Next parrot for me?

[Sa_2503]

I currently have a cockatiel that I love, but recently I have been thinking about having another bird. I want something larger (I have some experience dealing with macaws), but not overwhelming. I have the time, money, and commitment for a larger bird, I would prefer that they don't live longer than me (no macaws, no cockatoos, no amazons). I also have a 12-year-old brother that knows boundaries and respects them (No unsupervised handling time until he is old enough). My dad is a huge animal lover and my mother likes parrots in particular (she grew up with several Orange-fronted Parakeets). Noise is not really a problem (right now). I have been looking into Eclectus (love them, but the information in their diet is confusing. Still they are at the top of my list), mini macaws, Ringneck Parakeet, Green cheek conure, etc. There is also that at one point in their life they may have to live in an apartment. I live in Mexico City, and there are no rescues or sanctuaries to interact with large birds or adopt. I have already looked into a breeder that it's professional and will allow me to hand-raise my bird (my cockatiel was hand raised by me, and I liked that experience). That's the end of this long post.

Any suggestions as for birds?
Opinions?
Constructive criticism?
The good, the bad, and the ugly of some of these parrots?

 

[noodles123]

Do you have time to devote to both birds in totally separate spheres if they do not get along (e.g., 4 hours out of cage for you, and other 4 hours out of the cage for you, for a total of 8 daily long-term?), and can you always be in the room to supervise if they seem to get along?

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird...I know, people have done it, but that is a huge gamble when a life is on the line.

Getting a second bird (in any setting) is super risky in terms of behavior and diseases...and it can also lead to hormonal issues. It's a gamble, so you should only do it if you have the time and money to quarantine in separate rooms and cages initially, while providing for separate interaction time if they don't get along, and constant supervision even if they seem like they do get along. A size difference between birds can also prove fatal in a moment of anger or irritation. It could also lead to you being the "third- wheel" and cause them to dismiss you, or feel jealous.

Larger birds also cost way more than smaller birds (even though small birds aren't cheap at all)...With something large--- you are looking at probably $80,000 plus for lifetime cost because they live forever (50-100 years), are far more destructive in terms of toys and require larger housing etc--plus, a big bird could easily kill your tiel in a moment of frustration...and don't forget that a larger bird can TEAR YOU UP if (same goes for your other bird).

Do not seek to hand-raise another bird-- it's pretty risky and it doesn't help with bonding in the long-run. If you decide to get a bird, wait for it to be weaned before adopting because it is better for the bird and it will not harm your bond.

Finally, a powder-down bird like a cockatiel shouldn't be housed in the same home with a Macaw ever due to a known allergen specific to Macaws-- it's a hypersensitivity to powder-down and it's pretty common in Macaws...no mini-macaws either-- just not safe...and even if it were, they are too large for any apartment and far too loud.

 

[Ira7]

If you don’t want a bird that will live longer than you, I’m sure you can arrange that with a horrible diet and poor care. Plus, you already know how long you’re going to live? Can you teach the rest us the secret to knowing that?

Seriously, that should not be on the list of priorities for any species decision.

 

[noodles123]

If you don’t want a bird that will live longer than you, I’m sure you can arrange that with a horrible dirt and poor care.

Seriously, that should not be on the list of priorities for any species decision.

False---
There is a massive difference between a parakeet/cockatiel/quaker etc lifespan VS a Macaw, CAG/TAG, cockatoo or Amazon..(yes, poor care can kill them all quickly, BUT if you adopt a larger, long-lived bird, you have to plan for larger expenses and longer-term care and you are looking at potentially having to bounce that bird from home-to-home if you get too old to care for it or other life events interfere over time).

To dismiss lifespan when considering adopting a new bird, given the trauma of having to send a bonded bird to a new home, is simply irresponsible....not to mention the financial implications of making such a commitment without having considered the dent it will put in your wallet over time..

Yes, it has to be done sometimes (and some people plan responsibly and life still gets in the way), BUT there is a big difference between caring for a bird in your 20's/30's as opposed to your 80s/90s...and if you have to write your bird into your will, that is another huge issue...An issue that is far less likely when it comes to smaller birds.

With larger birds, you are basically getting married to them (regardless of children, jobs, moves, partners, travel, sickness, finances etc)...if you are 20, it literally could be a daily expense and responsibility for the rest of your life...and if you are significantly older, I would not suggest getting a baby bird from a breeder if they are a long-lived variety, as that is just short-sighted in many respects.

Ira- I can tell you right now that a Golden Retriever could NEVER live beyond 20 years...In fact, the world record is 19. Now, consider the fact that historically, certain species of parrots have lives beyond 120 years of age, and tell me that there is no point in planning...The average tiel doesn't usually live past 20 (that's on the high end)...Again, you MUST consider lifespan when getting a bird. These are living creatures and when you take one in, you ARE THEIR FLOCK...they bond very closely...it's kind of a HUGE deal.

 

[shinyuankuo]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.

I think it depends on where you live location wise. We live in a college town in the middle of PA, so Winston does not really bother people here. He's fairly quiet as a large bird, too. BUT, I think it's because we are lucky. Every bird has their own personality and preference. You can have a loud ekkie because they have the capability of being loud.

Diet-wise, there are wonderful chop posts shared by many members. You just have to give at least 80% veggies and some fruits. I supplement with TOPS pellets, but never make pellets the primary diet. Some ekkies are more difficult than others. I again think we got luck out with Winston.

If I were you, I'd be concerned about mixing a tiel and an ekkie. Ekkie certainly can kill the tiel if they fight. They will have to be separated and supervised ALL THE TIME. I think a green cheek might be a better size comparison. They need to be somewhat similar in size to balance the power game in my opinion.

 

[Ira7]

If you don’t want a bird that will live longer than you, I’m sure you can arrange that with a horrible dirt and poor care.

Seriously, that should not be on the list of priorities for any species decision.

False---
There is a massive difference between a parakeet/cockatiel/quaker etc lifespan VS a Macaw, CAG/TAG, cockatoo or Amazon..(yes, poor care can kill them all quickly, BUT if you adopt a larger, long-lived bird, you have to plan for larger expenses and longer-term care and you are looking at potentially having to bounce that bird from home-to-home if you get too old to care for it or other life events interfere over time).

To dismiss lifespan when considering adopting a new bird, given the trauma of having to send a bonded bird to a new home, is simply irresponsible....not to mention the financial implications of making such a commitment without having considered the dent it will put in your wallet over time..

Yes, it has to be done sometimes (and some people plan responsibly and life still gets in the way), BUT there is a big difference between caring for a bird in your 20's/30's as opposed to your 80s/90s...and if you have to write your bird into your will, that is another huge issue...An issue that is far less likely when it comes to smaller birds.

With larger birds, you are basically getting married to them (regardless of children, jobs, moves, partners, travel, sickness, finances etc)...if you are 20, it literally could be a daily expense and responsibility for the rest of your life...and if you are significantly older, I would not suggest getting a baby bird from a breeder if they are a long-lived variety, as that is just short-sighted in many respects.

Oh, I can’t believe you don’t get the point.

Plus, his younger brother is 12.

 

[noodles123]

Even if his brother is 12, he could be in his 30s--in theory (it's not uncommon for people to be 14 years older than siblings---and half siblings can have even larger age differences if the mom is young and dad is old). I think that planning for age matters and that with proper care, some birds live forever.

 

[noodles123]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.


I think it depends on where you live location wise. We live in a college town in the middle of PA, so Winston does not really bother people here. He's fairly quiet as a large bird, too. BUT, I think it's because we are lucky. Every bird has their own personality and preference. You can have a loud ekkie because they have the capability of being loud.

Diet-wise, there are wonderful chop posts shared by many members. You just have to give at least 80% veggies and some fruits. I supplement with TOPS pellets, but never make pellets the primary diet. Some ekkies are more difficult than others. I again think we got luck out with Winston.

If I were you, I'd be concerned about mixing a tiel and an ekkie. Ekkie certainly can kill the tiel if they fight. They will have to be separated and supervised ALL THE TIME. I think a green cheek might be a better size comparison. They need to be somewhat similar in size to balance the power game in my opinion.

I have lived in a an apartment with mine and I wouldn't do it again- I think some of it comes down to the owner, but a lot of it also depends on neighbors and policy (too much of which we cannot control). For instance, if a neighbor overheats a teflon pan or smokes weed, your bird could die. Apartment living is sometimes impossible for even the best bird owner..
If your unit sprays for bugs or paints the halls, your bird could die.
If your bird screams, you could get kicked out (and Eckies are known to be much quieter than macaws and other large birds-while they are not "quiet", they are some of THE quietest large birds out there).
it's just a lot of risk--- it worked out for me (but it was SOOOOO much stress) and it was dangerous for the bird---way harder than renting a home and housing a bird. Plus, in species designed to fly 45 miles per day, a small apartment doesn't even come close to adequate (neither does a house, but at least there is enough room to potentially fly without smashing into something).
Plus- I am not sure that an Eclectus can be housed with a powder-down bird like a tiel...and like I said, they are the quietest large bird I know of (as a rule)---even if they are still loud.
Birds also change A LOT when they hit puberty-- including noise levels and aggressive behaviors---and with larger birds, these tend to happen within years, as opposed to months-to-a-year (which leaves a lot of time to inadvertently establish bad habits and reinforce behaviors that will eventually become sexual/ fuel for screaming etc).

 

[chris-md]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.
..

I feel like you’re trying to put a round peg in a square hole here. It seems like you’re saying “big birds absolutely can. But nothing bigger or louder than my bird”. So really they can’t, but eclectus can. You guys are actually agreeing here.

Noodles is also correct, you absolutely have to take lifespan into account when bringing a new bird into your life. Many well cared for larger birds have a high likelihood of outliving their owners. That’s no small topic that needs to be addressed, as it involves willing the bird to someone and having backup plans.

 

[shinyuankuo]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.
..

I feel like you’re trying to put a round peg in a square hole here. It seems like you’re saying “big birds absolutely can. But nothing bigger or louder than my bird”. So really they can’t, but eclectus can. You guys are actually agreeing here.

Noodles is also correct, you absolutely have to take lifespan into account when bringing a new bird into your life. Many well cared for larger birds have a high likelihood of outliving their owners. That’s no small topic that needs to be addressed, as it involves willing the bird to someone and having backup plans.

The paragraphs after apartment is actually directed to OP not Noodles. (Facepalm for my bad). So in a sense, we are not actually disagreeing (except the apartment part).

I agree with the risks. I’m just saying there’s more to consider when we say an apartment. My apartment is relatively risk free, but I’d think an apartment in NYC is very different from what I experience. It can work, but it depends on a number of stuff.

 

[Sa_2503]

Do you have time to devote to both birds in totally separate spheres if they do not get along (e.g., 4 hours out of cage for you, and other 4 hours out of the cage for you, for a total of 8 daily long-term?), and can you always be in the room to supervise if they seem to get along?

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird...I know, people have done it, but that is a huge gamble when a life is on the line.

Getting a second bird (in any setting) is super risky in terms of behavior and diseases...and it can also lead to hormonal issues. It's a gamble, so you should only do it if you have the time and money to quarantine in separate rooms and cages initially, while providing for separate interaction time if they don't get along, and constant supervision even if they seem like they do get along. A size difference between birds can also prove fatal in a moment of anger or irritation. It could also lead to you being the "third- wheel" and cause them to dismiss you, or feel jealous.

Larger birds also cost way more than smaller birds (even though small birds aren't cheap at all)...With something large--- you are looking at probably $80,000 plus for lifetime cost because they live forever (50-100 years), are far more destructive in terms of toys and require larger housing etc--plus, a big bird could easily kill your tiel in a moment of frustration...and don't forget that a larger bird can TEAR YOU UP if (same goes for your other bird).

Do not seek to hand-raise another bird-- it's pretty risky and it doesn't help with bonding in the long-run. If you decide to get a bird, wait for it to be weaned before adopting because it is better for the bird and it will not harm your bond.

Finally, a powder-down bird like a cockatiel shouldn't be housed in the same home with a Macaw ever due to a known allergen specific to Macaws-- it's a hypersensitivity to powder-down and it's pretty common in Macaws...no mini-macaws either-- just not safe...and even if it were, they are too large for any apartment and far too loud.

Thank you! I am okay with them not bonding with each other (wasn't going to house them together out of fear). I may be able to get an older bird if the breeder agrees to it. Thank you for the macaw information! Also, the apartment is not a definitive thing. I may go to college and live in my parent's house all the time (there are no residential colleges in Mexico) and move out to a pet-friendly apartment, where my bird won't be the only sound.

 

[Sa_2503]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.

I think it depends on where you live location wise. We live in a college town in the middle of PA, so Winston does not really bother people here. He's fairly quiet as a large bird, too. BUT, I think it's because we are lucky. Every bird has their own personality and preference. You can have a loud ekkie because they have the capability of being loud.

Diet-wise, there are wonderful chop posts shared by many members. You just have to give at least 80% veggies and some fruits. I supplement with TOPS pellets, but never make pellets the primary diet. Some ekkies are more difficult than others. I again think we got luck out with Winston.

If I were you, I'd be concerned about mixing a tiel and an ekkie. Ekkie certainly can kill the tiel if they fight. They will have to be separated and supervised ALL THE TIME. I think a green cheek might be a better size comparison. They need to be somewhat similar in size to balance the power game in my opinion.

Thank you! I will definitely look into the chops (I already make one for my cockatiel). I understand that all parrots have different personalities and even though ekkies are normally known for being quieter than other birds their size I could end up with an ekkie that is as loud as a cockatoo. Any other advice you could give me relating ekkies? Since the information out there is confusing and sometimes they even contradict each other.

 

[Sa_2503]

If you don’t want a bird that will live longer than you, I’m sure you can arrange that with a horrible dirt and poor care.

Seriously, that should not be on the list of priorities for any species decision.

False---
There is a massive difference between a parakeet/cockatiel/quaker etc lifespan VS a Macaw, CAG/TAG, cockatoo or Amazon..(yes, poor care can kill them all quickly, BUT if you adopt a larger, long-lived bird, you have to plan for larger expenses and longer-term care and you are looking at potentially having to bounce that bird from home-to-home if you get too old to care for it or other life events interfere over time).

To dismiss lifespan when considering adopting a new bird, given the trauma of having to send a bonded bird to a new home, is simply irresponsible....not to mention the financial implications of making such a commitment without having considered the dent it will put in your wallet over time..

Yes, it has to be done sometimes (and some people plan responsibly and life still gets in the way), BUT there is a big difference between caring for a bird in your 20's/30's as opposed to your 80s/90s...and if you have to write your bird into your will, that is another huge issue...An issue that is far less likely when it comes to smaller birds.

With larger birds, you are basically getting married to them (regardless of children, jobs, moves, partners, travel, sickness, finances etc)...if you are 20, it literally could be a daily expense and responsibility for the rest of your life...and if you are significantly older, I would not suggest getting a baby bird from a breeder if they are a long-lived variety, as that is just short-sighted in many respects.

Oh, I can’t believe you don’t get the point.

Plus, his younger brother is 12.

Sorry, but I am really concerned about the well being of my birds. My brother being 12 doesn't change anything (I am 16, turning 17 this month), since I wouldn't force my brother to take care of my parrot. I also worry about what could happen to the bird after I die, since once I'm dead I have no say over what happens. This is why the lifespan is important for me, I can handle up to 50 years (I will be 67 and still able to take care of the bird). I wouldn't want an amazon since they are known for outliving their caretakers and the same goes with macaws and cockatoos.

 

[Sa_2503]

OH---Just saw that you may need to live in an apartment. The larger the bird, the bigger the noise and the greater the poop and destruction. I STRONGLY suggest that you never get a large bird in an apartment- it simply is unfair to the bird. It isn't enough space and it could get you evicted...If I could make it a law, I would make it illegal for people to adopt larger birds in apartments because there is too much risk involved for the human and the bird.

I respectfully disagree with no larger bird in an apartment. Winston and his two hooman slaves (me + hubby) live in an 1 bedroom apartment. Winston is a larger Eclectus (480-500 g), and he is content in this environment. However, I would suggest nothing larger than him and certainly nothing louder than him.


I think it depends on where you live location wise. We live in a college town in the middle of PA, so Winston does not really bother people here. He's fairly quiet as a large bird, too. BUT, I think it's because we are lucky. Every bird has their own personality and preference. You can have a loud ekkie because they have the capability of being loud.

Diet-wise, there are wonderful chop posts shared by many members. You just have to give at least 80% veggies and some fruits. I supplement with TOPS pellets, but never make pellets the primary diet. Some ekkies are more difficult than others. I again think we got luck out with Winston.

If I were you, I'd be concerned about mixing a tiel and an ekkie. Ekkie certainly can kill the tiel if they fight. They will have to be separated and supervised ALL THE TIME. I think a green cheek might be a better size comparison. They need to be somewhat similar in size to balance the power game in my opinion.

I have lived in a an apartment with mine and I wouldn't do it again- I think some of it comes down to the owner, but a lot of it also depends on neighbors and policy (too much of which we cannot control). For instance, if a neighbor overheats a teflon pan or smokes weed, your bird could die. Apartment living is sometimes impossible for even the best bird owner..
If your unit sprays for bugs or paints the halls, your bird could die.
If your bird screams, you could get kicked out (and Eckies are known to be much quieter than macaws and other large birds-while they are not "quiet", they are some of THE quietest large birds out there).
it's just a lot of risk--- it worked out for me (but it was SOOOOO much stress) and it was dangerous for the bird---way harder than renting a home and housing a bird. Plus, in species designed to fly 45 miles per day, a small apartment doesn't even come close to adequate (neither does a house, but at least there is enough room to potentially fly without smashing into something).
Plus- I am not sure that an Eclectus can be housed with a powder-down bird like a tiel...and like I said, they are the quietest large bird I know of (as a rule)---even if they are still loud.
Birds also change A LOT when they hit puberty-- including noise levels and aggressive behaviors---and with larger birds, these tend to happen within years, as opposed to months-to-a-year (which leaves a lot of time to inadvertently establish bad habits and reinforce behaviors that will eventually become sexual/ fuel for screaming etc).

Thank you for sharing your experience with the apartment living! I will definitely put more thought into it, as getting a new bird is nothing permanent (I am still researching!). Also thank you for warning me about the dangers of it!