90k budget retirement hobby/business

[itzjbean]

Do you have Facebook? I encourage you to join the group 'Hyacinth Macaw Lovers', there are many members who have hy's and will be able to give you some insight on what goes into their care and how to keep these intelligent creatures as family pets. Are you interested in breeding for profit, or actually keeping them as pets?

You've chosen a particularly difficult hobby to indulge in, breeding Hyacinths. It will take more than money to accomplish what you have in mind. They have very specific diets (they need a certain nut to live) and do not reach sexual maturity until around 10 years of age.

Here's another option, why not purchase a weaned Hyacinth (1 year old) from a reputable breeder and keep it as a family pet. You can learn SO much about them by watching them mature. Then after it is mature in 10 years, then you can consider finding your bird a mate and beginning the breeding process.

 

[Kiwibird]

I do wonder after reviewing earlier posts, if the OP's seeming lack of 'love' towards birds stems from the fact he (she?) views them like tropical fish- mindless creatures. All my reptiles and aquatics have always been kept in beautiful setups with a lot of effort put into their care and maintaining their environment on my end, and I truly do enjoy observing them but at the end of the day, they show no love back as it's not in their nature. They don't care about me, they just want to be fed and kept in an enclosure within the correct environmental parameters for their species. The only thing "gained" from keeping them is my own satisfaction and personal interest in the hobby.

The fact this person seems to have 0 experience with parrots may well account for their possible perception they're another exotic 'hobby' animal who just needs an expensive setup and advanced care by an admittedly dedicated owner, but gives nothing back in the relationship between animal and caretaker. I hope that if that is the case, this person can learn that parrots are much, much different and not really "hobbyist" pets. Being able to afford the best enclosures, diet, vet care etc... unlike other animals is not the only thing they need from their owners. Parrots also need and require your friendship as well. They well and truly become like family, like a child (when you do things right!). They are in the top 3 most intelligent animals besides humans, up there with great apes and dolphins capable of reaching the mental capacity of a 3-5 year old child. They are highly social and form deep, lifelong bonds with their human family. I hope the OP at least interacts with some parrots and chats with some *good* bird owners who can help educate and show off just how special the bond between a parrot and it's owner can be before deciding to pursue this venture as some kind of "hobby". It's more comparable to "adopting a child" than it is setting up a fish tank, even if it is a $90K fish tank with rare fish and corals etc...

 

[AAOtero]

Hello! I’m Brazilian. Although I’m not an experienced parrot owner at all I believe that going there, even if it’s just as a trip, and meeting the Hyacinth either on its native habitat or in a rescue would be a good experience for you. (I’ve already visited Macaw rescues there) After the World Cup several people have become more proficient in speaking English so communication would not be as much of a problem(there are more translators and agencies that specialize in helping English speaking tourists) I just think that since Hyacinths are an endangered species you could learn more about them by visiting their home, and it would help you to be able to replicate the best possible environment for them. And also, you would truly see what you’re signing up for. Remember that roses also bear thorns. This might be a little nationalistic of me but I hate when animals from my country’s fauna end up mistreated. It’s the same with birds such as sun conures, several people are endazzled by their beauty and often forget about their less desirable traits...

 

[Kiwibird]

I’ll just read your info. Way to much crazy and emotion going on here for me. Go ahead and shut the post down I’ll just lurk.

Please do keep lurking and reading! I hope you'll come to understand where the "crazy emotions" stem from.

He hasn't been posting recently but I highly recommend reading Birdman666's threads. He is one of the few members with extensive experience with hyacinth macaws so his insight into Big Macs and birds in general should prove invaluable to you.

 

[Scott]

Wasn’t asking for permission. I’m asking for information and community. I can read in a year what would have taken a lifetime for people even 10years ago. I have had reef tanks for 20years and delivered 15 litters of labradors. I also don’t have any financial constraints and all of the time in the world. I will be fine. This is the only negative post I will respond to so let’s keep it positive from here on out. I’m doing this and I will be awesome at it. Help me do the best job possible and let’s help these animals numbers grow. I’m an asset and I care deeply about helping these animals increase their numbers.

You may not agree with SilverSage's perspective, but she is spot-on in a broad sense. Hyacinths and other endangered parrots are squeezed by human development, arrogance, and somewhat protected by CITES. While increasing the reproductive rate is helpful, they must be carefully nurtured over a lifetime spanning decades. I highly respect your ambition, desire to learn, and commitment to breeding, but maintaining their physiological and psychological welfare downstream is a daunting task. Once sold and out of your purview, the care of a large macaw requires a deep knowledge base and dedication.

Please understand this forum fosters a respectful debate and we take our reverence for all feathered creatures seriously. You'll read a multitude of opinions, know ty originate from the heart and minds of some extraordinary experienced members.

Thanks for puting things in a respectful manner. I agree 100%. I know some people have attitudes to where they think their knowledge gives them the narcissistic inclination that people care what their opinion is. Shame is their own ego gets in the way of them communicating, because they have to first get across how important they are. Like I said, I wasn’t asking for permission.

I won’t be purchasing a bird for a year. If it comes off as cocky, that’s ok. My vet who has been working with macaws for 22 years is ecstatic about working with me. He also has full confidence and is being consulted every step of the way. I came to this site to expedite the process of finding quality resources. I know lots of people may have the view you need to pay your dues, work in a shelter, be humbled by post counts on the Internet forum, that just isn’t me. LOL.

Scott do you know any places near you in San Diego that house multiple hyacinths? I just want to go pick someone’s brain who is around them everyday and possibly get info from people who can let me observe some of their behavior in person. I was thinking San Diego zoo ? Just hang around the cages and talk with a handler we have passes and frequent the zoo at least 2x a month.

San Diego Zoo may be of assistance, though the sister facility Zoofari Park has a more interactive hands-on approach. Unsure if they have Hyacinths on property.

Other assets include Freeflight Del Mar, Dr. Jeff Jenkins, Dr. Brian Loudis, and Dr. Todd Cecil. The three docs are avian certified and/or ABVP-Avian.

I don't know of Hyacinth breeders in the area.

 

[Takoarm]

You may not agree with SilverSage's perspective, but she is spot-on in a broad sense. Hyacinths and other endangered parrots are squeezed by human development, arrogance, and somewhat protected by CITES. While increasing the reproductive rate is helpful, they must be carefully nurtured over a lifetime spanning decades. I highly respect your ambition, desire to learn, and commitment to breeding, but maintaining their physiological and psychological welfare downstream is a daunting task. Once sold and out of your purview, the care of a large macaw requires a deep knowledge base and dedication.

Please understand this forum fosters a respectful debate and we take our reverence for all feathered creatures seriously. You'll read a multitude of opinions, know ty originate from the heart and minds of some extraordinary experienced members.

Thanks for puting things in a respectful manner. I agree 100%. I know some people have attitudes to where they think their knowledge gives them the narcissistic inclination that people care what their opinion is. Shame is their own ego gets in the way of them communicating, because they have to first get across how important they are. Like I said, I wasn’t asking for permission.

I won’t be purchasing a bird for a year. If it comes off as cocky, that’s ok. My vet who has been working with macaws for 22 years is ecstatic about working with me. He also has full confidence and is being consulted every step of the way. I came to this site to expedite the process of finding quality resources. I know lots of people may have the view you need to pay your dues, work in a shelter, be humbled by post counts on the Internet forum, that just isn’t me. LOL.

Scott do you know any places near you in San Diego that house multiple hyacinths? I just want to go pick someone’s brain who is around them everyday and possibly get info from people who can let me observe some of their behavior in person. I was thinking San Diego zoo ? Just hang around the cages and talk with a handler we have passes and frequent the zoo at least 2x a month.

San Diego Zoo may be of assistance, though the sister facility Zoofari Park has a more interactive hands-on approach. Unsure if they have Hyacinths on property.

Other assets include Freeflight Del Mar, Dr. Jeff Jenkins, Dr. Brian Loudis, and Dr. Todd Cecil. The three docs are avian certified and/or ABVP-Avian.

I don't know of Hyacinth breeders in the area.

Scott you are awesome thanks for the info and kind words.

 

[Scott]

I’ll just read your info. Way to much crazy and emotion going on here for me. Go ahead and shut the post down I’ll just lurk.

You are welcome! We don't shut down threads because of emotional display - often better categorized as passion. I'd say that is rather apparent from both sides, no?

Folks such as Elon Musk, Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, etc prevailed via the unique mix of enthusiasm, intellect, and drive. Nobody is counting you out, just eager to share experiences and cautions.

 

[OutlawedSpirit]

Okay, after reading your initial post and all replies, I feel I need at add my two cents in as well.

First, from your initial post, I gathered that you are looking at breeding hyacinths as a source of income after you retire. If you indeed love your birds as children, and are willing to do everything right, there is not necessarily anything wrong with that. However, I do want to point out that you are not going to make anywhere near the income you think you're going to. In fact, you'll be lucky to make an income at all. I used to breed several different species of parrots, and had several pairs of each species set up that all produced well for me. However, with ensuring that all of my birds received the proper vet care, quality diets suitable for their species, fresh foods every single day, and that I had brooders set up for all of my young chicks and all of the hand feeding supplies and sanitizing equipment necessary to keep everyone healthy, it probably cost me just as much, if not more, than I made. Plus, that was with me charging more than the "average" breeder did for my babies.

Before you commit to breeding as a "business", do yourself a favor and run some numbers. First, what it will cost your for your initial set up. Then ask your vet that raises macaws what they use per macaw, per month in formula. Double that for a hy, then figure that for an entire year. Plus, only plan on getting 2 or 3 babies from a pair in a year in you are extremely lucky. And they may not breed every year. And that's if you're lucky and one of the birds in your pair doesn't decide they don't like the partner you chose for them and you wake up one morning to a dead bird.

Then, I'll tell you why I am not breeding anymore. The same thing could happen to you, or any other breeder really. In the middle of the night, our furnace malfunctioned and caused a carbon monoxide leak. Luckily, our detectors worked and woke us up. However, by the time we got the kids up and out of the house, I lost every single one of my breeders. Only my 3 large birds survived, mostly because they were kept in a different part of the house. So even if you do every single thing right, you can still lose it all to things that are out of your control. Nothing in breeding is ever guaranteed.

 

[Cas27]

Hi I’m Cas, I’m new here on the forums too...I’m also retired and I also retired young at 29 I’m 46 now. I also didn’t like what I was being told back too me when I would post but everyone has their own opinion. The people here have been dealing with birds for many years and know birds are not a hobby some treat them as pets some treat them as family and if you buy one as a pet like I did about a year ago your pet bird turns into family it just happens parrots are very needy creatures...I’ve learned the hard way I now have 4 needy kids I have too feed on time or it gets very loud I have scars from getting bit...I thought I knew everything about what ever I wanted too do but I was wrong.
I also had salt water reef tanks nicer than in the big aquariums you go too visit. Birds are hard man they all have different personality’s just like people do. I’m not going too tell you how too spend your money but I can tell you the people on this forum have as many years experience with parrots as you are old. You do not seem like a patient person and you are going too have time too learn about breeding just like that wow I wish you the best but it’s a bad retirement investment . I think I’m going too start racing nascar next week

 

[sonja]

My 2 cents: I think if your plan works out, it sounds great. But, in this period of time that you are soaking up as much info as possible, volunteer at a rescue! You will be plunged into the thick of things - you will learn firsthand what caring for parrots takes, how loud they are, how messy they are, how much a bite hurts, how fun they are, how much you can love them. You can see in an intense learning environment if it is right for you - firsthand experience that you can't get from reading online. If you find that the work is right up your alley, then you have a good hands-on foundation for the project you plan. Or, you may find that it's all too much, and this is also valuable info for you to gain for yourself, hands-on.

 

[Kiwibird]

no Problem it’s their loss. I’ll still have a bunch of beautiful animalls and they will have missed out on seeing it first hand besides they decided to act like kooks and throw cats at someone. Hahahahahaha. Not every business starts out as a lemonade stand people.

I've seen and handled a hy before. Was not impressed because it cost many times more than my bird. Much more impressed at the 20 some odd year relationship between the owner and his bird, which showed in the bird's impeccable behavior towards both the owner and complete strangers. BTW, I am one of the few people who's been around big birds my entire life, started handling them (and got my first serious bite) around age 3. I grew up reading book after book after book on avian behaviors, psychology, intelligence, training, healthcare you name it.... That's 29 years and countless tens of thousands of hours more hands on experience and in depth understanding of psittacine behavior and psychology than you have. Some of the other members responding have had even longer in the "bird game" with more experience and knowledge than myself. Yet you seem to know better than everyone else as a complete beginner who's possibly never even so much as held a bird before? It's really puzzling. As someone working toward starting my first little business venture, I couldn't imagine signing up for a relevant forum and barging in effectively saying "I already know everything, now give me lots of free advice (but only advice I want to hear!)". That doesn't even make sense:06:

I guess if you have multiple hyacinths, they'll at least have each other and all their financial-dependent care needs met. It will really be you who will be missing out with that attitude you have. Money won't buy you the love of these animals. They care not one iota about your bank account balance. You get out exactly what you put in, and by that, I mean working with them every single day for multiple hours a day towards a mutually rewarding bond. Thus far you have given zero indication you have any intention of doing that. It'll be your loss too if that is the case. Genuinely, I hope that you DO keep reading and DO keep learning or you'll be missing out on the most important part of your "investment"- the bond between these amazing animals and their caretaker. Anything less is like parking a Ferrari in a climate controlled garage and never driving it. The car may be ok but what's the point of owning it? I also think you may find it difficult to obtain a baby hy or even an older rescue and almost certainly not a proven pair no matter how much money you offer. Most HY breeders are extremely selective where there babies go, and that includes screening for those who may not be emotionally invested in the baby. Rescues are even more selective, not wanting to see the bird end up rehomed again and those breeders parting with their proven pairs are likely to be even more selective where they go.

 

[Takoarm]

Can’t believe some of the people here are expert parrot owners and clairvoyants. Your able to peer into my home, mind, past, and present so easily and accurately. Just do us a favor and give every rescue the winning lotto numbers while your at it.

 

[Kiwibird]

You know as little about my (or anyone else on this forum) political leanings as you do raising parrots!

P.S. Mods don't like politics being dragged into the forum, with good reason

 

[Kiwibird]

It is also an rather arrogant assumption on such a widely read public forum to believe YOU are the only one who will or could potentially benefit from the various responses you've received (and apparently feel don't apply to you). Threads on this forum are viewed by thousands of people, possibly others interested in breeding hyacinth macaws or parrots in general who ARE interested in learning from seasoned parrot owners and breeders who actually know what they're talking about/doing.

 

[plumsmum2005]

Is there anyone still working over there?

 

[Takoarm]

It is also an rather arrogant assumption on such a widely read public forum to believe YOU are the only one who will or could potentially benefit from the various responses you've received (and apparently feel don't apply to you). Threads on this forum are viewed by thousands of people, possibly others interested in breeding hyacinth macaws or parrots in general who ARE interested in learning from seasoned parrot owners and breeders who actually know what they're talking about/doing.

If that’s how you feel why waste time attacking me? Why not put something information based on the post. You came at me throwing cats from the get go.

 

[Kiwibird]

If you can't see the good advice you've already been given by multiple posters, I don't know what to tell you. Not once have I attacked you, in every post I've specified "potentially" or "if that is the case" offering ample opportunity and trying to encourage you to explain your position or current understanding on very relevant and important matters regarding parrot care, which you have thus far neglected to do. You have still not told anyone what you find appealing about parrots or macaws as companion animals, how much time you plan to put into bonding/training/socialization or anything else really that would inspire a different tone and dialogue with long time members. You have also completely avoided commenting on your current understanding of the emotional aspect of parrot psychology, which you may find some kind of namby-pamby bleeding heart crap now, but may not find such a "crazy emotional response" thing if you have unhappy, plucking and/or self mutilating birds in the future. Thus far, I have seen no questions about how to begin training them, what to feed them, healthcare, noise, mess etc... No feedback on where/how you plan to obtain a breeding pair, how long you're willing to wait, what you'll do if the birds don't like or want to mate with each other... Things most prospective owners and prospective breeders really want to know.

 

[GaleriaGila]

Continued respect to members who are responding with passion and politeness. You rock.

 

[itzjbean]

It is also an rather arrogant assumption on such a widely read public forum to believe YOU are the only one who will or could potentially benefit from the various responses you've received (and apparently feel don't apply to you). Threads on this forum are viewed by thousands of people, possibly others interested in breeding hyacinth macaws or parrots in general who ARE interested in learning from seasoned parrot owners and breeders who actually know what they're talking about/doing.

If that’s how you feel why waste time attacking me? Why not put something information based on the post. You came at me throwing cats from the get go.

I hope you saw my post about joining the hyacinth group on facebook. Such a useful tool to get advice from real hy owners. Something I also forgot about, you could get in touch with a few hyacinth breeders and learn from them about the process. They can answer some specific questions you may have about breeding them. One that comes to mind is 'Avian Adventures Aviary',. There are members here that have gotten macs from them. The difference between a good breeder and bad one -- a good one really puts the birds first and is not in it for the money. Consider reaching out to them to learn more.

 

[wrench13]

Welcome and be welcomed. I love Hyacinths and have held a few over the years. I wish you good luck in trying to breed these enormous beautiful parrots. They are rare, very rare. Can you please answer a few questions for me?

You mentioned your cages or aviaries are coming. Mind if I ask what kind they are ?
How large and what are they made of? Hys have enormously strong beaks, capable of busting welds on an average cage.

Since Hy's are on the CITES list, have you applied for what ever licence or other documents needed to have birds cross state lines? Last thing you want is to buy a Hy in say FLorida, and have it held in quarantine at the airport in San Diego until you can prove that your a breeder. Anodorhynchus hyacinthinu , the hyacinth macaw will need proper paperwork.

Good luck and keep us informed of your progress. Despite a rocky start, there are some real expert parrot owners here. Go to the Amazon forum, and read I Love Amazons sticky at the top of the page, just substitute Macaw for Amazons, and it will give you a wealth of information on raising parrots.