90k budget retirement hobby/business

[Takoarm]

Please delete post. My vet said don’t post pics or let people know you will be breeding Hyacinths because some weirdo will break into your house and steal your birds. Internet is full of people with tech knowledge that will find your address and rob you.

 

[SilverSage]

Please don’t. If you don’t understand the minds and needs of these birds you shouldn’t be raising them. What will you do when new owners come to you saying their bird has started screaming non stop? Biting? Plucking? Chewing his own flesh? You don’t just dive into parrot breeding, and you don’t start with an endangered species that has the intelligence and emotional needs of a human child.


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[locito277]

38 and retiring? Nice!! They all scream lol best of luck! I’m in Miami so cant help you club wise. Would love to see updated pics once you set up the aviaries. I’m
Building 2 in my home for
My 3 macaws!


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[plumsmum2005]

Owning birds is not about you it's about them and my tuppence is you are too self absorbed to have the birds best interests at heart. You have already got up my nose and guessing not the only one. Please take Silversage's advice and not do this. Hy's require a special kind of owner and commitment and are endangered. If you have so much free resources why not go give your time and money to a rescue I am sure they will welcome you.

 

[Scott]

Wasn’t asking for permission. I’m asking for information and community. I can read in a year what would have taken a lifetime for people even 10years ago. I have had reef tanks for 20years and delivered 15 litters of labradors. I also don’t have any financial constraints and all of the time in the world. I will be fine. This is the only negative post I will respond to so let’s keep it positive from here on out. I’m doing this and I will be awesome at it. Help me do the best job possible and let’s help these animals numbers grow. I’m an asset and I care deeply about helping these animals increase their numbers.

You may not agree with SilverSage and other's opinions, but they are spot-on in a broad sense. Hyacinths and other endangered parrots are squeezed by human development, arrogance, and somewhat protected by CITES. While increasing the reproductive rate is helpful, they must be carefully nurtured over a lifetime spanning decades. I highly respect your ambition, desire to learn, and commitment to breeding, but maintaining their physiological and psychological welfare downstream is a daunting task. Once sold and out of your purview, the care of a large macaw requires a deep knowledge base and dedication.

Please understand this forum fosters a respectful debate and we take our reverence for all feathered creatures seriously. You'll read a multitude of opinions, know they originate from the heart and minds of some extraordinary experienced members.

 

[plumsmum2005]

'Others' Scott ????

 

[Scott]

'Others' Scott ????

Other opinions, such as yours!

 

[plumsmum2005]

Hi me again, LOL

Why is your vet ecstatic about working with you? Has he all the avian qualifications or is he just using your resources to earn some more $'s?
I hope the zoo can help you but surely don't the staff have jobs to do? You could benefit hugely from working and supporting the right kind of rescue, the knowledge they have could be vast.

 

[DiscoDuck]

I am not going to read this thread. I already saw the comments that came across as uh, doesn't matter what I think about the first comments I read. Its not hard to figure out that you have the wherefore all based on your initial post.

Adapting to the birds and their care is easily learned. I know for a fact that I learned from this website about Macaws right down to the specific breed I thought would be best suited for me. Given that there is a wealth of information on here. I found that raising and acclimating Rudy was far easier than i expected.

On the other hand I have time for my bird. Its far easier than raising kids and they are a lot smarter!

I don't know about the Hyacinth specifically in detail. My own cautionary advice would be market driven as to why you want to breed them when it is more likely than not that bird will end up in adoption. I know that my bird will likely and easily outlive me. I would talk directly to some of the mainstays that are here. Wish you were on the Right Coast. I would come help. I have an extensive construction background.. message me if you want.

 

[DiscoDuck]

Hey, I found it on my DVR . This was easy.. Search Google for

Animal Cribs - Superfly Parrot Palace. S1E7

If High end Hyacinths is going to be your thing. Then you need to either contact these guys or DIY This is an ultimate, uhhh.. achievable goal

Best!

 

[DiscoDuck]

Last thought. Why the Hyacinth? It is a beautiful bird, they all are.

It is also the largest and the most expensive then there is CITES issue.

I obviously am partial to the GWM FWIW IMO i think there are several characteristics that have an advantage over the HY.

First is the colors. Did you know that the GVM blue wing feathers are actually red on the underside? Ever seen a feather with one color on one side and another on the opposite side?

Gizzard. The GWM flocks to river banks and ingests clay to help digestion. OK this is where I can go off track with the ornithologists here. Let me put it this way, there is a reason this birds eats muddy clay.

Talkativeness, there are several species of Parrots that are great talkers. Rudy talks and learns quite well. he has 50 words and phrases to his credit. He notoriously talks when he wants to and its rare because I have yet been able to make him talk.

The only time he really talks a is when I am outside with him about 1/2 hour before the sun sets.

Yeah so take my 2 cents for what it is worth to you. I just want to throw that out there since you are contemplating getting involved with pet trade. While I would love to have a HY. If I wanted to breed a parrot. I would go with is called the Gentle Giant..

Okay everyone beat me up. MY skin is thick. and my Rudy will bite you!

 

[plumsmum2005]

The important question here is 'why'? What are the birds getting out of this? These beautiful and intelligent birds are for a very specialist parrot keeper, lots of dedication, not really suitable to our front rooms. Do you care about putting youngsters 'out there' in less than perfect homes and if you get to hear that one of yours has been plucking, shrieking, even mutilating in years to come what would your feelings be then? My guess is, it's not my problem, they purchased the bird I just bred it?

Looking for some clubs and members in the Orange County area to sponge off of for a year or so before purchasing the birds.

What will you give back? Take, take, is a pretty selfish attitude, I can therefore I will is not an admirable trait. If you were asking 'where can I go to learn loads about these fabulous parrots' your post would have been met with different answers, excepting the constant enablers that would encourage raising anything and everything.

My recommendation is to spend some of your funds on going to Brazil to see and work with organisations trying to keep these birds in their native habitat. Help them fund some of it, give some in the first instance. Learn loads about them along the way.

You are young, what will you do when you and your wife want holidays? At such a young age I cannot see that foreign travel will be off the agenda for you both.

Many private collections do not benefit anyone except the owner, to keep the birds safe it is necessary to keep their location secret. What will happen when this 'phase' tires and you are 'bored of it' which is what I suspect will happen?

Have a think but most importantly have a change of attitude, no one owes you anything and the fact you have some $'s doesn't make you any more entitled than anyone else.

 

[LordTriggs]

Wasn’t asking for permission. I’m asking for information and community. I can read in a year what would have taken a lifetime for people even 10years ago. I have had reef tanks for 20years and delivered 15 litters of labradors. I also don’t have any financial constraints and all of the time in the world. I will be fine. This is the only negative post I will respond to so let’s keep it positive from here on out. I’m doing this and I will be awesome at it. Help me do the best job possible and let’s help these animals numbers grow. I’m an asset and I care deeply about helping these animals increase their numbers.

Okay now I am going to be as polite about this as I can be (I'd very much suggest an apology to people who are trying to help some parrots and in the same turn you)

Have you ever cared for a parrot? If not then the answer is simply to not dive right into breeding a pair, would you jump into the ocean if you've never swam in your life?

Birds aren't dogs, that's like me saying that I've raised 2 litters of kittens so I can easily raise a bear, we have so many people come on here saying they're going to breed birds because they've bred dogs or cats and then a few weeks later they come back with dead babies and questions.

What have you ever done in the past to prove you're an asset? What have you done to prove you're going to be 'awesome'? There are many many many people on here who know parrot care like the back of their hand and they wouldn't touch breeding with a 10 foot stick. Not to say no but right now you just don't know, you can read as much as anyone can, heck I've read so much on breeding myself but when it comes down to it I would have no clue.

I'm sure your vet is very happy about it, so is their bank account and their car dealer. They now know they have a steady income coming from you with at least 2 of the rarest macaws on the planet, that's some big $$$$$$$$

As much as you disagree with sage they do raise a very good point. What happens when you sell someone a $15'000 bird who begins pulling their feathers out who doesn't stop screaming at 5 in the morning? You'll have a pretty irate person on your hands demanding that you either fix the bird or give them their money back. Even if you give out perfect babies it is inevitable and arguably your responsibility to at least be able to help that person, and by help I don't mean just telling them their bird needs a mate which is what a lot of breeders wrongly suggest.

You will have to get hands on experience hand feeding babies and know the ins and outs of it otherwise you are going to damage those babies minds every time you have one hand-fed. Even if you plan on parents rearing them there will be times you have to step in to hand feed them. Reading up on it and watching video guides is just not enough to figure out the nuances of hand-feeding and even then you are going to have babies die, that's the unfortunate reality of breeding. Even the best will lose lives so you have to deal with that. On a side note I very much hope that you adopt a strict 'NO' policy towards selling unweaned birds because that's the most despicable thing anyone can do.

You'll also have to write the parrots into your will as they will almost certainly outlive you so you would have to figure out someone that they can go to and not just dumping them at a rescue unless you plan on donating a load of money at the same time, rescues are fit to burst as it is without the 2 biggest parrots in their care.

It is not impossible to become a good breeder but you need to do a lot of learning and training to become a good breeder. If breeding a bird was easy then they wouldn't be so expensive. As a side thing I would offer a kindly suggestion to dismount the high horse you're riding right now as it's very unbecoming to think so highly of yourself without any reason and a good way to alienate people fast.

 

[DiscoDuck]

Hey Plums,

I wonder if the local zoo Supervisor thinks similarly as you do. I live very close to a park that has a small zoo in it. Last year they called the State Police Park Rangers 3 times last year. The police wouldnt say why the zoo called. After that, I stayed away from the park for almost 9 months. until..

Because Rudy has had tens of thousands of pics, I search for them, Lo and behold look what pic i found https://www.visitwilmingtonde.com/event/spring-opening-%40-brandywine-zoo/31193/

On opening day of the zoo. I went straight to the office and asked them why did they call the police when they have a pic of a similar bird as mine inside the zoo. I got no answer. 15 minutes later nearly a mile away the police stopped on me the street and asked me to stay away from the zoo.

The encounter ended with, "they are on my side", told me "don't upset the staff."

I think the worst part of that is that few people visit that zoo, they could easily use me as an ambassador for free, but no.. they dont see me as a positive. anyways /end rant

 

[Kiwibird]

Welcome!

ALL breeders start with no experience and have to learn, I think it is something that is easy to forget (no, I'm not a breeder and have 0 interest in being one myself). Financially, you sound able to afford the best equipment and vet care for breeding macaws and the fact you state the avian vet you'll be working with knows you personally and breeds macaws himself is certainly a good place to start learning. If he's as good as you say, I'd imagine they'll be a whole lot of observation and learning from watching before any hands on working with very delicate and very expensive babies. Experience wise, you have none. You're the proverbial 16 year old who's getting a Ferrari. It's not necessarily that you won't be able to handle Hy's, but, you've never even kept any parrots before. It's a lot of bird to start with. Why exactly are you interested in them? Hopefully NOT the fact they're status symbols. Just because you can afford the "Ferrari of birds" doesn't make it a good idea to get a couple as your very first birds. I think people may have a bit of a different view if you'd tell us more about what you like about hyacinth macaw, macaw in general, parrots in general. People on here really love and are dedicated to our birds from tiny budgies to the largest macaws and view them as unique and precious individuals who have personalities and likes and dislikes. Parrots aren't dogs or fish, they're more like toddlers developmentally. While it may not be your intention, you are coming across as wanting status symbols or some kind of expensive hobby, not intelligent companion animals who will be with you for the rest of your life. Talk to us, tell us more about your interest in birds etc... and I bet people will warm up a bit more

As Hy's are EXTREMELY difficult to find, even as single birds, I'm also wondering have you already located a proven pair or how precisely do you plan on going about starting this venture? Unlike dogs in heat that will mate with any other dog in the vicinity, merely having a male and female parrot together during the breeding season doesn't necessarily mean they'll want to reproduce with each other. These are intelligent beings. If someone stuck you in a room with some random woman you may or may not find attractive or intelligent or funny, the mere fact she's there doesn't necessarily mean you'll want to marry her and start cranking out lots of kids, right? Parrots are very selective of their mate, as it is a lifelong partnership they'll be forging. This is especially true for large parrots, as their partnerships with their mate will span 65+ years! If you plan to purchase 'baby' (weaned juvenile) hy's, even if you can manage to find a male and female of similar age who are NOT blood related (inbreeding is a serious issue and will likely lead to sickly offspring with genetic issues or inability to reproduce at all), you'll have around 8-10 years before they're even capable or interested in breeding (the largest macaws take many years to reach reproductive age), and that's IF they're interested in each other.

Another possibility to consider besides breeding, if your intention is to contribute to the world through your work with parrots, might be to look at a hyacinth macaw or other macaw species as a companion parrot and focus your efforts on their 'education'. Being such intelligent animals (think Alex the African grey), with the time and resources you have puts you in the position of having a truly unique opportunity to be able to really work with a bird to the point of pushing the boundaries of avian intelligence. In my free time, I've taught my "3rd home" rescue bird to put together shape puzzles and identify shapes and colors with increasing accuracy. Imagine the possibilities you'd have working with a bird from a baby with the resources and time you have! And unlike breeding parrots, few people are getting into that due to a lack of public funding available and not being able to not have a full time job. But it sounds like that's not much of an issue for you since you'll be retiring at such a young age and are looking for something to fill your time by the sounds of it! Just an interesting alternative I thought of you may seriously want to consider since it's unique and not everyone can do it

 

[Carl_Power]

Why not start out with a small Parrot as a pet as the experience will be invaluable. Parrots are nothing like other animals at all. 2 pairs of breeding Macaws will be bonded to eachother so handling and raising them could prove difficult resulting in lots of hospital visits getting sewn up because thats an inevitable outcome when they bite you. If you do this then please please get a few years experience, this scares me x

 

[Flboy]

Wasn’t asking for permission. I’m asking for information and community. I can read in a year what would have taken a lifetime for people even 10years ago. I have had reef tanks for 20years and delivered 15 litters of labradors. I also don’t have any financial constraints and all of the time in the world. I will be fine. This is the only negative post I will respond to so let’s keep it positive from here on out. I’m doing this and I will be awesome at it. Help me do the best job possible and let’s help these animals numbers grow. I’m an asset and I care deeply about helping these animals increase their numbers.

One thing for certain, I am positive you are being too sensitive! You are asking for information and community. If I see you walking across the street into traffic and you may not realize it, I am to say nothing?
Looking at this as a purely business venture, you know you must look at, and understand every negative! To open a restaurant, you better know every aspect of every brick that builds it!
Looking at this as a pure act of love and caring, well, lost for words!

You need to surround yourself with knowledgeable, hard working, trustworthy people.
The need to open to criticism is essential! If your best guy says you may be wrong, ?the highwy or my way?

 

[Anansi]

Hello, and welcome to the Parrot Forums family!

Okay, bit of a rocky start here. Let's all take a beat and allow tempers to cool. As Kiwibird mentioned, all breeders start with no experience and need to begin somewhere. Now, you have developed an interest in breeding Hyacinth macaws and have come here for some insight as to how to go about it. I respect both your ambition and desire to learn. But let's make one thing clear from the outset. Name calling between members will not be tolerated, here. There are a host of different personalities on this forum, and as such disagreements are unavoidable. But we can all agree do so respectfully, yes?

You may feel that some of the responses to your posts were on the harsher side. But if you take a step back and view this from a distance, I think you might agree that you brought a howitzer to a knife fight. Fact is, everyone here is concerned with the safety and welfare of birds first. What you read wasn't so much an attack upon you, but rather a spirited defense of the birds that will eventually be under your care. Why? Because while there are many who take up an interest in breeding, there are few with the dedication , work ethic and moral fiber to be good ones. And a bad breeder almost always leads to neglected birds at best, and dead birds at worst.

So instead of taking offense at the perceived tone of those replying to your post, try instead to hear what they are trying to tell you. Think about it, if someone new to a particular venture in which you were an expert came to you and said they wanted to jump right in and start doing what you do, wouldn't the responsible thing be to warn them of the pitfalls of said endeavor? Things often look a lot easier and rosier from the outside looking in. Unfortunately, if that turned out to be the case here, it's the birds who would suffer.

I'm not trying to beat you over the head with this. If you feel a passion in your heart for raising Hy's, who am I to tell you not to do so? For all I know, you might wind up being some kind of Bird Whisperer. But I can say, in all confidence, that you have a lot to learn. And this is a good place to do so. And the two people you've already insulted (SilverSage and Plumsmum) are both quite knowledgeable about birds. And SilverSage is actually one of the most experienced breeders on this forum... one of the good ones I'd mentioned earlier... ie exactly who you want to be talking to!

All this said, I'm going to go back and do some editing of this thread. The spirit of the posts will remain intact, but again, name calling will not be tolerated. And I will ask that things remain on a more civil and respectful front from this point onward. Sound good?

 

[SilverSage]

I want to be clear. I’m not saying you shouldn’t breed birds because you aren’t experienced. As has been mentioned, I myself am an aviculturist. I’m not saying “only experienced people should breed,” because everyone starts at square one. My most common reason for thinking someone shouldn’t breed isn’t even relevant here because clearly you can afford supplies.

What I’m saying is only parrot lovers should raise parrots. I’m very concerned and I would be out of line if I said nothing. I’m even more concerned because as an argument you brought up that you have raised FISH rather than any sort of love of parrots. Parrots have extremely intense mental and emotional needs, and birds this big can sometimes need to be hand fed formula from a syringe FOR A YEAR. If it is a labor of love, that’s manageable for some. But nothing you have said even HINTS at love. If you are doing this for money or prestige, you will be tempted to cut corners on things like full fledging, abundance weaning, proper socialization, etc especially since the consequences of those actions might not show up for a decade.

And this is a forum; it is literally a place for us to give opinions. If you didn’t want any opinions, you shouldn’t have posted on a forum. In fact, this is one of the FEW companion parrot forums on the internet that is friendly to breeders at all.


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[GaleriaGila]

I commend the responding members and Moderator for the insightful, helpful, and caring input. Speaking of caring, I'm always proud of our CARE for birds. I think we succeed in putting that first... it's a real guiding light, and a major reason this site is so great.