A friend in need

[Joshuwaaa]

Hi ,

I haven't actually posted on the macaw section of the site yet but was wondering if someone could be of any help. I've found most my help on this forum and would love to continue that in the macaw community.

I recently got a call from my friend who has a greenwing macaw asking, completely out the blue for me to have him. I have my own eclectus and conure and have always loved birds and made the best attempts to care for them which is why he made the call, however I'm no pro to bird behaviour and training. Only recently have me and my eclectus started training, and although we are doing well, a macaw would be a bit deep for me at the moment wouldn't it.

I told him I'd pop over and see the bird and see what the matter was and if we could maybe help, so me and jack drove over (with no intention of bringing this bird home) to try and help.

We got there and Darren (my friend) has just had a baby and last time we went the bird was in the front room, now hes been relegated to the kitchen in a small corner out the way. They also have three dogs they primarily care for and this bird has had three homes. I did tell him that these birds although beautiful require a lot of attention and care, with hindsight a unforgiving thing, he now doesn't think he can care for the bird.

We got the bird out and he is beautiful, 6 years old I believe, lovely and healthy but terribly untame. He was tame, but after being with them for 6 months and no real attention, he has regressed. Darren an his family are frightened of the bird, as was I slightly, and intimidated after they saw him apparently break apart a broom handle.

He doesn't step up, he bites a lot and even ran from Darrens legs just to get a nip at me. The bird is so defensive of Darren and loved climbing on him and being next to him, but Darren is visibly terrified and does nothing in fear of his beak. I went to offer him treats, which he took from my hand, and tried to ask him to step up gently, to which me and jack now have nice sore cuts on our arms. I kept trying, didn't move from the bite, but Darren kept flinching, which is normal, but teaching this bird that biting means get lost.

I said I would keep going over and together would try and help tame the bird somewhat and see if we can get him more friendly.

Is there anything you could suggest that might help me? Im taking my clicker to help Darren learn, an to try and start the clicker process. Maybe try just food from my hand again.

Anything we can do to help his bird more? I don't want him to try and rehome him again, it would be his fourth home. Id rather take him myself and spend all the time trying to help this bird.

Please someone, help me?

Thanks

Josh

x

 

[crimson]

Sounds to me like this would be an experience of a lifetime for you!....now having said that I am far from being experienced with macaws, but there are many options here for you and the bird.
1. is to have your friend try and train this bird, at least to step up on a perch, or take food without biting.
2. you could offer this bird a temporary home, and see if you could train him then find him a good home.
3.You take the bird and give him a permanent home.
4. your friend could take him to a rescue organization.
....what do you think?
I'm sure there are better options for this bird, and here's hoping it has a positive outcome

 

[Joshuwaaa]

To be honest a rescue wouldn't be an option. Although they are lovely and I love what they do, that would be another home for him, where he would again be adopted. An what if again, he gets some idiot who thinks he's beautiful but has no idea of his health and welfare.

I'd feel guilty, and I literally love this bird, he's a wonderful, intelligent bird, that just needs a good home and someone who can develop his behaviour better.

Darren was unable to offer his arm to Monty (the GW) as he was terrified, and they are looking not to get rid of him.

I'm half ready to go and get him. My apartment is already bird proof with tons of toys, play gyms and stands. Places where I could maybe train him and spend the time.

Its just getting him back home and making the leap with a bird who is already aggressive against me and jack. I'm not good enough even at my best of times.

Do you think with some time, effort and lots of love Monty would come to like living with me? Would he be, at six years old, now stuck in his ways and unable to go back to his old tame ways. I couldn't, like Darren, just keep him cooped up in his cage 24/7. As we left he was trying to get Monty back in, an didn't actually get him in for two hours after we had left. He sprays him back in, something I really disagree with and was a little annoyed about.

aaaaah

x

 

[JerseyWendy]

Do you think with some time, effort and lots of love Monty would come to like living with me? Would he be, at six years old, now stuck in his ways and unable to go back to his old tame ways. I couldn't, like Darren, just keep him cooped up in his cage 24/7. As we left he was trying to get Monty back in, an didn't actually get him in for two hours after we had left. He sprays him back in, something I really disagree with and was a little annoyed about.

aaaaah

x

Yes, I think Monty would LOVE to live with you, as you sound like a good fit for him with your dedication, patience and love he'd be receiving from you.

At 6 years, he's still VERY VERY young, and I'm sure Monty will have you wrapped tightly around his talons in no time at all.

They are so incredibly smart those big guys, so why not give it a go? (Sorry if I sound like the evil enabler here :54

 

[Merlee]

I agree that Monty is still young considering the lifespan of the species. If you read a lot of posts on different forums, many birds have been rehabilitated from abuse and neglect. It just takes time and patience for the right person to turn a bird around. Take a chance and see what happens. Monty would be better off with you at this point. If things don't turn out well with you, you can always find another home who will be a better fit. I know that sounds bad, but considering how many members are on different bird forums, it's possible somebody would be willing to open their home to help a bird in need. You came to the right place!!

 

[AngelicaandBandit]

Dont give up! As said above 6 years is quite young for a Macaw. Im sure he would have a fabulous life with you, that said, there is the many obstacles to overcome in your path to giving Monty the life he deserves, but you can do it!

Step 1: Take him home, set his cage up, an as you probably know a 30 day quarantine from your other fids is in order. Give him time to adjust and settle into his new home. As you've no doubt read many times on the topic of taming, do stuff near the cage, eating, reading etc feed him through the bars of the cage. Eventually he will remain calm when you're around and associate your hand with treats and food, a good thing.

Step one is the most crucial bit of taming. Think of this as first impressions. This is where you build your foundation. This part really tests your patience as it could take an awfully long time but, like a house, if you dont lay a strong foundation, everything will come crashing down. This may take days, maybe weeks, or months, possibly years.

Step 2: Clicker training. This can be done during step one as it doesnt require taking Monty out of his cage. Click and reward so Monty associates the click with the treat.

I personlly advise you do step 2 during step 1, training works miracles with biting birds I promise you, clicker training will decrease but a tiny bit Montys urge to bite you.

Step 3: (Or step 2 depending how you go about what I said previously) Target training. I really recommend you go to My Parrot Help - Home and read what it has on Target Training, the site shows you a specific way to go about target training, i used that method on my cockatoo and was very effective.

People have asked me how I got my cockatoo to stop biting. I said Training, training keeps your bird focused and stimulated rather then want to bite.

Good luck with Monty! It will be a LOT of hard work but it will pay off as long as the right dedication, patience and love goes into this.

Keep us posted!

 

[Peeker]

Joshua, as much as you say your friend doesn't want to rehome the bird--I suspect that would be best. Keeping the bird not only requires the bird to learn better behaviors, it requires your friend to learn to handle the bird well. He also needs to understand this birds needs and make adjustments in his home. Right now the new baby is his priority as well it should be. I doubt having a new baby as it grows and toddles and runs will make an ideal situation to work with a very large bird that is loud and bites. :/

Although we all hate to hear the bird needs another home, when it's the right home birds generally adjust well.

The big question is--is YOUR home the right home? I can feel your heart beating with love and care for this bird and have absolutely zero doubt you would do everything you can in your power to help him. But, you are in uni right now and also need to focus on your studies. Will you have the time without neglecting your studies, your partner, your other birds? Are you ready to take on such a commitment? Adopting a large macaw is like adopting a 5 year old child that won't be ready to move out at 18. That's something to really think about.

If forums like this have shown me anything, they have shown me how many truly wonderful people their are out there that love birds as I do and are ready to make that kind of commitment.

Really consider whether you are ready for something like this and everything a macaw means, or consider working with the bird perhaps and helping to find the right forever home for him.

**Remember big birds like that mean BIG cages, BIG carriers for the car (vet trips), larger food bills, more toy shreddables and it sounds like this young buzzsaw has a healthy need to chew!

Whatever your decision, I wish you the best. I know I would have a hard time making that choice too!

 

[BirdBrains2233]

Just to throw my 2cents in... Macaws are all about testing the people who try to get close to them. It seems as if they thrive on it. With that said I will try to sum up all my tougher experiences. When I first tried to handle all of the supposedly "Mean" birds, they strike, hiss, screech, claw and all of the other negative things you could think of. I learned quickly that If I did not assert my dominance and show who was in charge that it would be a fight I would not win. When I first reach in the cage with a "cage aggressive" I attempt to get them to step up and just wait to be bitten, and when they go to strike I force myself not to move and take the bite. Once they see I am not going to pull away after that first (2nd and 3rd, and sometime 10th time) they usually step up and they attitude mostly changes. Those first bites will always be the worst, but it does change. I have helped many people with stubborn birds and there have only been very few that just refused to change their ways. Im sure with more time they would have eventually came around, but with my military deployments I just didnt have that time available. It sounds like you have the drive and concern needed to help this young GW have a great life. Keep us updated on how things turn out, Maybe a few pictures when you get the chance also

 

[BillsBirds]

I would say that because of the questions you are asking, and the concern you have for this bird...you are his best option here. Take him, and enjoy. It will be a learning experience for you both, and a lifelong friend for you both, as well.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Wow, the response to this thread has been amazing, and I thank you all.

I'm trying my absolute best not to get carried away, I know the complete devotion and perseverance I had with Loki, an he has come on leaps and bounds even waving, stepping up and down, spinning

However, it wasn't without its struggles. Monty was a huge bird, an I would hate to take him in and feel like I'm doing him a disservice. As Peeker quite rightly said I do have a demanding Uni course (studying law) and a part time job. As well as my other fids. That being said, I'm 21 and never go drinking, don't go clubbing, I spend all my time with my partner and our family of fids.

I think I could help him, I think we would gain such a huge bond going through this process of taming.

Seems like such a huge decision to make, I want to make the best one for Monty and my small family. Cricket and Loki were introduced properly, good quarantine and they are fine with our supervision.

Darren is being quite stubborn and asking £1,200 for Monty, this would be with his cage. This isn't a problem as its cheaper then most are asking, but this worries me because some idiot will snatch him up.

I told Darren to wait for my reply, as I was "consulting" with those I trust on the matter (this forum)

What if I can't get him out his cage? Could I use a rope perch bent around to start getting him out daily? to start a routine?

If he would step up nicely I could totally work around the rest. That's the biggest obstacle.

Should I go back and keep visiting Monty? See if me an him make some progress before I completely change his surrounding? or would the change maybe give me an advantage, taking him away from Darren?

Thanks for all your help guys, its invaluable to have you here to talk to,

Josh

**
I never said!!!

What an idiot!!

He doesn't seem to lung and bite Darren, only those of us he didn't know and trust. Could this mean with some time and trust he would be the same with me? He wouldn't bite as much?

Darren can stroke the back of his head if he asks Monty, and he was quite content with him, its just Darren literally leans away from him because he is intimidated.

Monty will also dance for a treat, and took treats from my hand when he danced on command, said hello on command and kissed on command. The start of my training essentially lol

 

[JerseyWendy]

Monty is a magnificent looking GW!!! And yes, you absolutely can use a bendable rope perch to get him to come out of his cage. Some folks even use small branches in the beginning until there 's enough trust where it's no longer needed.

I have the original dowel that Niko's cage came with, and I use it when he outsmarts me and ends up on top of his 7' cage. All I have to do is show him the dowel, and he then comes running to my arm, lol.

So has your friend already listed Monty? I really hope he will let you have a chance with him before someone who's inexperienced snatches him up.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Hey Wendy,

Yea he's already listed him. Little pressure to make sure I make up my mind before someone else gets in. He is however convinced he will not sell to someone who doesn't understand Monty's needs.. however I'm not sure if someone turned up with £1,200 if he wouldn't take it. I'm not sure.

I mean, I could bring him home and after a week he may start trusting and maybe make progress. I could bring him home and after a month, two months, may make no progress at all and be utterly frustrated that nothing I do is making much difference..

Just trying to be realistic, but I would love him to come home with me

 

[JerseyWendy]

This is a very difficult decision, Joshua. I understand he's your friend, but I don't like being "rushed" into such big commitments, especially if you have any doubts at all.

 

[sodakat]

My late input is don't do it.

But, if you absolutely must, please insist that Darren give him to you. It is outrageous that he wants to immediately have the bird gone, is willing to disrupt your life just because you are a more dedicated bird owner than he is and have taken the time to work with your bird, then expects you to pay him to take his problem off his hands.

I'm sure that because you are such a caring person you would find a way to make it work. But I hate to see you feel guilty for your friend's shortcomings. He COULD change his behavior and start working with the bird. You know he could. He chooses not to.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

I completely agree with Kathy.

It sucks, but while I was there I did keep saying "offer him your arm" and telling him when to give Monty a treat. I was so desperate to see whether he would step up onto him because it would show that with him he isn't so aggressive. Darren just wasn't willing to do it, he was far to intimidated.

I did question (without trying to be rude) why they went for such a huge bird. To which they said it was because they had had an African grey and loved his looks. I was a little annoyed really because its really irresponsible to make such a commitment. Monty loves Darren but Darren said he didn't trust him enough not to bite him or be aggressive.

I honestly can't say whether I would be a good fit, I know that at my very best I am always in need of help with my current fids. However, sometimes I think its not what you know or can do, its what your willing to learn, how dedicated and how loving you are with your birds.

Cricket my conure isn't tame, and I couldn't tame him, an I still care for his every need as I do Loki. I would never get rid of a bird I took responsibility for, it isn't fair (except in extreme circumstances). We still work and he will step up, but he's far happier in his cage with his toys, singing to Loki.

I think, to start, Im going to try and help Darren interact and care for Monty, see if I can go and help tame and build THEIR relationship before I attempt to just take this bird.

If I cant help, and he still wants to get rid of the bird, I will have to be there ready to take him in.

I just won't be pressured at the moment, just because I love parrots, doesn't make me best to care for so many

x

 

[Joshuwaaa]

Has made me realise how much I love birds though haha, never been in such turmoil over something like this lol.

Hey, Il just be a crazy old bird man

 

[JerseyWendy]

Has made me realise how much I love birds though haha, never been in such turmoil over something like this lol.

Hey, Il just be a crazy old bird man

That must then make me an ANCIENT crazy bird lady.

 

[Joshuwaaa]

This whole experience has taught me I want more birds lol, as I already have two maybe I could open the home to one more.

I've explained that I can't take in the green wing, with my other fids and his demanding needs, I'm unsure paying to bring him here is a little silly. I have however passed on the ad to a good friend of mine who has a few birds in the hope she may know someone best suited for Monty, maybe someone with a girly he can go and love

Thanks for all your help, I think a macaw may be on the cards as Jack has fell in love with the idea haha,

Who knows,

Josh x