Timneh Attack!

[Sweets66]

Is there someone out there who could please give me some advice...I have a Timneh Grey male, Georgie; he's 14 months old. Since he came to us at 3 months, he's had moments where each member of the family has been bitten, drawing blood at times, but he get's his beak smack, a stern "NO" and this usually sorts the problem for a time. Three days ago, we brought home Lucy, 2 1/2 month old Timneh female; Georgie & Lucy hit it off straight away. Georgie is happy for me to handle either of them, is normally calm, but since Lucy's arrival, he has taken to attacking my husband without provocation. for example, this morning my husband just walked past Georgie; Georgie flew at my husband, bit his ear hard, when my husband tried to defend himself, Georgie then latched onto his finger a drew blood! My husband is not a tolerant man; he shouted at Georgie loudly, it took all his might to not strangle this bird. Now Georgie won't come near my husband, other that to attack him. How can I stop this? Is there a way to stop this? If I don't find a way, I may have to consider finding Lucy another home as I suspect she my be the cause of his bad behavior.

 

[SillyBoy]

First off, please PLEASE do not smack his beak. The firm no is ok but smacking his beak can and will lead to loosing trust in you and could cause the biting to become worse. What I do is if one of mine bites, I tell them no and place them in their cage for a short time and walk away. After a short time I return, explain to them biting is a no no and let them out. Over time, they learned that biting mean cage time and they hate being put back during play time so it lessened a lot.

As for Georgie attacking your husband now that Lucy is here, he probably sees your husband as a love rival. He wants to chase him off so he doesn't take Lucy from him. I will be honest, sometimes this can be fixed and sometimes it can't. With my too, I just don't touch her when she is around my father *her love interest* if I do, I get bite but if I keep my distance, she is fine. BUT with my macaw it is a totally different story. I am her love interest and if ANYONE gets within a room of me when I hold her, she takes chunks out of me and then goes after them.

Hopefully someone with more experience on possessive parrots can chime in and help. But please remember do not smack him on the beak or anywhere else, he will loose trust in you and trust is a very very hard thing to get back once lost.

 

[Spiritbird]

Are you planning on these two birds breeding? I suggest you clip the male's wings as soon as possible. Yes, the bird is protecting his new mate from anyone or thing that he sees as a threat. Hitting the beak of any bird is not a good thing to do. You discipline by distraction and positive reinforcement. It sounds to me like you have created a breeding pair and they usually are not interactive with humans. Please read the articles on this page. They are very very good.

https://companionparrotonline.com/Member_Articles.html

 

[greycloud]

Excellent advice Sillyboy! I wrote the same thing out prior to you and lost it. I was just coming back to repost when I saw yours.
Do not rehome the baby. It has only been 3 days. Gwynns' world has been turned upside down.
Since he has had aggression behaviors in the past you may have to do a modified wing clip to protect the family. I only recommend this as a last resort.
He obviously does not trust or feel comfortable right now so it is important to not do anything to cause him to feel threatened right now.
Also, the new bird should have been quarantined from Gwynn. It is too late now as any illnesses that are hidden have been exposed to him.
It is always best to do a slow introduction. Gwynn needs extra love and understanding right now. He needs to be rewarded for ANY positive behavior, even if that is just sitting and playing. When he learns that good behavior is rewarded with yummy treats, verbal praise and NO physical punishment you will see an improvement.
Patience is the key and baby steps!

 

[4theBirds]

It is frustrating, especially with bond - pairing. The birds seem a bit young for this behavior. Patience is usually the solution. Your husband may need to work with the birds individually. I wonder if your two are housed together, is it possible to house them separately? It's also important to handle the bird which was acquired first, first.

Our first CAG, Paddy, was "bonded " to my wife. I was frequently nipped when handling Paddy if she was around, but when she was gone not. She h ad to be physically gone from the house; he somehow knew if she was in the house, even if she was out of sight.

 

[Sweets66]

Thank you very much for your response, I will most definitely change my discipline method. We bought Lucy to be more of a companion for Georgie that a breeding mate. On retrospect, I see that this was not a well thought out plan...

First off, please PLEASE do not smack his beak. The firm no is ok but smacking his beak can and will lead to loosing trust in you and could cause the biting to become worse. What I do is if one of mine bites, I tell them no and place them in their cage for a short time and walk away. After a short time I return, explain to them biting is a no no and let them out. Over time, they learned that biting mean cage time and they hate being put back during play time so it lessened a lot.

As for Georgie attacking your husband now that Lucy is here, he probably sees your husband as a love rival. He wants to chase him off so he doesn't take Lucy from him. I will be honest, sometimes this can be fixed and sometimes it can't. With my too, I just don't touch her when she is around my father *her love interest* if I do, I get bite but if I keep my distance, she is fine. BUT with my macaw it is a totally different story. I am her love interest and if ANYONE gets within a room of me when I hold her, she takes chunks out of me and then goes after them.

Hopefully someone with more experience on possessive parrots can chime in and help. But please remember do not smack him on the beak or anywhere else, he will loose trust in you and trust is a very very hard thing to get back once lost.

 

[Sweets66]

Georgie initially bonded with me, but is happy to have any family member handle him - sadly, I suspected that Lucy was the cause of his behavior...Many thanks for your suggestion.

It is frustrating, especially with bond - pairing. The birds seem a bit young for this behavior. Patience is usually the solution. Your husband may need to work with the birds individually. I wonder if your two are housed together, is it possible to house them separately? It's also important to handle the bird which was acquired first, first.

Our first CAG, Paddy, was "bonded " to my wife. I was frequently nipped when handling Paddy if she was around, but when she was gone not. She h ad to be physically gone from the house; he somehow knew if she was in the house, even if she was out of sight.

 

[paulhanlon]

Are you for real smacking a birds beak is no way to stop biting and you should never smack a bird anywhere may it be the beak or anywhere else on its body this bird is only 14 months old by smacking its beak you are lossing this birds trust and also by doing this you will make the bird think that you are a threat which will lead to consistant biting and alot of problems in the future as the bird will not know if anyone that goes near him/her means harm I surgest you stop smacking this bird a firm no is good enough but never smack the bird.

 

[Pookamama]

Are you planning on these two birds breeding? I suggest you clip the male's wings as soon as possible. Yes, the bird is protecting his new mate from anyone or thing that he sees as a threat. Hitting the beak of any bird is not a good thing to do. You discipline by distraction and positive reinforcement. It sounds to me like you have created a breeding pair and they usually are not interactive with humans. Please read the articles on this page. They are very very good.

https://companionparrotonline.com/Member_Articles.html

Thanks so much for this link! I've been reading the articles on and off today and learning so much!

 

[tharindhu006]

wow, those parrots look nice

 

[wildwest]

i would find one of your birds a new home. maybe Georgie since he has no trust in your husband.

 

[Oedipussrex]

It may just be the way you were focusing on the problem, or just the way you wrote it. but your post came across as rather violent, both the birds and your household members.
Stopping the smacking, and having the people in your house treat him whenever he is good will be a good start as others have said, as said a firm "no" is ok, as long as the bird knows what it means, and doesnt just take it as attention and continue to misbehave to get the attention. If this is whats happening, sometimes it is best to not aknowledge the behaviour at all and just put them back in the cage for a "time out" until they are behaving again - at which point you reward them for behaving.
*Yelling at him may just encourage screaming.

As for your husband there is absolutely nothing you can do to reconcile him and your bird. that is between your husband and the bird.

From the sounds of it he will have to work 500% more than the rest of you to earn back your birds trust, and still may only reach tolerance. Simply because you stated that your husband did not tolerate the bird at all (i am presuming, it may have been a harsh bite and warranted distress on his part as well) but it doesn't really seem that the love and patience is there to ever allow them to have a truly happy relationship.

Training does wonders for your relationship with the bird and may help their relationship. Even if he cannot handle him - You could pick a behaviour he does by himself, like talking, scratching, yawning, whatever (as long as it is a positive behaviour) and treat him for that, giving him praise, (if actually handing him the treat is too much just plop it in a bowl nearby) and then gradually get to the point where you can have him repeat that behaviour on cue. shaping a behaviour they already have is an easy way to start trick training which helps them learn trust, discipline and want to be with you.

It does look like the root of your problem will require you to address some defensive/hormonal/mating behaviours as well. I have no experience with these at all. But really the problems im trying to help with with my above advice are behavioural, and so may not help with all of the things you described...

From personal experience with my Ekkie: he tolerates all people, and loves most of them. however within the first few months that we had him, my father needed to get him back in the cage and pickle wouldn't come to him or step up. Having grown up in a rural area with many dogs and some farm animals, my father has a rather harsh idea of animal discipline, and thought nothing of simply picking pickle up by the feet like a chicken to get him back in the cage.
Obviously pickle hated that. Being an ekkie he is less outgoing and violent about his dislike for my father, but 1 1/2 years later, with no other incidents at all, and even being trained to wave at my father on cue (we have gotten him to step up a few times now), pickle has still not forgiven him. He runs to the other side of the cage when he enters the room, and has actually developed a much more sexist view of humans, being wary of any new older males he meets...

 

[Sweets66]

Actually, Paulhalon, we are for real...being first time parrot owners, we tend to take advice from people who we believe, know more about parrots than us first timers. Hence we were told by the breeder, no less, that this is the action to take should our parrot bite. Having at least 8 of his own well behaved parrots, shoot us for taking his advise! So, for all those on your high horses, please get down and give useful & correcting advise and save your criticism for someone who wants it! But for those who're wondering, the "smack' was more of a tap, we ensured that at no stage Georgie was ever hurt. Yes we did give Lucy to another home because we felt it was best for Georgie.

 

[Sweets66]

It may just be the way you were focusing on the problem, or just the way you wrote it. but your post came across as rather violent, both the birds and your household members.
Stopping the smacking, and having the people in your house treat him whenever he is good will be a good start as others have said, as said a firm "no" is ok, as long as the bird knows what it means, and doesnt just take it as attention and continue to misbehave to get the attention. If this is whats happening, sometimes it is best to not aknowledge the behaviour at all and just put them back in the cage for a "time out" until they are behaving again - at which point you reward them for behaving.
*Yelling at him may just encourage screaming.

As for your husband there is absolutely nothing you can do to reconcile him and your bird. that is between your husband and the bird.

From the sounds of it he will have to work 500% more than the rest of you to earn back your birds trust, and still may only reach tolerance. Simply because you stated that your husband did not tolerate the bird at all (i am presuming, it may have been a harsh bite and warranted distress on his part as well) but it doesn't really seem that the love and patience is there to ever allow them to have a truly happy relationship.

Training does wonders for your relationship with the bird and may help their relationship. Even if he cannot handle him - You could pick a behaviour he does by himself, like talking, scratching, yawning, whatever (as long as it is a positive behaviour) and treat him for that, giving him praise, (if actually handing him the treat is too much just plop it in a bowl nearby) and then gradually get to the point where you can have him repeat that behaviour on cue. shaping a behaviour they already have is an easy way to start trick training which helps them learn trust, discipline and want to be with you.

It does look like the root of your problem will require you to address some defensive/hormonal/mating behaviours as well. I have no experience with these at all. But really the problems im trying to help with with my above advice are behavioural, and so may not help with all of the things you described...

From personal experience with my Ekkie: he tolerates all people, and loves most of them. however within the first few months that we had him, my father needed to get him back in the cage and pickle wouldn't come to him or step up. Having grown up in a rural area with many dogs and some farm animals, my father has a rather harsh idea of animal discipline, and thought nothing of simply picking pickle up by the feet like a chicken to get him back in the cage.
Obviously pickle hated that. Being an ekkie he is less outgoing and violent about his dislike for my father, but 1 1/2 years later, with no other incidents at all, and even being trained to wave at my father on cue (we have gotten him to step up a few times now), pickle has still not forgiven him. He runs to the other side of the cage when he enters the room, and has actually developed a much more sexist view of humans, being wary of any new older males he meets...

Many thanks for your advice, we changed our discipline tactics immediately, gave Lucy to a loving parrot owner. It's been a month since her departure & Georgie is back to the sweet little bird he used to be. He is our "little person" and is with us every moment. he is deeply loved - we appreciate all your positive advice with thanks!

 

[wolf0994]

Glad to hear Georgie is back to being sweet. Also glad that you found a home for Lucy. May your family and Georgie have a wonderful life together!

 

[incognito]

All is well that ends well ...

hope everything will be alright in future... my advice think before you act,

your first haste was getting a second bird and then another haste was getting rid of ... anyways this is what i think