venting about screaming (dont mean to offend anyone)

[gemini84]

ok guys i just need to vent, i see so many posts about screaming birds and one i read today about "getting rid of it" really pushed my buttons. i apologise if this post offends anyone, and i will admit that i dont have as much experience in bird behaviour as others on this forum, so i maybe percieved as ignorant but i need to get this off my chest.

A bird is a beautiful intelligent creature and uses skwaking as a way of communication, yes some talk but that is like us learning a different language. when times get tough we will use our native toungue in hope some one will understand.

no matter what breed, species u get they all make noise and for all different reasons. whether it be excitement, hunger, stress, fear, communication etc. they dont do it just to annoy you. yes depending on which species u get will vary the noise level for example a macaw will be louder then a budgie.

it is a responsibility as guardians to decipher what our feathered companion is trying to tell us. communication can not be "trained out" or "solved".

if you have a screaming bird, the only problem he/she has is a guardian that doesnt understand his/her needs.

an simple comparison is a baby, a baby will scream and cry to inform us that something is wrong and will continue to do this until the issue is fixed.
yes it can get frustrating, but you continue untill you find the problem.

when purchasing, rehoming or rescuing any form of bird or any animal for that matter you need to keep this in mind.

they wont just scream for no reason.

i recently just went through 2 weeks of prince screaming, he did this out of (what im calling distress) over bruno missing, trying to call him home.

every time my neighbour drives in the driveway prince and bruno will scream, this is out of excitement as they think their previos owner is here (same car).

every time my they here our car they will scream either because they are sad we are leaving or excited we are home.

they will scream every morning and evening, communicating with all the wild lorrikeets outside.

they greet me every morning with a loud sqwark to say goid morning.

im sure u get the idea.

so please do ur research when u decide to bring a parrot into ur life, and remember that unlike a baby who will grow up and learn to communicate in a way you can understand, a parrot will be the same way for upto and in excess of 50yrs. if u dont think you can handle this, then do the bird a favor and dont take him/her home.

sorry for the rant but its not fair to our feathered friends to be percived as having behavioural issues or a problem because we cant figure out what they are trying to telk us

 

[MarciaLove]

I agree its so true! It bugs me very much that people dont try to understand what their pets are obviously trying to tell them and just decide to throw them away! No one should take in any animals withought fully understanding the commitment and all the harder things that come with the pets like bird screaming.

 

[noblemacaw]

When I researched RFM I learned that they are very loud as babies. If you are able to weather out the loudness they make fantastic companions. This concerned me because I live in a town home. Granted I live in an end unit and am one of the original owners in our community I was concerned about the "loudness" of baby RFM's. I talked to Valentino's breeder a lot about this and when I learned she had a client that lived with TWO RFM's in an apartment I didn't worry about it anymore.

Fast forward to Valentino coming home. Valentino's calls are LOUD!! Once he was on my shoulder and called and my ear rang for half hour. I will admit the frequency of a RFM scream is within range of me being able to handle it. It is the really high pitched screams that I can't handle. (Only example I can think of is a Nanday conure. I watched my friend's Nanday for 6 weeks and her scream was almost unbearable for me) I am actually surprised Valentino does not scream more than he does. He will call to me certain times. When I get up and he hears me walk down the stairs he will call to me. When it is getting on dinner time and if I am late in leaving my office to come down he will call to me. During the day during independent play with Valentino KNOWING I am upstairs in the house he is quiet and will talk to himself. When I talk back to him he still does not scream. He has learned I will not come back down stairs until early evening or late afternoon.

Nighttime he can be loud. He does NOT like going to bed. He will scream if I begin forcing him to go to bed. This I need to change now that the new neighbor had bought the vacant house attached to my unit. They are a retired couple and I am sure Valentino's nighttime screams at 10:30PM will eventually be a problem so I must address this now. First I need not to egg him on. I am guilty of that but I love communicating with my parrot. I will need to slow down the bed time process so that Valentino feels I am spending time with him and not just feeding him and shoving him to bed (I do not do this but I think he feels that I am.) Even if I cannot eliminate the night time loudness completely once the main light is turned off and "Good night Valentino"is said and the stove light if left on he is quiet and will no longer scream or be loud.

I would never "get rid" of Valentino because of his voice. I may joke about de-voicing him (A VERY barbaric practice done long time ago to parrots to help with screaming. OMG! Freaks me out I know about it but I have been studying parrots for almost 30 years.) but I would NEVER fault my Valentino for being a parrot.

I know I expected Valentino to be a lot louder than he is but I also have establashed a routine with him and as for his screaming. He only calls to me in the morning when I first get up and if I am late going back downstairs after working and during our nighttime routine. He will call when I leave the house to do errands but the weird part of that is during the week when I leave the house and come back he does not call (probably because it is during his independent play time) when on weekends when Lupe is home..he will call to me when I leave and come home.

 

[haleybird]

Noblemacaw, people actually devoiced parrots? :'(

That makes my heart hurt so much....that is really awful. I dont even wanna google it, it will probably just make me really upset (angry and sad all at the same time).

And, I agree...While certain species are admittedly shrill, its all a part of parrot guardianship. I love the expressive nature of birds. Every part of it. its what makes them unique and quirky and precious. (I think this is also one of the many facets that makes me a macaw person lol.)

I just wish people would think about all aspects of parrot guardianship before getting a bird, hearing it scream or bite once, and then just dumping it...these are sentient beings, not living room ornaments!

 

[weco]

I agree Gemini. A couple of months ago, I told someone that there best bet might be to get rid of their birds.....they had only had the birds a short while, maybe a few weeks at most.....not any time to speak of. They had (done their research) & decided on...A...yellow collar macaw, but they walked out with two yellow collar macaws & they're call for help was that the birds were not paying any attention to them, rather they would just move away from the humans & stay by themselves and would bite (I think, but maybe not).

My recommendation/suggestion was totally based on the fact that they had not researched what would happen when two birds were caged together.....they brought home the second bird on totally erroneous/invalid assumptions, then, rather than research the true problem & devise a solution, they call for help.....that's why wally world & grocery stores put candy & other junk.....for the impulse buyers & birds don't need to be an impulse purchase!

I figured I would make a lot of people mad because of my suggestion, so I didn't go back to the thread.

 

[weco]

Breeders used to bifurcate (split) birds beaks, mostly 'toos, 'zons, greys & other large birds, and usually males, to keep them from injuring their mates.....and.....until the last few years, the Association of Avian Veterinarians condoned the practice...only changing the wording on their website in the past couple of years.....

 

[gemini84]

people need to really think hard when taking in one of these beautiful sensitive creatures. as weco said, they should not be bought on impulse. most that are bought on impulse are often better off in a new home.

here is an impulse story that really annoyed me, it is actually about my own sister (she has alot of experience in handling birds as her partner was a breeder)

a little while back (when i only had oxy) i had to babysit for my sister (told her i HAD to bring oxy). she luves about an 1.5 hrs away and i would have to stay overnight. my partner was also working in that area at the time so i hadnt seen him for a bit aswell. i went up a day earlier so i could spend some time with my not so better half (lol). oxy spent the first night at my sister's with her family as he couldnt stay with me at johns sisters (3 dogs 2 cats and a very rough toddler). everything was great, oxy was really well behaved and sweet to them.

when i arrived the next day my sister was tellung me how much they all loved oxy and all the stories from the night. she was in shock at how quiet and well behaved he was. she wanted one. i spent the next night at her house caring for her children.

i spoke with my sister and her partner about them wanting an alex.
i had seen an ad in the paper 2days before i went up that 1 of oxy's siblings was still available. they devided they wanted him, if he was still hand tame etc (they were about 6months old). that day when i got home i went straight round to the breeders he had gone the day before.

i rang my sister to give her the bad news.

2 days later she rings me asking questions about what oxy was like when i first bought him.
i explained he was shy but friendly, and she has to remember that for the entire time i had had oxy i was home all day every day spending time with him. i found out that day she found a guy with 6month old alex's that had actually bought her partners breeding pair.

they went round to get the baby, to get it from the cage it was in with its other siblings a pair of welding gloves were required (im sorry, but that should have been her initial signal), the burd was snatched from the cage and wing clipped.
she got the bird home and as u can imagine it was unhandleable.
thats why she had rung me, she wanted my advice and suggestions.

i told her that the bird will need time to settle in and learn to trust her. this could take days weeks even months.

3 days later i ring to see how her new friend is going. she had returned him as she couldnt handle it. its not what she wanted.

that poor bird was man handle and taken from here to there because even tho i tried explaining why oxy was such a good bird, she didnt have the patient and had to have one now abd expected it to be like oxy.

oxy is one of those rare alexs... doesnt screem, doesnt bite and at that stage lived cuddles. the one she got bit, screemed and hated people.

as u can imagine i went off my tree at her

 

[legal_eagle]

Hear, hear! Great message! While we need to live harmoniously with our parrots, we also need to allow them to be themselves!

 

[gemini84]

those are some dreadful stories about the devoicing and splitting the beak.
although i love the companionship and the love i get from gorgeous boys, sometimes i wish the human race had never taken them from the wild to be bred in captivity.

i guess all we can do now is try and do the best to protect the ones that are here.

 

[WannaBeAParrot]

Gemini, thanks for posting this. I was going to do something like it. I read that post you speak of, and I replied to it. I had to delete the rant and rave that was originally in my post because my first concern was to address the needs of the bird. But let me say, it was hard to hold my tongue (fingers). I just kept thinking -- why did you buy this bird -- what selfish reason could be worth bringing a new family member home that will live with you for the net 20 or 30+ years, but he didn't even do enough research to understand the noise level of a Sun Conure !! Then when a bird starts acting like a bird and sqwaking, he wants to GET RID OF IT. Makes me !@#$% angry. I love kids, but to be annoyed that the bird is keeping the baby awake is absurd. Didn't the guy remember that there was a little baby in the house when he was bringing home a noisy bird that would most likely act like a bird. I don't get it at all. Not at all. I hope so much that the guy finds a really good person to take the bird right away. Clearly, it's not going to work out for him to keep this bird properly at this time, and that would be negligent to keep him anyway.

Lets all pray for the birdie.

 

[noblemacaw]

Devoicing is a old old practice that no Avian vet would ever advocate or practice doing now. It is much the same consensus that is it a cruel practice much like debarking a dog is. I once heard a Blue and Gold macaw that was devoiced and it did make me cry even though the bird was healthy in every way.

Haleybird you would be horrified at some of the ways vets use to treat "pets" 30 or 40 years ago. I know I am but am glad most vets do not practice most of the procedures. For instance declawing cats. I know vets still do that but some also consider it cruel as well. Many years ago because of my Noble macaw and wanting to rescue a farm cat I had him declawed...NEVER AGAIN WOULD I EVER DO THAT. I didn't know, should of learned more about it but I felt so strongly about helping the cat and keeping my parrot safe. My current cat has her claws and she lives alright with my naughty RFM. I did my research and have a breed of cat with a very low prey drive (Ragdoll). Yes, I would never trust them together for any kind of contact but my cat also never bothered any parrot in the cage.

My ignorance cost my first cat his claws and I have to live with that for the rest of my life. To even make myself feel worse he had 7 toes on each front foot. I really loved that cat he was awesome.

 

[jendaymumma]

Bob, my handsome Jenday Conure came to our family from a rescue. I had made a phone call to the rescue prior to Bob coming home. Our phone call complete, the rescue didn't hang up on their end. I said to my partner, Kevin, "Listen, those voices are the macaws, and cockatoos". Then I heard another distinct rather loud voice and said, "and there is Bob. Can you hear Bob?" Kevin looked at me and said, "THAT'S BOB?"

We live in an apartment. Kevin was slightly concerned that Bob's vocals might not work out in our apartment. He's been with us 7 weeks now. He's a sweet, handsome, conure who needed to come home. He is vocal most often in later morning, afternoons (especially when we're playing) and every so often at night. For the most part, he's fitting right in more and more everyday. Can't imagine NOT hearing the BIG voice in that sweet little package.

 

[MonicaMc]

Well, there are "two ways" of raising babies... or dealing with babies when they cry.

You have one side that says to allow the babies to cry it out. That is, do not feed them, do not comfort them. Just ignore them until they quit crying

Then you have the other side that says to figure out why they are crying. Are they upset? Are they hungry? Do they need a nap? Do they need their diaper changed? Do they just need comfort?


My nephew was raised the second way, and generally speaking, he's a pretty happy baby. Ya, sure, there's the occasional fits and temper tantrums, and his parents can't handle him in public, but he's not one of those kids who cries or screams all the time.



And then we have parrots. Number one recommendation for a screaming parrot? Ignore it.



Huh. Makes sense, doesn't it?




_________________________

On the topic of getting rid of a bird because the owner can't handle the bird or it's behavior, well sometimes that's for the best. Sometimes birds require a more experienced hand. Sometimes the bird is *not* happy with the person who purchased/adopted them and simply needs an owner who he/she will like.

Was it wise for this person to purchase a noisy conure? Probably not, considering their household. Can they work through this? Probably. Could they handle the stress of a screaming conure that is frequently waking up their infant? Well, that's up to the owner... and if the screaming can't be instantly fixed, then it may be more stress to everyone involved (bird, owner, infant, family) to keep the bird rather than finding a more appropriate bird for the household.

Birds can indeed be noisy, but as per the post, the conure is screaming nonstop all day long if someone isn't around the bird. That is clearly not a good sign. But not all sun conures are like that. Not all sun conures scream throughout the day. He expected a noisy bird, what he didn't expect was a bird that screamed all day long.


So... would you recommend a person to keep a noisy parrot even though it's disrupting their life and causing stress to the entire family?

Or would you recommend to this person to find a more appropriate home for the bird where noise wouldn't be an issue and the screaming could be worked through without anyone getting stressed out or frustrated?

 

[gemini84]

i dont agree with the whole ignore the screeming, obviously he/she is expressing some thing.

ever consider that maybe the bird is bored and that why its screams all day?
maybe there is something the bird doesnt like that is causing him distress?

i wish the best for the conure in the thread that set me off on this, and yes it needs to be rehomed for its well being.

 

[Featheredsamurai]

The simple fact is that we, as humans, need to think like a bird. Understand all you can about the species, similar species, and body language. Dealing with something we don't understand can be frustrating, by understanding out birds and researching behavior we will set ourself, as well as our birds, up for success.

The post about the conure also upset me, mostly because the guy didn't do enough research and set himself up for failure. I hope everything is figured out, and he comes to understand his conure better or find him a fantastic home.

 

[gemini84]

a great example comunication is what happened with tab and fargo the other week. tab was feeding the horses and could here fargo screaming. she thought it was just cause he coukd see her (she didnt ignore him) although the reason forfargo's screaming was discovered once tab had finished and returned to fargo the 2nd time to find a snake slithering out her bedroom window.

there is a reason why they do it, whether it be occasionally or constant. if u find what the problem is, u and ur feathered friend will live alot happier.

every one seems to be advocates for rescuing, adopting and rehoming parrots.
if people would take the time to better understand what it is that their feathered friends want there woukd be less in urgent need.

i know and respect that other people here may have different opinions but this is how i feel on this topic.

 

[MonicaMc]

I wish many people felt the same way... but when parrots bite or scream or do any behavior that we deem as "bad", the number one recommendation is to ignore the behavior.

Bird screams? Ignore it.
Bird bites? Ignore it by taking the bite.


Ignoring the behavior is in no way figuring out why it's occurring in the first place, so it doesn't deal with the root of the problem. Rather than setting the bird up for success, he may unintentionally be setting them up for failure. I wish people could see this and it would be like a light bulb just "clicking on" and then they get it, but they most often don't... because that's how they've always done it.... that's how everyone else does it... that's how it was recommended for them to do it. Anything other than the "norm" isn't accepted because it's 'different'.

 

[Brodie]

There is always a reason!
I have had my fair share of scarlet and Ticka going through screaming stages, and every time, even if it took weeks, I had to figure out why. Because I knew it had to be something. They don't just scream for no reason.
Even if it as small as something like not getting their daily almond fix -_- lol

I have grown up with parrots, anything from budgies, cockatiels, ring necks, alexandrines, cockatoos, amazons ect, so I'm used to the noise. But nothing like how scarlet was the other day.. But I got through it, and no matter what, I would never, ever get rid of her. I got myself into this, I choose to care for them for the rest of my or their life's, and that is exactly what I'm gonna do, and I'm gonna do it at the best of my ability, because they deserve the world!

 

[Jtbirds]

Well let me out my two cents in this kinda debate now. Parrots do scream for things, but the is a classifiable behavior that is excessive screaming. This is screaming that can even be called a neurological behavior and is very negative and bad for the bird to do. This is seen a lot in cockatoos and seldom in other species but does occur. So if the birds screaming is in excess and may even be a neuro issue then it needs to be solved, and if not the bird will just develop worse and worse issues. There is an acceptable amount of screaming in which all birds should be allowed to do. They were born with that trait and need to express it. I don't agree with people punishing there birds with water bottles, yelling, etc... But I do agree if the screaming has gone to an all day point it needs fixed. This is we're I developed what I do to solve it, my method doesn't stop screaming it gets it adjusted to a normal amount again I would never want screaming to fully stop it is communication after all. I do believe that people that don't to there research and get a bird and then give it up is probably best if they do it the right way. Letting them keep the bird is asking for more and more issues , espically because if they didn't do the research in the first place they probably won't now...

There is always a reason but that doesn't mean that reason is for the birds good. In chronic screamers the reason fr screaming is to fill a void were they can't self entertain themselves and soothe there urge to scream. This is very negative for the birds an IMO should e solved as it is unhealthily. That's like a human doing drugs after there wife let them to fill the void. Screaming can release feel good hormones in the birds so it can then turn into the same kinda effect I suppose. So yes there is a reason, but is it an acceptable healthy one?

Next if you have never lived with a cockatoo that has screamed for hours, then you have never had what some people talk about dealing with. Imagine a jet engine going off in your house constantly... Yes people should have looked up more and so on, but they don't and now it is more expirences people's job to have to work and fix the issue. So this is why people end up rehoming because they don't have the knowledge and don't want to deal with other peoples advice, instead they just pick the easy way which is get rid of the bird.

 

[crimson]

gemini84- well said! you hit the nail right on the head with the comparison.

"an simple comparison is a baby, a baby will scream and cry to inform us that something is wrong and will continue to do this until the issue is fixed.
yes it can get frustrating, but you continue untill you find the problem."

I have to say it irks me when people get a pet without doing their research, it's often the animal who suffers due to a lack of understanding on the owners part... which is a huge commitment to keep any animal happy, healthy and content. Birds are unique, they are not like a cat or dog.
Not everyone is familiar with birds, their behaviour, temperment, etc.
What concerns me is that when people get animals, they can develop behavioural issues, and rather than addressing these issues, they re-home them, easier for everybody right?...wrong
the bird did not ask to be brought into your house, you brought the bird in. It should never be a 'well let's try and see what happens approach'...at the very least, you owe it to the bird to try and deal with it's behavioural issues, if and only then, after many attempts, if it still is not working, then maybe try and find an appropriate home, that's my two cents