hour away I am planning to see sometime this week though. And okay, I will try not to disturb him as much as possible and let him adjust fully to our presence. Also, how often should he poop? Lastly, at night when he sleeps, he perches on a perch and rocks a little bit. I don't know if that is normal...I did prepare a sleeping tent for him, but he was not interested in it and did not attempt to go into it.

Take that hut out of his cage...they are dangerous for health and can increase hormonal behavior and aggression (there is no need for one--in the wild, they sleep on a tree branch unless nesting). EDIT- I just posted the novels from one of the links I gave you earlier (the "My King Parrot Scares Me")-There's more on the actual link, but the stuff below if what I was mostly referring to...I also fixed the links that weren't working for some reason (see below).

Are you covering him at night?
I ask because I am wondering how you are able to see him if the room is fairly dark or the cage is covered.
Some birds do get night-frights if it's too dark, so that is something to keep in mind if you start adjusting things in that department.

When you say he rocks, how much? It's hard to say w/o seeing it. He might not actually be fully asleep if you are in the room and the lights are on etc...

Pooping usually happens every few hours at least...Pay attention to poop all the time (in terms of how it looks etc) because it's often one of the first indicators of illness. It should always be scentless and it should have 3 parts (urine=liquid, urates=white part, feces=the greenish/brown chunks).

I'm having trouble picturing how he was able to bite her...Did he stick his head through the hole while it was open?

 

[noodles123]

Here:
Here is my "new to birds" post that I like to share with first-time bird owners. It is long and you probably know some of it already, but since there is a large learning-curve, I hope it is helpful!

I copied and pasted from another "new bird owner" post. Sorry it's so long!!!

When you have a bird, any sort of heated mechanism (anything that heats or is intended to be heated) and contains PTFE/PFOA/PFCs/Teflon will be out of the question (and most things that heat up or are intended to be heated DO contain these chemicals)--This includes things like pots, pans, cupcake trays, cookie sheets, cake pans etc, but it will also things like include hair-dryers, straighteners, curling irons, curlers, rice-cookers, SLOW COOKERS, popcorn poppers, air fryers, microwave meals (including certain types of microwave popcorn), steamers, irons, ironing board covers, electric skillets, griddles, George Foreman Grills, drip trays, toasters, toaster ovens, poaching pans, electric blankets, humidifiers, heat lamps, SPACE HEATERS, Scotch Guard etc etc...Here 2 links about it: https://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/teflon-kills-birds
To find out what contains PTFE/PFOA/PFCs/Teflon, you have to call and be a bit insistent about it over the phone (and in some cases, you won't get far--but sometimes it is a matter of how you ask). Almost always, it will take a few days (and numerous holds) for them to get back to you and you must provide the full chemical names, abbreviations and brand-names. Shopping when you have a bird is super annoying because cannot visually ID these chemical coatings, as they can be colored, transparent, or mixed into metal/fabric during the manufacturing process. Teflon and chemically similar products have killed birds on separate floors with the doors shut. Similarly, while DuPont claims that off-gassing only occurs at higher heats, there have been myriad bird deaths (even within academic circles) at temperatures well within the 300 degree F range! There is a reason they used canaries in coal-mines and it is because they die very easily due to even low levels of fumes of any sort. Some specific accounts: https://www.ewg.org/research/canaries-kitchen/bird-death-diaries
Here are the abbreviations and full spellings of the chemicals you need to ask about when inquiring about a product (give the name, spelling and abbreviation of each):

Teflon= common brand-name using the chemical types in question
PTFE= Polytetrafluoroethyline
PFOA= Perfluorooctanoic acid (sometimes known as C8)
PFCs= Perfluorinated chemicals

Sleep=essential to hormonal and immune function. Different species have different requirements, but 12 is pretty much the average. This means that someone must be there to cover and uncover the bird at the same time each night and that your home must be conducive to sleep.

Make sure you aren't using any unsafe products around the bird. This is pretty much everything with a scent (and some things without).
No perfume, PAINTS, carpet cleaner, flea shampoo, aerosols, solvents, air fresheners, paints, smoke of any kind, vaping, sunscreen, bugspray, candles of any kind (organic or non), insecticides, certain soaps/shampoos, fire-places, burning or heated oil/fat, self-cleaning ovens, gas and any household cleaners (e.g., bleach, windex, lysol, fabreeze, scrubbing bubbles, kaboom, pine-sol etc)...You will seriously have to re-think your entire home and your cleaning routine will change a ton.
NEVER use the self-cleaning oven function or try to season cast iron around birds.
The list goes on. Birds have VERY sensitive respiratory systems. Essential oils are also fairly unsafe due to their ability to be absorbed into the blood-stream and due to a bird's sensitive air sacs.
In terms of safe cleaning alternatives: White vinegar + water (as long as you don't heat it), grapefruit seed extract + water, baking soda (for scrubbing), some (but not all) natural cleaning products sold in pre-mixed formulas, and then avian-safe veterinary disinfectants, such as F10 SC (the yellow/clear concentrate has to be mixed with water but it is super safe and more effective than vinegar at killing bacteria etc).

Fumes make traveling with a bird complicated, as it is very unsafe to bring your bird with you into a location where teflon or chemical cleaners are being used. My bird does travel with me, but it is important to consider the safety of your final destination, as well as car temperature and any stops along the way (if you plan on bringing your bird inside).
I would recommend getting an air purifier (non-ozone producing/non-ionizing) to help with dust/mold etc (which can harm birds). Please note- a purifier will not protect birds from cigarette smoke, vaping fumes, teflon/ptfe/pfoa etc. It will only help increase the quality of the air to some extent. You cannot use unsafe chemicals around the bird just because you have a purifier.

Generally, you should only pet birds on the head/neck and you should not allow any shadowy spaces in the cage (boxes, bedding, crumbled paper, tents, blankets, low furniture, in clothing etc)...and so are tents/huts/hammocks etc. These things are hormonal triggers and they can cause health and behavior problems and snuggle huts can also entangle birds and cause blockages.

Birds hide illness like crazy, so there is nothing intuitive about their diseases. You have to be ready to study your birds poop and behavior daily, because even the slightest change can be a huge indicator. Blood work must be done frequently (ideally, 1x a year, but some vets will say every 3) and should be done soon after you get a new bird. Birds can carry and spread deadly illnesses without showing any symptoms, so play-dates and exposure to boarding facilities etc come with risks of their own. PBFD, ABV and PDD are all very serious and very contagious diseases that can be spread by things like feather dust in the ventilation system. These diseases are also notorious for producing false negatives in infected but asymptomatic carriers (when tested).
Bottom line: make sure that you have a certified avian vet (CAV) near you. Exotics vets who see birds are not the same thing. If you don't have a CAV near you, your life will be much more anxiety-ridden than if you do (and the difference between a CAV and an exotics vet can mean the difference between life and death for your bird in certain instances). NOTE: I know CAVs are not available everywhere, so do the best you can to find one. I lived in a place that didn't have one in the past, and I had to shop around for exotics vets and I always researched before trusting anything my exotics vet told me. Some of it was good advice and some was terrible. Never trust a vet that says to mix medicine into a bird's water! That is a sign that they are totally clueless. Also, never trust a vet that gives a bird antibiotics without first running some sort of test on the poop etc...

Birds are very sensitive to temperature changes and drafts. Any temperature change of 10 degrees or more puts significant stress on their systems. If you have to take your bird out in the cold, make sure you carefully cover the cage and pre-warm the car. Also, make sure you don't have any air-fresheners in the car or vents blowing directly on the bird. Extreme heat can also be harmful. Over time, birds can adjust to a wide ranger of temperatures, but this adjustment has to take place over a long period of time. Anything too quick is going to shock their systems.

Dowel perches that are smooth/even in texture lead to a disease called bumble-foot. Textured perches prevent this---look into dragonwood, manzanita and pummice perches. There are numerous guides to appropriate sizing online.

Birds move in slow motion and especially and establishing real trust can take many months. Do not push physical contact early on. Do quiet things near the cage, read a book out loud etc. The goal is to form positive associations between low-stress, rewarding situations and yourself/bird. Don't push anything your bird isn't comfortable with while building trust.

A baby bird will generally be friendly to all (much like a baby human), but teen and adult birds experience significant hormonal changes which impact their personality and preferences. Puberty is particularly bad in many cases. Although it passes, an adult bird will never be as nice as a baby and it will come with a whole new set of preferences, desires and rules.
It is very important not to engage in behaviors that will eventually be inappropriate for the bird as an adult, as this sets an unsustainable precedent. You must teach independence, refrain from allowing the bird to graft itself to you all day, do not spend excessive time with your bird due to the fact that they are a new and exciting new pet (because you will be expected to keep it up long-term), pet on head/neck only and do not provide your bird with access to fleece huts, huts in general, tents, boxes, blankets, pillows, bedding etc, ignore screams for attention and attend to the sounds you will be able to tolerate long-term, ignore biting when it happens and do not scold/react unless you know why it happened---you don't want to reinforce behavior by reacting in a way that will strengthen it. There is also information on this forum about "the shunning" method which can work for some birds depending on who is being bitten and your relationship with the bird.

 

[noodles123]

Foods- stick to a low-fat diet with occasional seeds (for most birds) although some varieties do need a few more in their daily diet. Never cut them off what they are used to cold-turkey because they can starve.
Unless you have an eclectus, a diet of pellets and chop (fruit/veg with more vet than fruit=ideal). If your bird is eating seeds as a major part of his diet, don't just cut him off (as they can be stubborn and starve if they are picky enough). Mine eats a healthy seed mix (no sunflowers or peanuts) and pellets (plus chop). I give her some seeds because she came to me eating them and she is eating less now than she did then...her blood work etc is fine and so is her weight, so I am okay with a few mixed in.
Tobacco residue (in the air or on hands/body)= very bad for them too, so if you smoke, vape, chew etc, MAKE SURE you are completely aired out and that any part of your body that the bird will be touching has been washed if it came in contact with the tobacco etc.
Birds are lactose intolerant, so dairy isn't very good for them (although a teeny-tiny bit of a hard cheese or something can be given like once a month or something lol---like a very rare treat and when I say tiny, I mean tiny).

Unsafe foods- tomato, mushroom, rhubarb, chocolate, coffee of any sort (even decaf--there is an actual component in it other than caffeine), artificial sweeteners, AVOCADO, honey, apple seeds and the meat from fruits cut near the pit, alcohol...Avoid high sugar foods, avoid high-fat foods, Salt should be EXTREMELY limited , do not allow your bird to come into contact with your saliva or eat directly after you (human saliva has the potential to make birds sick in some cases). Some people also say to avoid celery, as it can cause the crop to get blocked (same with other super-stringy foods). OH---No garlic, onions, chives, leeks, shallots, green-onions etc....Now, a teeny bit of cooked garlic in a dish filled with other ingredients isn't going to kill a bird if it sneaks a bite (assuming there is nothing else toxic in there) but it is toxic for them in general.
Peanuts should be avoided as they contain aflatoxins and can cause aspergillosis.
Certain beans are also toxic and should never be fed to birds (even when cooked)--It depends on the type..
Citrus fruit/citric acid should be very limited (as in oranges etc) because too much can cause iron storage syndrome.

Wet food shouldn't be in the cage more than 3 hours before getting dumped and washed with a bird-safe soap like Dawn.

Water dished should be washed at least 1-2 times daily with water and soap.

No corn cob bedding or bedding in the cage---period (line cage with something like paper towels, butcher paper or black and white newspaper)


No huts/tents/access to shadowy spaces (in or out of the cage) or it can make them get crazy and hormonal over time.

Make sure he has safe toys but don't just shove a bunch into the cage without making sure you give him time to adjust to seeing them from a safe distance and model playing with them for a few days nearby (silly, but important for young or timid birds).

MAJOR RED FLAGS---sitting on the bottom of the cage with no apparent purpose, falling/difficulty balancing for no reason (babies excluded), wheezing, tail pumping/bobbing when standing still and breathing, audible sounds when breathing, discharge from eyes or nose, frequent sneezing. If you notice these things, it isn't a "wait and see" health issue, it is a get them in ASAP issue. Bleeding is also another important one as birds don't have much blood. In an emergency, corn starch can be used to temporarily stop bleeding but it isn't a permanent fix in many cases..oh, and straining to poop is another one to look out for. There are 3 parts to poop--- the poop, the urine and the urates. The urates are like a white, stringy liquid and they should always be white. The urine is the liquid that surrounds the poop . The poop should not have chunks of undigested food in it. Super watery poop or NEON green poop can be bad--poop should never ever have a smell. Bubbly poop can indicate yeast over-growth. Stress can diet change can temporarily alter poop, but its important to keep an eye on it daily and change cage liners daily.
https://www.northernparrots.com/what...l-you-blog507/

Pay attention to poop as it will be very important for you to check it daily--- different colors/consistancies mean different things. Some of it will change depending on diet but it is important to get an idea of what your birds healthy poop looks like.

Many people use a gram scale to track their bird's weight every few days--you can buy one with a perch attached or make your own, by attaching a t-stand to one. Just remember--- not glue/fumes around the bird if you do this.

Birds are sensitive to drafts and major temperature changes. Make sure your bird isn't near drafty windows or heating/cooling vents. If you have to take him outside and it is cold, cover the cage with a blanket before returning to a temperature like he was used to.

When you cover the cage at night, make sure you cover it with a material that is breathable--- you do not want to smother the bird. They sell special cage-covers that are black-out materials yet breathable, but you can use other things as long as you are sure they aren't too thick. Also, your bird should never be covered during the day aside from travel in cooler weather. Never cover to stop screaming etc...bad news. Make sure that the laundry detergent you use doesn't have a strong smell. I use free-and clear and never any fabric softener or drier sheets, as these chemical scents are bad for the bird (and people honestly).

Make sure your bird's cage is in the main area of activity in the house (excluding the kitchen, as that is hazardous)--spend time socializing your bird. Remember that even a bird with clipped wings can fly given wind/height/space etc, so never take the bird outside without a cage or harness. If you ever do get wings clipped (which not everyone does), make sure you do not get a single-wing clip---you do not want them falling to the ground or losing control if they try to fly---the goal is for them to glide down safely.

Bathing opportunities should be provided once your bird is comfortable with you. If it doesn't scare him, you can spritz him with a spray bottle (not in the face and never as a punishment) but DO make sure the house is warm and draft free and never get a bird wet right before bed. Another option is setting out a shallow basin of water and allowing him to walk around in it. Some people will take their bird into the shower and let them go in and out of the water as they please, but there should never be any contact with soap and water should be luke-warm to cool (not as hot as people would generally prefer to shower and not super cold either).

For cleaning around the house, I use vinegar and water or f10 sc (bird-safe disinfectant). If you get the kind that is yellowish/clear, it doesn't have to be rinsed (there is a green kind with detergent that does have to be rinsed). F10 does have to be diluted before use though--- one tiny bottle makes something like 17 gallons if you mix it at a 1:250 ppm ratio (e.g., 2ml of F10 to every 17 oz h20)...It is a really great product and it kills germs way better than vinegar. It is safe for use in diluted form with your bird in the same room. Once mixed and stored in a spray bottle, it is good for up to 6 months. Unmixed, it lasts for years. I use f10 to clean my birds cage, but I have to scrape off the poop, as f10 doesn't break down grime, it just disinfects.

 

[CheekyAlfie]

Yes, he was hanging off the side next to the food bowl door (Not flinching away) when she changed the bowl and was bit. Although he drew blood, it was still a very breif and quick nip. I will take out the tent right away. His feces is just as the post described, three parts. He rocks very slightly, just a tiny bit. He does not have a cover yet, we ordered it online but shipping is being delayed. Also, that is the most detailed, and good care information have seen after doing all other research. Thank you so much.

 

[noodles123]

You are very very welcome! Sorry it's so much!

If you can find out what motivates him in general, or something he REALLY likes, that may be your ticket to bonding.. If it is a little unhealthy, that can be okay for training as long as it is given in very small amounts (only for training) and as long as it isn't toxic.
Please note: my list of unhealthy foods isn't complete, so make sure you do check when feeding new foods. Also, remember that 1 grape to a small bird would be like 200 to a person, so keep portion size in mind.

Do you know if he was covered at his last place? If not, it may scare him...just depends (he will probably get used to it, but you might call and ask what they did there because you don't want him flailing around). Also, some birds have night frights and if that is the case, an alternative is black-out curtains with a night-light in the room.

Does he have his own sleep space?
If not, another possibility is a sleep cage (for down the road, when you can handle him). Sleep cages are smaller cages that can be moved to a quiet location other than the room with the main cage.


Random, but also important:
Here is some information on metals and their safety--
http://www.multiscope.com/hotspot/articles/heavymetals.htm

another link to a list of household hazards:
http://www.exoticpetvet.com/parrot-precautions.html



I know that is a lot...Don't mean to overwhelm you--there is a lot to know about parrots though.