Yellow feathers

[lucy1]

I'm after any opinions or advice to help with my freaky fid please!

Milo is now 11 months old and is just finishing his first heavy moult. When I got him at 4 months old I noticed he had a small amount of yellow in his tail feathers



I thought this was quite nice and made him a bit different. But..., since his moult the yellow seems to be spreading His tail is now mostly yellow with blue tips



and his wings now have a substantial amount of yellow in them - again yellow bases with blue ends on his primaries, secondaries and secondary coverts.



This on its own wouldn't be a problem (albeit a little weird), but there is an issue... The yellow bits are really weak and awful. Its not the lovely golden yellow on his front, it's a weak lemony colour, and seems to have a different structure to the blue. He is in good health and his blue feathers have a lovely glossy sheen, but the yellow bits are really weak and are deteriorating already.



And the WORST bit is that they are so weak that they actually break off at the yellow bits. When he crash lands or catches a wing on something when he flaps there's a good chance another feather will break off. The picture of his wing was taken several weeks ago, he has broken so many feathers now that he is effectively clipped without me having trimmed him! I guess I can see the positive side of a self-clipping parrot but it's heartbreaking watching them all break off



This was the result of a single play session!

So, does anyone know what this is? Any idea what is causing it and what we can do about it?

 

[Featheredsamurai]

This seems very concerning to me. When was the last time he saw a certified avian vet? Can you explain his diet to us?

The weakness in the color change is the most worrisome thing to me, it makes me wonder if it's the early stages of beak and feather disease. But I have no idea how this disease affects blue and gold macaws, I'm only speculating so don't freak out and panic. I'm hoping he just has a nutritional deficiency that the vet can give vitamins for...

If I was in your place I would get him to a avian vet as soon as they have a appointment available that fits your schedule to find out what is wrong.

 

[MarciaLove]

I agree with Copperarabian take him to a vet ASAP it sounds like it could be a disease or due to improper diet idk i hope he will be ok

 

[tab_xo]

I have no idea but could it be a mutation? Or if they have a colour mutation does that usually start when they are babies, not when they are finished moulting?

Definitely take him to the vet to see!

Has he moulted all of his tail? Or is that just his rough baby tail? Usually when they are younger they have very messy and breaking tails, with huge bits broken out along it! But when they moult it out it grows back nicely

 

[lucy1]

Looks like we're off to the vets then!

Just re-read my post, I should clarify when I say it's spreading since his moult, I meant as a result of his moult. The feathers grew like this, they have not changed from blue to yellow since they came through! They have grown as normal, just a different colour.

He has been tested for PBFD and had no contact with any other birds (except the Amazons, who have also been tested) and he does not have any of the listed symptoms - his feathers are growing normally apart from the colour.

Avian vets are few and far between in the UK but I'll take him to my regular vet as an interim until I can get to a specialist to see what he thinks. The smaller amount of yellow he had originally was clearly visible when he went last time and was not commented on as being a problem, it never occurred to me to ask at the time.

He's still young so no food phobias or obsessions to worry about. He's on seed rather than pellets but prefers fruit and veg (not a normal parrot!) to junk, unless there's a chicken leg on offer. He gets whatever fruit and veg is on offer so gets a good variety, with some beans/ pulses (never sure what the difference is between them), pasta or cous cous, limited bits of egg and chicken and a bit of anything going!

 

[triordan]

Have you contacted the breeder?

 

[MonicaMc]

Considering the colors, it actually does look pretty close to a potentially new mutation that many think *may* be spangle, but no test breedings yet to confirm.

You can see the birds in some of the links in the following thread.
http://www.parrotforums.com/macaws/32703-what-kind-macaw.html


Considering the yellow parts are very easy to break, I agree with the recommendation to get some thorough testing done with an avian vet and, if possible, contact the store/breeder where you got him from to see if there are any more like him.

 

[Alwese]

Very interesting. The part that bothers me is the yellow area is weaker, not just with color. Funny how mutations seem to show up in B&Gs first though. Here are two pictures of what showed up in B&Gs I have heard of. Click on picture to enlarge:

 

[lucy1]

Thanks for all the suggestions!

We've got kind of good news so far, but no real answers yet.

I spoke to the breeder who advised that he is not aware of any yellow mutation from Milo's parents, but yellow feathers can be a sign of vitamin A deficiency. I was devastated! I try really hard with his diet (he eats far better than I do) and he shouldn't be deficient in anything. I cried myself to sleep that night thinking I'd failed as a parront

But..., we had an appointment with the local vet the following day, who admitted he's no specialist but says the pattern and colouring does not match vitamin A deficiency. Also, my Amazons get the same food (with fewer nuts) and they are fine. He has taken photos and a couple of moulted feathers and is going to speak to a couple of avian specialists for me.

At a loose end before work, I decided to take Milo to see the breeder for another opinion. As soon as he saw him he agreed it's not the normal symptoms for vitamin A deficiency. He knows of one other B&G which developed odd yellow feathers and is trying to make contact with them for me. He also knows the UK's leading avian vet who retired recently and again has photos and will ask around for me.

Sooo..., the vet and breeder have so far drawn a blank. The problem we keep coming up against is that he had a few yellow feathers when I got him at 4 months old, and the Amazons are not showing any symptoms. This rules out most environmental and diet causes, leading back to it most likely being a freak throwback colour mutation.

He does show a similarity to the mutations on the link MonicaMc added - his tail is the same as the baby shown on top of the cage, and if you look at the wing feathers on the babies and the youngster being held by the car you can see their primaries are like Milo's - all frayed and tatty. Also I believe most hybrids don't show their final colours until they've moulted a few times (I could be wrong on this), so maybe this is why he's changed so much with a moult?

So..., we still don't know what's going on and will still welcome any suggestions, but it sounds like good news so far, we're just waiting for some real answers!

 

[Featheredsamurai]

Have the vets tested for cancer? It's very unlikely to be that, but worth testing for just encase.

That's fantastic that he sent a sample to a avian vet, hopefully there will be answers soon.

 

[lucy1]

We haven't done any tests yet, my vet wants to get an avian vet's input before we start doing any unnecessary tests that a specialist may be able to rule out visually or with an exam (I think his decision may have been aided by the size of Milo's beak...! )

 

[MonicaMc]

This is not a case of hybridization. What it is I don't know, and I could ask a group or two, but the main responses would probably be to do some testing.

 

[lucy1]

Apologies MonicaMc, I didn't mean to imply he is a hybrid, I just thought if hybrids take a few moults to show their final colours, maybe a mutation would too?
Either way I think we're in for a lot of testing...

 

[Featheredsamurai]

That sucks, testing is always expensive I hope they figure it out sooner rather than later so you don't have to pay for lots of unneeded test.

 

[MonicaMc]

Ah, I see. Well, as for hybrids, true colors may or may not be apparent as soon as they color out. It really depends on the hybrids and whether or not the parent species are different colors as adults vs as chicks... i.e. macaw hybrids you know what they'll look like as soon as they feather out!

Sun & jenday conures and red headed conure hybrid species all have an immature coloration and an adult coloration, so it may take a few molts for hybrids to get their adult colors.



There is grizzled/acquired pied, but it's not necessarily a mutation as it can't be reproduced. A bird that has that "gene' may be able to effect how the offspring appear, but otherwise cannot pass the gene down to future offspring.

Most mutations don't change as the bird molts, so what you see is often what the bird will appear like as an adult (not counting juvenile plumage into adult plumage). The one major exception that I can think of right now is the par-blue mutations. These birds may be more blue as offspring, but as they mature, their feathers may molt in with a green-ish hugh.


Although your B&G is similar in appearance to some of the ones I posted, I don't think he's the same. Could be wrong though.


If you can see it, there's been some new photos of the B&G's uploaded.

https://www.facebook.com/criadourom...57405319207.1073741825.100002848501592&type=3