Please help ... heartbroken new lovebird owner

[flexney]

Hello from Southern California, we recently adopted a group of three very young lovebirds from a local breeder who hand raised them. We are a homebody type family with two teenage daughters, four cats, two small dogs, fish and a turtle. All of whom are deeply loved and pampered as family. I haven't had lovebirds, or any birds since childhood parakeets inthe long ago past. I spent a lot of time learning about their diets and needs, and we had a wonderful month together. They were so bright and busy, and fun. They loved free time closed safely in my large bathroom which they would spend peering at themselves in the mirror and nestling in my hair. Everything was going well until I surprised the family by cooking roast chicken for dinner one night in a Dutch oven. I kept them safe from open water, fire, the other animals, but in the time it took for my chicken to roast they all died. I couldn't believe it. One was on the bottom of the cage, one was still clinging to the side of the cage hanging upside down, dead. The third was wobbly but still alive, so i grabbed him up and ran outside with him. But he died a few minutes later. I am beyond devastated. I don't have a self cleaning oven. I didn't overheat anything. My Dutch oven has to be the cause, but i was sure that with the cast iron interior, it was safe. I can't eat, and I can't sleep. I did speak with an avian veterinarian who said that Teflon poisoning was the cause. How does everyone in the world not know this? I thought a cast iron pot was safe. Now I'm completely paranoid. If I am ever brave enough to bring new friends home, how can i know this won't happen again? How can I be sure that my cookware is safe? I've heard that other metals are deadly also. I'm grieving.... please help me.

 

[flexney]

I should also say that the birds' cage was in the living room, and that most our windows are open most all of the time. I can't believe they are all gone. It's been a week now, but i can't stop seeing their little bodies.

 

[Jen5200]

I’m so, so sorry you are going through this. It was an accident, but I can imagine how you must be feeling. I’m terrible with words, so I won’t try to be comforting - but I can see how much you obviously cared about them. I hope this won’t stop you from opening your heart to another bird in time. You sound like you are a great bird parent and I’m so sorry that this happened.

Teflon is one of those terrible things that is in so many products in our homes. Some of us just throw out our kitchen stuff and start over - checking that every product that comes into the house is pfoa and pfte free. I tossed my toaster oven, many small gadgets, frying pans, baking pans, my ironing board cover (yes some have teflon), space heater....it’s crazy how many things have Teflon coatings. Out went the candles, scented products, etc. We try hard, and hope that we don’t miss anything - that’s all we can do.

 

[LaManuka]

I’m so very sorry for your loss. Teflon seems to have made it’s way into so many things nowadays, you could not be expected to know. As far as cookware is concerned, plain old stainless steel appears to be pretty much the only type with no harmful coating to be concerned about. Unfortunately though Teflon also lurks in hairdryers, curling tongs, ovens, irons, all sorts of unexpected places. I’m sorry that your first post here has to be under such tragic circumstances, but your experience and sharing your story may just prevent someone else from unwittingly making the same mistake. Meanwhile you’ve come to the right place because we understand your grief and we are here to help you through this. I hope you can welcome a new feathered addition to your family someday.

 

[Allee]

I’m so very sorry for your tragic loss. I wish you were joining us in far happier circumstances. What you are going through is heartbreaking in so many ways.
I wish there was something we could say to ease your pain. It’s obvious you take responsibility very seriously, please try not to blame yourself, instead try to see it as the tragic accident it was and know that we understand and care deeply. This is a terrible reminder of how fragile our little feathered friends really are.

 

[Terry57]

I am so sorry for your loss, my heart is breaking for you.
Please know that we are here for you!

 

[ParrotGenie]

This is why I only use stainless steel for cookware as find quite a bit of pfoa and pfte in all kind of cookware and appliances. Other option is ceramic coated cookware. Also pfoa and pfte is also in hairdryers and heaters as well to keep dust from sticking in elements. So you have to be-careful when selecting these as well. Then if you are using a new heating appliance off-gas running it outside for a few hours. I also use two IQair purifers with V5 cell gas filter absorbs more than 250 pollutant gases and makes tobacco smoke, cooking fumes, and pet odors. As you have to worry about what people are also using around you.

Sorry for your lost and hope you will heal in time and you can welcome a new feathered addition to your family someday.

 

[Anansi]

I am so deeply sorry for your losses. As others here have said, teflon and other PTFE/PFOA type products are in so many more products than most would think. I tend to go ceramic, stainless steel or copper for my cookware, always looking for the tag that specifically mentions that they are PTFE/PFOA free.

You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers.

 

[Anansi]

Also, here is a link to a thread you might find helpful for your questions: http://www.parrotforums.com/general...e-s-pfoa-s-silicon-ceramic-cook-bakeware.html

 

[Laurasea]

So sorry for you loss!!! How horrific.
I use cast iron, I didn't Know there was some that had a nonstick coating added either. How terrifying. I wish they didn't make that stuff. I can't imagine something that can kill is good for us either, we've found out do many plastics are bad for us after all...
Just so sorry for your pain...

 

[Scott]

My deepest condolences for your tragic loss of three lovebirds. May their precious memories provide comfort as you grieve. I am glad you joined, so many of our members have endured losses for various reasons. We are here to support you.

 

[bonita]

Dear Flexney, First forgive yourself! That"s why they are called accidents.My husband turned on an overhead fan which killed Emmy my parrolett. I had warned him about the fan. You can only move forward. Blessings, Bonita PS there was most likely a teflon coating on the dutch oven. Netflix- The devil you know* watch it. Go with God. Bonita

(moderator insertion) *Documentary of Teflon and chemical issues: https://www.netflix.com/title/80997719

 

[wrench13]

Sorry for your. Teflon its chemical equals have killed more parrots than anything. And it is on everything,thngs you would not susspect.

 

[noodles123]

I am really sorry for your loss--I posted before and my intent wasn't to be insensitive. I am a problem-solver type of person, so in my eagerness to help, I can sometimes become too caught up in the details. I apologize if it came off the wrong way. There is just so much I wish I had known, and I tend to write from that perspective. Again, I hope that time heals all wounds and that you find the comfort, support and information you need to move forward.

 

[EllenD]

I'm so sorry for your losses, this is awful and unfortunately common. Very common. There was a family of long-time breeders of African Gray's who lost 40+ birds all in 10 minutes due to a space heater. It's not just "Teflon" that does this, it's any appliances which contain any parts with Fluorinated Compounds that off-gas when they heat up. These Fluorinated Compounds include PFOA, PTFE, and many, many others, and Teflon coating is just one product that contains these compounds. And no one knows about this, you're correct. And it's so sad.

The best thing you can do, the only thing you can do really, is to always call the manufacturer of any product or appliance that you might be intending to buy, and ask them a couple of questions:

#1.) Does this product contain any Teflon coating at all?
#2.) Does this product contain any fluorinated compounds at all?
#3.) Is this product safe for birds?
#4.) Does this product have the potential to off-gas any harmful fumes when it heats up?

a lot of companies are starting to be able to answer these questions, but many still cannot. So you just have to be very vigilant and never ever buy a product or appliance until you know whether or not it contains any fluorinated compounds that may kill your birds. Unfortunately right now that's about as good as it gets....

 

[SailBoat]

Very sorry for your loss. Warm Amazon Feather Hugs and Prays for you and your family.

 

[flexney]

Hi again, and thank you so very much for all of you who have welcomed me so warmly and who completely understand my horror. I will check those links ASAP. I'm really, really struggling at the moment trying to process what has happened to my little friends. I find that I can only start to talk about it in very short intervals, if that makes any sense. I'm not a PETA nut, but I guess I look at any living thing that comes into my orbit as an equal soul – from the plants in my garden to my dogs, cats and turtles. And, of course, birds. (While I now have no indoor pet birds, I host a dozen bird feeders in my yard.



Right now, I am feeling really angry about this. If the gas produced under heat is capable of killing a little bird, what is it doing to larger life forms? How is this legal and allowed? I have followed a few links, which largely seem to pertain to gases released to overheated metals, but my cookware was not overheated.



I'm rambling now and in tears again. Again, thanks so much for your kind words. Isn't it awful that so many people have to come to a place like this, with this exact burden and sadness??



Love, flexney (Dana)

 

[Scott]

Hi again, and thank you so very much for all of you who have welcomed me so warmly and who completely understand my horror. I will check those links ASAP. I'm really, really struggling at the moment trying to process what has happened to my little friends. I find that I can only start to talk about it in very short intervals, if that makes any sense. I'm not a PETA nut, but I guess I look at any living thing that comes into my orbit as an equal soul — from the plants in my garden to my dogs, cats and turtles. And, of course, birds. (While I now have no indoor pet birds, I host a dozen bird feeders in my yard.



Right now, I am feeling really angry about this. If the gas produced under heat is capable of killing a little bird, what is it doing to larger life forms? How is this legal and allowed? I have followed a few links, which largely seem to pertain to gases released to overheated metals, but my cookware was not overheated.



I'm rambling now and in tears again. Again, thanks so much for your kind words. Isn't it awful that so many people have to come to a place like this, with this exact burden and sadness??



Love, flexney (Dana)

Dana, was your avian vet certain their loss was caused by Teflon/PFOA? The evidence is overwhelming given the timeline, but other phenomena such as gas leaks or other chemical releases are possible.

Many of us know loss firsthand and understand the grieving process is lengthy and uneven. Please take care of yourself and know that in time the beautiful memories of your lovebirds will become more powerful than sadness.

 

[EllenD]

I would also assume it was the Dutch Oven based on the timeline and also just based on how common this is...I think the reason cookware isn't mentioned specifically when talking about off-gassing metals is because it's not technically the cookware but rather the coating (usually used for a non-stick surface either for cooking or for coating internal parts of an appliance to prevent fires and corrosion)...plus none of these huge manufacturers of cookware and appliances are going to want it to get out...Which comes down to greed.

Cookware including pots and pans, small cooking appliances such as Dutch Ovens, griddles, George Foreman Grills, etc., and then space heaters, air purifiers, etc. are all culprits...Tons of small appliances and also anything metal that is meant to heat up, such as baseboard heaters as well...And most of the world doesn't know anything about it...

We totally understand what you feel for your birds, our birds are our families too. It's no different than losing a child or loved one to me, as they are my children quite literally, as I couldn't have human children...So I definitely get it. You're not alone...

 

[Tami2]

I am so terribly sorry for your loss. :smile016: