Picky eater/fatty liver/weight help

[LoveMyConlan]

My Red Lored Amazon was recently at the vet again for a health check. Her blood test results from this visit show that we have lowered her liver counts!! Her first visit test had high levels and the vet said she probably had fatty liver disease. But we have lowered the levels a bit in just a few months!! For those unfamiliar with this Amazon, she's a rescue that was given to me months ago who I've been working with. She has cataracts and has low vision. After looking over her more on this visit, my vet seems to think that she's older than what we were told. I was told she's 21 years old. The import band on her foot and her looks makes my vet think she's closer to 40-50 years old.

My problem is she needs to gain weight. Her chest and abdomen are V shaped instead of round. But she needs to gain HEALTHY weight. She came to me on dollar store seed and shelled peanuts for food. She is now on a fruit and nut mix and Parrot seed mix by Higgens.

Getting her to eat anything other than her seeds and nuts is still hard. I've tried eating with her, making new foods fun and interesting, baking them so they are crunchy, offering sweet Patato fries (baked), offering enrichment toys that have both her favorite things and the good stuff.... But she turns her nose.

I've recently discovered her LOVE of Chinese fried rice... She all but leapt into my bowl. But I know she can't have that.

Is there anything healthy but high calorie she can have that I can try? My vets opinion is that either A) we let her live her life out and give her what she wants to keep her happy. Or B) we cut all nuts from her diet (which is about all she'll eat without me shoving it on her mouth).

But I'm worried that cutting what she will eat on her own will cause her to lose weight. The vet mentioned the possibility of having to force feed her, give her sub q fluids to keep her energy up, and basically forcing her to either starve or eat what she needs to eat to make her better I couldn't do that to her after how far we've come. She's gained weight since she came to me but to try to pull her back to healthy she needs to be on a strict diet.

What do you all recommend? What foods can she have that will get her weight up without adding to the liver issue?

 

[Scott]

My vets opinion is that either A) we let her live her life out and give her what she wants to keep her happy. Or B) we cut all nuts from her diet (which is about all she'll eat without me shoving it on her mouth).

But I'm worried that cutting what she will eat on her own will cause her to lose weight. The vet mentioned the possibility of having to force feed her, give her sub q fluids to keep her energy up, and basically forcing her to either starve or eat.../QUOTE]

Thank you for caring and loving this fragile and long-lived Red Lored! You've clearly outlined the ethical gulf between choices A and B. Most parrots will not literally starve when "deprived" of their choice foods, but an elderly and underweight bird may not be a good candidate for easy conversion. You might try withholding seeds for a day and offer a wide variety of vegetables and fruits. Perhaps blending a nutritious "smoothie" of fresh foods and veggies would be attractive?

IMHO the force-feeding method would be the very least palatable.

 

[Loko]

I think the choice is yours to make, but if it were me Id probably shy away from the force feeding route due to the birds age. Shes old and probably went through some rough times to end up in a rescue, so Id probably just let her live her days out in peace. If she were younger and healthier Id think differently but at 40-50 years of age I personally wouldnt put her through that. If you think shes got it in her and it would make a huge difference though, its your choice.

 

[LoveMyConlan]

My vets opinion is that either A) we let her live her life out and give her what she wants to keep her happy. Or B) we cut all nuts from her diet (which is about all she'll eat without me shoving it on her mouth).

But I'm worried that cutting what she will eat on her own will cause her to lose weight. The vet mentioned the possibility of having to force feed her, give her sub q fluids to keep her energy up, and basically forcing her to either starve or eat.../QUOTE]

Thank you for caring and loving this fragile and long-lived Red Lored! You've clearly outlined the ethical gulf between choices A and B. Most parrots will not literally starve when "deprived" of their choice foods, but an elderly and underweight bird may not be a good candidate for easy conversion. You might try withholding seeds for a day and offer a wide variety of vegetables and fruits. Perhaps blending a nutritious "smoothie" of fresh foods and veggies would be attractive?

IMHO the force-feeding method would be the very least palatable.

Unfortunately fruit and vegetables are hard to get onto her. I've tried chop, puree, dried, baked, steamed..... She loves crunch but I can never get they the consistency of a chip :/

 

[Loko]

My vets opinion is that either A) we let her live her life out and give her what she wants to keep her happy. Or B) we cut all nuts from her diet (which is about all she'll eat without me shoving it on her mouth).

But I'm worried that cutting what she will eat on her own will cause her to lose weight. The vet mentioned the possibility of having to force feed her, give her sub q fluids to keep her energy up, and basically forcing her to either starve or eat.../QUOTE]

Thank you for caring and loving this fragile and long-lived Red Lored! You've clearly outlined the ethical gulf between choices A and B. Most parrots will not literally starve when "deprived" of their choice foods, but an elderly and underweight bird may not be a good candidate for easy conversion. You might try withholding seeds for a day and offer a wide variety of vegetables and fruits. Perhaps blending a nutritious "smoothie" of fresh foods and veggies would be attractive?

IMHO the force-feeding method would be the very least palatable.

Unfortunately fruit and vegetables are hard to get onto her. I've tried chop, puree, dried, baked, steamed..... She loves crunch but I can never get they the consistency of a chip :/

They sell veggie and fruit "chips" for birds. Not sure if the nutritonal value is lowered at all but better than nothing.
I wouldve mentioned grinding up some nutrtional veggies with, say double the amount of a fruit or veggie she does like so it keeps the taste, but I see you said she wont eat that either.

 

[Flboy]

Try some of the freeze dried veggies. For sure trash, but may be a stepping stone. Biggest hurdle is to avoid the salt!
My thought is to swap out one junk food for another that is a gateway into real food!
Example, I started my kids on fried shredded Brussel sprouts, with parm cheese. Garbage? Yes, but they will eat those things any way I throw them at them! They have developed that desire for bitter!

 

[SailBoat]

Thank-you, for bringing this Amazon into your life.

Based on you having her for 'several' months, its really early regarding her not expanding her diet. We are usually deep into the second year before we see real movement towards an improved diet. You just need to keep providing!

Honestly, at this point you are still working on her becoming part of your family. Eating with the family is very important in both social group bonding and expanding their diet interests. Breakfast tends to be one of the best for trying new things.

Since weight is a basic as part of any Avian Vet visit, which way has her weight moved since your last visit?

If a blood test was included with the first visit months ago and again now. Those two tests should show direction and provide insight as to the status of the Liver. Any direction regarding those tests.

FYI: I strongly recommend that you get copies of the finds of each Vet visit and also any tests conducted for your tracking and history file.

 

[LoveMyConlan]

Thank-you, for bringing this Amazon into your life.

Based on you having her for 'several' months, its really early regarding her not expanding her diet. We are usually deep into the second year before we see real movement towards an improved diet. You just need to keep providing!

Honestly, at this point you are still working on her becoming part of your family. Eating with the family is very important in both social group bonding and expanding their diet interests. Breakfast tends to be one of the best for trying new things.

Since weight is a basic as part of any Avian Vet visit, which way has her weight moved since your last visit?

If a blood test was included with the first visit months ago and again now. Those two tests should show direction and provide insight as to the status of the Liver. Any direction regarding those tests.

FYI: I strongly recommend that you get copies of the finds of each Vet visit and also any tests conducted for your tracking and history file.

I can't remember her exact weight, but she did put on some grams. I'd have to get copies from the vet to know for sure how many. But he was happy to see her gaining weight. It wasn't a huge amount though but it was better than before. Her face is fuller and she isn't so thin. Before you could see everything

Her liver levels have come down since the first visit back in April, but they are still elevated. Her CBC counts all looked good this time as well. Her gram stain from before showed yeast, and she was placed on medication. Her poo smelled so bad but after the meds it's been normal. We retested her this visit and she was all clear.

She saw a great avian groomer the other day and had a spa day! Nice break trim and buff, nail trim, good foot scrub, and a bath with a special bird cleanser and moisturizer. Plus got her nares flushed again. She came out looking so much better! Even the vet was impressed at how much better her feathers and beak looked.

And the groomer took her time and made everything slow so she didn't get to upset. Took over an hour, they stopped and took breaks to let her relax, and cost me about $100 but it was worth it

I'm setting a follow up with the vet for just a physical when my Conures go in for their yearly check in February. So hopefully I can get her weight up. She is more than happy to eat her favorite foods, take baths on the sink, drink her water, and loves to sit on my lap or run around on the floor. She'll place her beak on the floor and walk forward line a walking cane as she moves around. She super chatty and loves to sing with me, so I know that even though she's having issues with liver and her looks, she's a happy girl

 

[plumsmum2005]

Hi well done you for what you are trying to do for your bird. Only one suggestion, have your tried Nutriberries? Pellets and seeds in one tasty ball.

 

[LoveMyConlan]

I did try Nutriberrys. My Conures love them so I bought a small batch for her. And I even Sat with her and ate caramel popcorn to make her think I was eating the same thing... Nope. She wasn't fooled lol

 

[plumsmum2005]

Just leave some in her dish where seed usually lives and see if she trusts them after a bit?

 

[Anansi]

Congratulations on all you've managed so far! I think you're doing an incredible job!

Just remember that the food transition is more often a marathon than a sprint. Be persistent with offering fruits and veggies. Keep trying different things. Whole, chopped, grated, steamed, raw, served very warm, served room temp, crunchy, mushy... wash, rinse, repeat. Some birds are just very stubborn about what they'll try.

Btw, have you ever tried mixing a little virgin coconut oil with their veggies? My birds go crazy for it! Or pomegranates? Rare is the bird who will turn down a pomegranate.

 

[plumsmum2005]

Congratulations on all you've managed so far! I think you're doing an incredible job!

Just remember that the food transition is more often a marathon than a sprint. Be persistent with offering fruits and veggies. Keep trying different things. Whole, chopped, grated, steamed, raw, served very warm, served room temp, crunchy, mushy... wash, rinse, repeat. Some birds are just very stubborn about what they'll try.

Btw, have you ever tried mixing a little virgin coconut oil with their veggies? My birds go crazy for it! Or pomegranates? Rare is the bird who will turn down a pomegranate.

I have that bird LOL

 

[plumsmum2005]

Re the Special Fried Rice liking, how about cooked brown rice, most birds love rice, sprinkle on top of some veggies which will help with at least getting some on her beak.

 

[Anansi]

Congratulations on all you've managed so far! I think you're doing an incredible job!

Just remember that the food transition is more often a marathon than a sprint. Be persistent with offering fruits and veggies. Keep trying different things. Whole, chopped, grated, steamed, raw, served very warm, served room temp, crunchy, mushy... wash, rinse, repeat. Some birds are just very stubborn about what they'll try.

Btw, have you ever tried mixing a little virgin coconut oil with their veggies? My birds go crazy for it! Or pomegranates? Rare is the bird who will turn down a pomegranate.

I have that bird LOL

Hahaha! That's because Plum is a notorious mischief maker! He just likes to be contrary! Lol!

 

[janquito]

I'm so glad to hear that you rescued this bird! I have liver disease. My #s were over 100. It took approximately a year to get them down to normal. I was taking vitamin E. I wonder if giving that to your bird would help? It was on my doctor's recommendation that I take vitamin E as he couldn't figure out why I have this disease. Maybe ask your vet how much to give her. Best wishes!

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