My ten year old green cheek won't leave his cage!

[cacturnemandan]

Hi everyone!

Jed is a 10 year old green cheek conure (I've had him since a few months after he was weaned). During his first few years he'd be constantly be begging for attention and would race out of his cage any chance he got. We had parakeets up until he was 4 but he's been our only bird ever since.

EDIT: We call Jed "him" but he's never actually been sexed. He's never displayed any mounting behavior so my guess would be that "he's" a girl.

I've noticed that over the past 3-4 years it has gotten progressively harder to get him to leave his cage. He will shy away from my hands when I put them near him, and does not come out even if I leave the door open for hours. Even if I hold out a treat he loves (orange juice or a blueberry), I can only get him to "step up" on rare occasions. I've tried every day this past week and he has only come out twice.

Once he IS outside, he is very playful, loves to snuggle, and enjoys being held and petted. But it's so hard to get him out!

He doesn't seem depressed or sick or anything. He spends most of his day snuggling with his toys, and beak-grinds happily. He doesn't seem to lack energy and he isn't overweight. He never experienced any kind of abuse (that I know of) that would make him scared of my hands. And again, he only avoids my hands when he is inside his cage.

I'd appreciate your ideas as to what is going on, and tips on how to get him to come out on his own!

Thanks!

 

[noodles123]

I can't say for sure, but you mention snuggling with the toys--that sounds very hormonal. If he has any huts, tents or shadowy spaces in his cage remove them (they are often triggers for nesting behavior, sexuality and cage aggression). Outside of the cage, do not allow access to shadowy spaces either (bedding, pillows, drawers, under furniture etc).
Pet on the head and neck only when you do have him out.
Make sure he is on a sleep schedule with a bare minimum of 10 hours dark sleep nightly---same bed time and wake up/covering/uncovering and without covering his cage at any other time --cage covers should only ever be used at bed time.

Also, get blood-work done, just to make sure everything is okay internally-- any major shift in behavior should always involve an avian certified vet (not just an exotics vet, if at all possible).

 

[cacturnemandan]

Thanks noodles! He's never had a cage cover and I do tend to be up at odd hours. He also likes retreating/snuggling up to the furthest corner of his cage every now and then. Do you think the fact that this has been happening for several years is consistent with nesting/sexual behavior? This doesn't appear to be seasonal at all.

Also, I probably should have mentioned this in the main post, but we never did a sex test on Jed--we call him "him" but I would guess that he's actually a girl, as he's never displayed any sort of mounting behavior. Does that change things?

I can start by removing stuff from his cage and trying out a cage cover. Do you think he'll have trouble adjusting to the cover since he's older? If it freaks him out then I don't want to force it.

 

[T00tsyd]

I would remove anything that he snuggles with. Syd loves plastic bags. He will seek them out wherever he can in the house and the moment he finds one that becomes his focus. He will ignore me (his first love), his favourite treats and any sort of enticement. I would go through his cage and take things away until he returns to normal. Then limit their use if at all.

 

[Kiwibird]

By the sound of it, this bird has had a relatively low stress, stable life and feels safe/secure in his home/position in his “flock” (which is a good thing!). At age 10, he is now an undeniably mature bird and it isn’t uncommon for birds in that position to become somewhat sedentary and lazy. There’s even a term for it- perch potato. What, recently, has been new and exciting in his life? How often does he get new toys? Are new toys just variations of old toys?

“Hormones” has become something of a catch all explanation for a lot of undesirable or otherwise unexplained behavior in parrots in recent years, but IMO, it doesn’t sound like your bird is actually having hormonal issues. Snuggling a toy isn’t necessarily sexual, birds huddle up next to things for comfort and security too. Getting sexual with an inanimate object is a pretty obvious thing and is usually an obsessive behavior (such as TOOtsyd’s description of their bird who likes plastic bags). Females are often worse than males with overt sexual displays and female conures are very prone to egg laying when hormones are an issue. Plus, healthy, sexually mature parrots only experience hormonal behaviors for a brief period every year as part of a natural breeding cycle, while birds with hormonal imbalances or who are being constantly sexually stimulated by something in their environment that leads to year round or extended issues, typically experience a range of very obvious and undesirable behaviors. IMO, it sounds more like your bird is having having a mid life crisis and is in need of new and exciting things in his life again. If you start taking things out of his cage, replace them with new things that are different then what was there before (for example, if he has a lot of wood toys, try offering acrylic toys and bells instead). If you just take things away without replacing, he’ll just become even more lazy and possibly stressed or depressed. Even if it’s a bit of effort, it’s *great* that you are engaging him and getting him out of the cage again as often as possible. If you make it worth his time, he will probably want to come out more and more often. You should aim to have him coming out for a couple hours a day. Having some kind of perch or play stand away from his cage may make it more appealing to him to leave the cage. If you haven’t before, it may also be a good time to start harness training or invest in a bird backpack style carrier so he can become used to one or the other and come spring, start safely going outside with you (on walks, drives, to stores etc...) which is an excellent way to keep mature birds stimulated and excited about life. It’s good that you’re noticing these changes and looking to correct them. I’m sure with some effort, you can get him out of this slump and back to being an energetic, excited bird again.

 

[Laurasea]

Hi , please don't remove what ever toy he,/she is treating like a freind. That would put do much stress on your bird.

Your bird is cagebound. This can happen when your bird isn't getting enough social interaction and out if the cage time. Not enough stimulation for their minds. Perhaps you feel like you have been meeting the birds needs, but your birds behavior says otherwise.

I've had to deal with cagebound birds before in rescue situations. As has Sailboat, who rescues Amazon parrots. You can read his thread I love Amazon's an ongoing journey. Iwll come back and link it here in a few mins. http://www.parrotforums.com/amazons/65119-i-love-amazons-going-journey.html. This next one is a behavioralist working with a fearful parrot that won't leave it's cage. Might have some tips for you. https://blogpamelaclarkonline.com/2018/06/19/teaching-a-fearful-parrot-to-step-up/

A parrot needs a min of 3-6 hours of out of the cage time daily. Some if that time you are paying direct attention to the parrot, and some if that time is indirect attention, where they sit near you on play stand, or rife on your shoulder while you do chores. My avain vet recommendation is for parrots with any behavior problems that need to be higher starting at six hours of out of the cage time.

It's time to do a re-evaluation , and complete overhaul on your psrrots life. If the cage has set in the same place for ten years, maybe look if there is a new place you can move it to , that might be better, and gets a good amount of light. Where do you have the cage now? Also is it time for an upgrade to a larger cage? Amazon has some nice large cages for around a 100 bucks. These cages are 30-32 inches long, 20-24 inches wide, and 54-62 inches tall. What size is his cage?

I have a great article on stress in parrots and I will li k it here in a few min. A lot of really great stuff in this article. Talks about the importance of greeting your parrot every morning , rituals, stress relief techniques ECT. It also talks about taking the time to do objective observations. For one you can observe his use of the cage. Are their perches you could move to increase use, maybe add some perches so he can do a a trip around the cage jumping from one to the other. I keep tweaking my cage until I get the most utilization of perches and toys from my parrot. https://lafeber.com/pet-birds/stress-reduction-for-parrot-companions/

Diet. Lots of veggies and leafy greens. You can also sprout seeds. Feed cooked beans, cooked lentils, cooked oatmeal, scrambled eggs. Cooked sweet potatoes, cooked squash. If your parrot doesn't eat theses things, you can get him to start. Diversity of food is good for the mind and the body. Eating the new food infront of them and offer a piece by hand. Or eat in front of them and try to get them to steal the yummy healthy food from your plate. Then put a few different types of veggies in shallow sturdy dish, I use a small casserole dish or serving dish. These let's them umb in and explore the food, and to get a good look at it. Once you get him coming out of the cage , I find veggies and new food are best served outdide of the cage, they seem more tempted to try new stuff that way. Also it's time to start introducing foraging. I'll put some links here in a few min.
https://www.beautyofbirds.com/foragingfood.html

http://www.parrotforums.com/parrot-...afe-fresh-foods-toxic-food-lists-sprouts.html

I have some good links to toys I will put here. Frankly toys you make yourself ate often much more fun to you parrot , than many stuff you can buy. You can put some pages from an old paperback book and thread them through the bars, birds love to shred these. You can get bird safe leather strips and tie loose knots in it. GCC love to untie knots!!!! You can cut fun shapes it of cardboard and punch a hole though them and then ose a large zip tie to hang them in the cage. You can also string plastic beads on several zip ties do then can play and move the beads around. You can use plastic bottle caps and use a small dish with shallow water , and float the caps in the water, in the caps put a few seeds. My birds find this a lot of fun. Some googling will give you tons of ideas on DIY toys. The main thing to keep in mind, is they need stuff they can easily destroy every day, and stuff they can manipulate, bells, beads, small foot toys they can carry and balls. Also you might need to teach them to play, and reward with safflower seeds. .. https://blogpamelaclarkonline.com/2018/10/10/my-parrot-wont-play-with-toys/

https://bestinflock.com/2008/04/25/your-parrot-wont-play-with-toys/

Oops I have to go, I will com back add the links and give some ideas on shaping behavior to get your bird out of the cage.

 

[noodles123]

Hi , please don't remove what ever toy he,/she is treating like a freind. That would put do much stress on your bird.

Your bird is cagebound. This can happen when your bird isn't getting enough social interaction and out if the cage time. Not enough stimulation for their minds. Perhaps you feel like you have been meeting the birds needs, but your birds behavior says otherwise.

I've had to deal with cagebound birds before in rescue situations. As has Sailboat, who rescues Amazon parrots. You can read his thread I love Amazon's an ongoing journey. Iwll come back and link it here in a few mins. http://www.parrotforums.com/amazons/65119-i-love-amazons-going-journey.html

A parrot needs a min of 3-6 hours of out of the cage time daily. Some if that time you are paying direct attention to the parrot, and some if that time is indirect attention, where they sit near you on play stand, or rife on your shoulder while you do chores. My avain vet recommendation is for parrots with any behavior problems that need to be higher starting at six hours of out of the cage time.

It's time to do a re-evaluation , and complete overhaul on your psrrots life. If the cage has set in the same place for ten years, maybe look if there is a new place you can move it to , that might be better, and gets a good amount of light. Where do you have the cage now? Also is it time for an upgrade to a larger cage? Amazon has some nice large cages for around a 100 bucks. These cages are 30-32 inches long, 20-24 inches wide, and 54-62 inches tall. What size is his cage?

I have a great article on stress in parrots and I will li k it here in a few min. A lot of really great stuff in this article. Talks about the importance of greeting your parrot every morning , rituals, stress relief techniques ECT. It also talks about taking the time to do objective observations. For one you can observe his use of the cage. Are their perches you could move to increase use, maybe add some perches so he can do a a trip around the cage jumping from one to the other. I keep tweaking my cage until I get the most utilization of perches and toys from my parrot. https://lafeber.com/pet-birds/stress-reduction-for-parrot-companions/

Diet. Lots of veggies and leafy greens. You can also sprout seeds. Feed cooked beans, cooked lentils, cooked oatmeal, scrambled eggs. Cooked sweet potatoes, cooked squash. If your parrot doesn't eat theses things, you can get him to start. Diversity of food is good for the mind and the body. Eating the new food infront of them and offer a piece by hand. Or eat in front of them and try to get them to steal the yummy healthy food from your plate. Then put a few different types of veggies in shallow sturdy dish, I use a small casserole dish or serving dish. These let's them umb in and explore the food, and to get a good look at it. Once you get him coming out of the cage , I find veggies and new food are best served outdide of the cage, they seem more tempted to try new stuff that way. Also it's time to start introducing foraging. I'll put some links here in a few min.

I have some good links to toys I will put here. Frankly toys you make yourself ate often much more fun to you parrot , than many stuff you can buy. You can put some pages from an old paperback book and thread them through the bars, birds love to shred these. You can get bird safe leather strips and tie loose knots in it. GCC love to untie knots!!!! You can cut fun shapes it of cardboard and punch a hole though them and then ose a large zip tie to hang them in the cage. You can also string plastic beads on several zip ties do then can play and move the beads around. You can use plastic bottle caps and use a small dish with shallow water , and float the caps in the water, in the caps put a few seeds. My birds find this a lot of fun. Some googling will give you tons of ideas on DIY toys. The main thing to keep in mind, is they need stuff they can easily destroy every day, and stuff they can manipulate, bells, beads, small foot toys they can carry and balls. Also you might need to teach them to play, and reward with safflower seeds. ..

Oops I have to go, I will com back add the links and give some ideas on shaping behavior to get your bird out of the cage.

Hormones are often a catch-all but this is not sounding entirely non-hormonal (and if there is a behavior in a non-neglected bird (socially, behaviorally, environmentally, nutritionally), there are often hormones involved to some extent, even if in conjunction with other issues). If diet, sleep, interaction and everything else were good, this could have started from something really minor (like a rough week + hormones + the toys) and lead to something that is more like an addiction or coping skill. BUT---too many people also negate the importance of keeping a cage free from nesting-type places. If I saw this behavior in mine, as soon as it started, I would remove the toy. I have done it and my cockatoo is very well-adjusted...Now, has it escalated to a point where things need to be handled more delicately? Quite possibly (depending on the time-frame and other contextual factors)...but again, lots of conclusions without enough evidence (myself included).

Do we even know how long this has been going on for certain? That is why I hesitate to say that this is truly a case of long-term cage-bound behavior.

Yes- this could very well be a classic Tom Hanks "Wilson" (Cast-Away") situation...BUT---eventually, Wilson did have to go...he served a purpose, but then he had to go eventually in order for Tom Hanks to rejoin humanity. Then again, it could also just be a short-term thing where a hormonal bird felt sexually frustrated and found a "mate" or even just a NEST-- in an inanimate object. Hard to know without more information.

I agree with a lot of this--- but a cage-bound bird sometimes becomes that way because it interprets something inside as more important than the things on the outside--It is so very contextual when it comes to removing the toys etc--- It really just depends..and I am not saying that there weren't socialization issues leading up to it, BUT it seems a little rash to say DO NOT remove the toys---I mean, I can see both of your points and they are valid, but at the same time, it is quite possible that without the toys, he would be forced to seek out greener pastures beyond his cage. If they are sexual objects or hormonal triggers then without them in the cage, he might leave his cage because he would no longer view it as a nesting site. That is a big MIGHT--again, not saying I am right or that you guys are wrong....but all scenarios are possible. It's impossible to say whether this is or isn't hormones without seeing it in person, but if everything else has been fine and then all of the sudden he developed an interest in these toys and started isolating himself, it seems like the toys are a big part of the problem. Now, was he lonely and that is what prompted him to seek that companionship? Perhaps, but then again, that is not always the case. I guess I am juts thinking that there is a little too much confidence that this is a case of loneliness and definitely NOT hormones, when it could be either or both.

When my bird has become weirdly obsessed with objects in her cage, I have removed them as soon as I noticed the increased interest. Now, she was never cage-bound, but they certainly were triggers for her behaviors (including aggression within the cage where they were located). A bird who gets a mate a suddenly becomes cage-aggressive behaves in a very similar way...Sometimes birds have to be separated--I am not saying hurl the toys into the sea, and having read these responses, I understand why one might hesitate to remove them. I can't even say with certainty that your bird is attached to these toys in the same way that it would attach to a mate.
Am I sure that taking them out is the best course of action? Heck no...no even close, but I am also certain that there is no real way to know that it isn't without more information.

Again-- this is going to be a major judgement call---anyone on this thread could be correct, but that means that some of us (myself included) could be wrong. I guess I am saying, think long and hard about the behavior and your birds emotional stability--try to map out a timeline and see when you first saw this behavior getting worse. Consider whether it coincided with less attention from you guys etc etc. If your bird is truly cage-bound, then handle things gently to the best of your ability....

All I know is that people with aggressive birds often find that removing snuggle huts/tents decreases the aggression within a matter of days...Is that what is happening here? I am not sure, but I guess just think about all of the possibilities before you make a choice, and know that there are valid arguments on both sides (depending on what is actually going on with your bird). If a bird is obsessed with something and that object is removed, it doesn't always result in an emotional upheaval--- sometimes it does upset them temporarily, sometimes it upsets them for longer periods...sometimes they hardly react. It's very hard to anticipate exactly what is happening here, so don't rule anything out until you contemplate all of the responses you have gotten (in conjunction with reflecting on your birds behavior).

In the end, if you try everything else (bonding etc) and it continues, I still would say that the toys could be a huge issue. Right now, the bird's quality of life is that of a reclusive, crazy cat-lady...so I guess I just feel like something has to happen to keep him from building a wall around himself and lashing out at others (because surely this is a health hazard from the bird and others).

Good luck!

 

[Laurasea]

Noodles, I sought advice from an avain vet and behaviorist when I first brought home my rescue Quaker Penny. Penny was very obsessed with a toy that she constantly preened and regurged to. The vet/behaviorist said as I made the changes to improve her quality of life, and met her contact and social needs this behavior would disappear. Then I could remove. Up until then , this was her stress relief, safety net, comfort and pretend freind. And that removing it would cause her stress and make her even more shutdown, feeling even more untrustful of her environment. Indeed , over a month of improvise her life, she stopped obsession over this object, and I removed it from the cage

I think this parrot needs some positive changes in its life, before we remove it's only safety net or comfort iteam .....

Experiences and parrots, situationd may vary, but I'm just letting you know where I coming from with that advice. And that I sought professional help and advice with a similar case.

Also it's important to note. The information given by the Op is the bird is just sitting snuggle to the object. Not having sex with it, not feeding it not preening it. Parrots seek sheltered areas to rest, for safety. A parrot sitting out exposed on a branch is going to be somebody's lunch! I think in Sailboats thread he talks about filling the cage with toys and perches to resemble a rain forest. And provide visual screenings, and mental stimulation.

 

[noodles123]

I appreciate that-- I guess it just depends on how it all started and how long it has been happening. A long-term situation is going to be different than something that hasn't been going on for that long.
I agree with trying other things if this is a long-term issue, for sure.

As I said above, "Wilson" will eventually have to go, but if it is a really deep-set issue that has gone on for a long time, it will have to be more gradual (just like in Castaway) lol--sounds like that is what the vet said as well.

Also-- just in case people don't follow that reference- Castaway tells the story of a man who becomes stranded on an island after a crash and ends up in desperate need of interaction. As a means of coping, he creates a "friend" out of a volleyball (Wilson). He does everything with Wilson but in time, he becomes more independent and as rescue approaches..some other things happen:
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaQa4ttIyNo"]Cast Away (4/5) Movie CLIP - I'm Sorry, Wilson! (2000) HD - YouTube[/ame]
I totally cried when I watched this scene in theatres LOL, so don't negate a true attachment if it is possible that your bird sought that out as a means of coping...BUT-- again, the duration and intensity of the behavior will be telling.



Also "POOPNOODLES" ?!?! lollllllll---Is that my new name?

 

[Laurasea]

Lol!!!! It was an accidental add!!! I think sometimes my computer is hacked I have all these weird glitches!!! When I saw that I was like what the heck?;?;?! Lol I have no idea .

 

[noodles123]

Lol!!!! It was an accidental add!!! I think sometimes my computer is hacked I have all these weird glitches!!! When I saw that I was like what the heck?;?;?! Lol I have no idea .

It is a rather interesting visual-- quite effective really "POOP Noodles"..Next time I really piss you off, feeL free to use that and I will be honored LOL!!! OR at least laugh a lot.

 

[Laurasea]

Thanks for understanding Noodles!! I was trying to edit before you saw!!!!

Ok here is an excellent article dealing with cage bou d parrots!!! If you read none of our other links read this one!
https://www.beautyofbirds.com/cageboundbirds.html

Also I my self have many years ago, made some mistakes with my GCC " Burt the Bird" ...anyway I moved to a new house, had stress at work, and was dealing with a chronic illness..... My Burt didn't get the out if cage time she deserved... And became fearful and cage agressive. None of which are good excuses. I am atoning by providing a better life now, and by sharing information on parrots. Burt the Bird , I'm dedicating my time in your honor. I miss you

 

[cacturnemandan]

Thanks everyone for your advice! I really appreciate it. I feel like the "mid-life crisis" and "cage bound" idea is most in line with what I've been thinking. He isn't expressing any obsessive behavior with his toys...my take was always that he really likes being comfy! He just likes to press himself against something soft and chill.

I still think that taking some extra clutter out of his cage / some new toys will be helpful. Also, noodle's comment about the nesting behavior made me realize: Jed's cage has a tray on top (I usually put his food/treats on it)...but I realize that since the whole top of his cage is covered it could get a sort of "nest" feel to it, especially in dim light. I've removed the tray and I'll look into using a cage cover. I'll try to be more proactive about getting him out and playing, too.

The flight harness idea is a great one! The winter's pretty harsh here right now but I'll look into that once things warm up a bit.

Thanks!

 

[Laurasea]

You can use a clear glass casserole dish on top of the cage to hold stuff. I do. You definitely want to make sure he gets plus ty if light in his cage area. If it's dark there look into adding a lamp in that area.