Kili bit my little boy!! Help!

[Ripstied]

I just got Kili home to TN 2 days ago. For those of you who haven't followed our story, she's a 1.5 years old umbrella cockatoo, who's been sweet and cuddly so far. We adopted her in FL over 2 weeks ago and just got her home to TN 2 days ago, so we've had her almost 3 weeks. She has a giant cage that she's been sitting on top of during the day the past 2 days (I've been waiting for my full size java tree to arrive). I'm not sure if it's just the perfect storm between letting her sit high on top her cage (I've read people say not to let them sit high up), the stress of the 16 hour car ride, and new house environment and routine. My 5 year old was on a step stool trying to engage her by bobbing up and down, talking, and wiggling a small toy in front of her. Kili bit his thumb nail so bad that it cut the nail at the quick almost the entire width of the nail. There was so much blood I thought she took his finger off! I'm still shaking from it! Kili was hanging on the outside of her cage when this happened and if she was irritated she could have easily gone up higher or to the back or inside of cage. 1st of all, my little boy is not allowed anywhere near Kili maybe forever, but I feel like I'm being irresponsible keeping an animal that could be a danger to my family. I told my husband that I would see what my parrot friends had to say as way of advice and in the meantime Kili won't be allowed on top of her cage any more. (I have a table top java tree that she can be on when out of her cage), and I figured we'd give it a few days till she settles in. The problem is that she hasn't seemed stressed to me in any way since we got home. In fact, she seemed to LOVE her new cage immediately. You can hardly get her out of it. I will admit she doesn't seem to act like most of the cockatoos I've read about, such as no real playing or hanging upside down. No interest in foraging for food. She finally will chew on wood toys, but not like you hear about. She has just liked sitting on her little tree and getting her head and face rubbed. Maybe her inactivity is a sign of stress? By the way, I have 2 other kids ages 13 and 9. They've spent lots of time holding Kili and haven't had any problems. I'm scared to death that Kili might be too unpredictable in that she could just decide to take a chunk out of one of them some day... If Kili doesn't want to have her head rubbed she usually gently pushes your fingers away or gently grabs a finger and pushes it away, and so we know to leave her alone. I don't know what to think. My heart says give her another chance under better circumstances, but my brain tells me that no animal is worth the risk. This is coming from someone that has always owned large bread dogs. Over the last 20 years we actually had to re-home 2 of our dogs because of over aggressiveness toward the kids. But with a dog, you have to because you can't just keep the kids away from them when they're running free in your yard. A bird we can set limits of not letting the 5 year old near. I'm hoping it's just a case of Kili not liking my son. I've read about cockatoos that love 1 household member but won't let another member anywhere near them. Help!! My heart is breaking!!

 

[Birdman666]

Okay...

So many myths... so much to explain. So little space.

Let's start with the height dominance myth, and then go into what things actually went wrong here...

1. Height dominance explained: A bird up high is not in a position to be controlled. They are smart enough to know that. They act up when they are not in a position to be controlled. If they bite when they are up there, then they haven't been fully socialized or trained.

Lowering them from that spot, makes it easier to control them, BUT until you have them trained... you are not really addressing the problem. The problem is training and socialization. All my playstands are a foot or two taller than I am, but my birds come down when they are called, and don't misbehave when they are up there.

Why?! They've been trained.

Training them is YOUR job. They don't come like that!

 

[Kiwibird]

Parrots bite. The injury potential to small children is greater because they are smaller, but at some point, every family member will likely be bitten. That's just one of things that go with the territory of owning parrots. Unlike dogs, that does not make them "vicious" animals that are no longer safe, it's more of a way of communication they occasionally utilize.

My dads cockatoo latched into my cheek when I was 3 years old. I still remember running around with him hanging off my face That was the first time, but certainly not the last time that bird bit me. My dad still has him though, and I love parrots as an adult I do think until your son is older, it would be wise to keep him away from the bird, but I don't think this is a reason to consider rehoming. I would also suggest not engaging your bird (any family member) in the way you describe your son doing. While I'm sure it was done innocently, bobbing and waving a toy is antagonizing and/or overstimulating your bird. Birds, especially 'sensitive' ones like cockatoos, prefer slow, calm, predictable movements. Even my bird, who is generally very laid back and very bonded would bite me if I was moving around rapidly, waving a toy at him. It's threatening to them. I think the older children should still handle her under supervision, as well as as many adults who are willing. Socialization is the key to keeping them, well, social. Do be sure you kids and other household members know what to do IF/WHEN they are bit- calmly get the bird off (no screaming, yelling ext... this will only encourage MORE biting in the future), then take her back to her cage without a word for a time out while you clean the wound. It is very important you show as little reaction as possible to a bite as not to encourage more. Be sure you are encouraging positive interactions with treats and verbal praise so she understands playing nice gets her rewards while biting gets her a time out. Parrots are very developmentally similar to toddlers (though they never grow up) and much of the same ways you deal with a small child will work (with minor tweaks) on your bird

 

[Ripstied]

Okay...

So many myths... so much to explain. So little space.

Let's start with the height dominance myth, and then go into what things actually went wrong here...

1. Height dominance explained: A bird up high is not in a position to be controlled. They are smart enough to know that. They act up when they are not in a position to be controlled. If they bite when they are up there, then they haven't been fully socialized or trained.

Lowering them from that spot, makes it easier to control them, BUT until you have them trained... you are not really addressing the problem. The problem is training and socialization. All my playstands are a foot or two taller than I am, but my birds come down when they are called, and don't misbehave when they are up there.

Why?! They've been trained.

Training them is YOUR job. They don't come like that!

So I guess I'm at a loss as to how to train, and what that means. She's been very socialized, but maybe not in the sense you speak of. Her breeder has a booth at the flea market where she was 2 days a week, all day, around many different people. I've read some people say not to scold or react in any way to bad behavior, because this just encourages them to do it more, so I've just ignored it, distracted her, or nonchalantly put her back in her cage. I don't have a problem with putting time into training, I just need more info on what that entails and how to...

 

[Birdman666]

Myth number two: There is a bird on the face of this planet that will not bite... (especially one as excitable as a large too!)

I have no idea who sold you this too, but if he gave you the impression that these birds do not bite, HE LIED HIS BUTT OFF!!!

ALL PARROTS, EVEN TAME FRIENDLY ONES, CAN AND WILL BITE!!! PERIOD!!!

1. A five year old has absolutely no business handling a too without strict parental supervision and control. ESPECIALLY a large too that is not fully comfortable in his surroundings. MOST ESPECIALLY a bird that has not been trained to control his bite pressure... (My daughter handled them at that age, but ALWAYS with adult supervision and instruction!)

2. Cockatoos are excitable. If he was doing something that got the too worked into a state, and he wanted to play? HOW DO TOOS PLAY WITH THEIR TOYS? THAT'S RIGHT! THEY BITE THEM, AND CHEW ON THEM...

3. If the bird wanted a toy that your son was holding "THAT'S MINE!" He's gonna take the toy from your son!!! How do they do that? BY BITING A FINGER AND GETTING HIM TO DROP IT!!!

4. If the too is not fully comfortable with the household, and everyone and everything in it? Guess what, he's going to drive people away from "his nest." How is he going to do that? Probably by biting... or bluffing... or dive bombing.

5. HAS ANYONE IN YOUR HOUSEHOLD HAD ANY BIRD TRAINING OR HANDLING CLASSES AT ALL?! BECAUSE YOU HAVE TAKEN ON THE HIGHEST MAINTENANCE PARROT OUT THERE... WELL SECOND HIGHEST... M2'S ARE THE HIGHEST. U2'S ARE CLOSE THOUGH.

 

[Doublete]

Sounds like over stimulation... not to be held against the bird. A child doesn't have the ability to read body language and know when the bird is too excited to function.


There are many training threads and body language and ideas. Or even just look up any post by birdman. His advice is invaluable.

 

[Birdman666]

The head bob dancing movements also mean they are getting worked into a state. When you get them worked up like that they become unpredictable.

DO NOT HANDLE THEM WHEN THEY ARE WORKED INTO A STATE!

Sitting in a flea market booth, having strangers around, doesn't mean the bird has been properly socialized.

It means they have become used to that environment. Changing that environment, means they have to get used to another environment.

 

[JerseyWendy]

I don't have cockatoo experience, however, I also want to stress that you should never let your 5-year old handle the bird unsupervised. And even THEN an accident can happen in the blink of an eye. Many big birds (big macs and Amazons included) aren't overly fond of little ones (children). Children (never intentionally, of course) have quicker, jerkier movements than adults, which can set a bird off rather quickly because they don't know how to interpret those motions/movements.

I am terribly sorry to hear of your son's injury! That had to have been incredibly painful.

Also, the thing we call 'trust': Trust is a great thing and must be earned, but always keep in mind that we ARE dealing with an animal - you can never quite predict what they may do next.

 

[Birdman666]

Another problem: Fingernails are often mistaken for feather sheaths.

Parrots often try to "be helpful" and remove them. For them, it's good grooming, and a friendly gesture.

For us, it's very painful!

My CAG split one of my fingernails in half about three weeks ago, without really trying... Rough play. Missed the toy. Got my fingernail...

It happens.

 

[Ripstied]

Parrots bite. The injury potential to small children is greater because they are smaller, but at some point, every family member will likely be bitten. That's just one of things that go with the territory of owning parrots. Unlike dogs, that does not make them "vicious" animals that are no longer safe, it's more of a way of communication they occasionally utilize.

My dads cockatoo latched into my cheek when I was 3 years old. I still remember running around with him hanging off my face That was the first time, but certainly not the last time that bird bit me. My dad still has him though, and I love parrots as an adult I do think until your son is older, it would be wise to keep him away from the bird, but I don't think this is a reason to consider rehoming. I would also suggest not engaging your bird (any family member) in the way you describe your son doing. While I'm sure it was done innocently, bobbing and waving a toy is antagonizing and/or overstimulating your bird. Birds, especially 'sensitive' ones like cockatoos, prefer slow, calm, predictable movements. Even my bird, who is generally very laid back and very bonded would bite me if I was moving around rapidly, waving a toy at him. It's threatening to them. I think the older children should still handle her under supervision, as well as as many adults who are willing. Socialization is the key to keeping them, well, social. Do be sure you kids and other household members know what to do IF/WHEN they are bit- calmly get the bird off (no screaming, yelling ext... this will only encourage MORE biting in the future), then take her back to her cage without a word for a time out while you clean the wound. It is very important you show as little reaction as possible to a bite as not to encourage more. Be sure you are encouraging positive interactions with treats and verbal praise so she understands playing nice gets her rewards while biting gets her a time out. Parrots are very developmentally similar to toddlers (though they never grow up) and much of the same ways you deal with a small child will work (with minor tweaks) on your bird

Thanks for the advice! I agree that I don't think my boy was intentionally antagonizing Kili, because we have several animals and he is good with all of them. However, you apparently can't play that way with a parrot! There was definitely some screaming, because my boy was in pain, but I didn't react to Kili in any way. I cleaned and bandaged the finger in the other room. Then I spoke very soothing to Kili, because she was slightly trembling and obviously agitated. I had to slightly pry her toes off of the cage to get her off, then I put her inside her cage. Birdman posted about training. Any other suggestions for training? By they way, I can't seem to find anything healthy that she loves as a treat. She'll eat organic pellets, apples, and banana, but it's not a treat to her. The only thing that I've seen her almost jump off the perch for is pizza. Yes, it's horrible for her, and no I don't make a practice of giving it to her. It's very apparent to me she got people food handouts at her breeder's house. I've never seen anything like when we had pizza delivered a week ago. My normally quiet non-animated cockatoo was leaning way down toward the pizza box and was chatting up a storm.

 

[Birdman666]

PIZZA is a universal truth for all parrots...

And it even comes with a free bird toy - THE PIZZA BOX. Almost as good as the thing that came in it...

Have you tried walnuts, cashews and/or pistacios yet?!

 

[Ripstied]

Myth number two: There is a bird on the face of this planet that will not bite... (especially one as excitable as a large too!)

I have no idea who sold you this too, but if he gave you the impression that these birds do not bite, HE LIED HIS BUTT OFF!!!

ALL PARROTS, EVEN TAME FRIENDLY ONES, CAN AND WILL BITE!!! PERIOD!!!

1. A five year old has absolutely no business handling a too without strict parental supervision and control. ESPECIALLY a large too that is not fully comfortable in his surroundings. MOST ESPECIALLY a bird that has not been trained to control his bite pressure... (My daughter handled them at that age, but ALWAYS with adult supervision and instruction!)

2. Cockatoos are excitable. If he was doing something that got the too worked into a state, and he wanted to play? HOW DO TOOS PLAY WITH THEIR TOYS? THAT'S RIGHT! THEY BITE THEM, AND CHEW ON THEM...

3. If the bird wanted a toy that your son was holding "THAT'S MINE!" He's gonna take the toy from your son!!! How do they do that? BY BITING A FINGER AND GETTING HIM TO DROP IT!!!

4. If the too is not fully comfortable with the household, and everyone and everything in it? Guess what, he's going to drive people away from "his nest." How is he going to do that? Probably by biting... or bluffing... or dive bombing.

5. HAS ANYONE IN YOUR HOUSEHOLD HAD ANY BIRD TRAINING OR HANDLING CLASSES AT ALL?! BECAUSE YOU HAVE TAKEN ON THE HIGHEST MAINTENANCE PARROT OUT THERE...

We have not had any experience with a large bird. We've all been around large dogs that you have to handle properly and train, so I figured this would be something that we could learn, too. I read up on everything I could get my hands on online for the past month, but it was more on behavior, diet, safe toys, foraging, speech training, grooming, and personality characteristics. Any suggestions on a particular online thread on training and handling?

 

[Siobhan]

Bobbing and bouncing, particularly when the parrot is on top of the cage, if its crest is raised, is a threatening behavior. A 'too with a raised crest is usually agitated for some reason. He's (she's) scared, or something is happening he doesn't understand, or he hears a sound he doesn't recognize, or he doesn't like what's going on. Rocky raises his crest when I leave for work. He knows the signs and that's one way of telling me he disapproves. But any time his crest is raised, I'm out of reach because he might chomp. When your son was bobbing and bouncing, your 'too took that as a sign of aggression and reacted with returned aggression. I agree that a child that age should never interact with a large parrot unsupervised, but the bird was only behaving according to its instinct and can't be blamed for it. The playfulness that your son meant to exhibit would work with a dog. It means something else entirely to a parrot.

 

[Birdman666]

bobbing and bouncing, particularly when the parrot is on top of the cage, if its crest is raised, is a threatening behavior. A 'too with a raised crest is usually agitated for some reason. He's (she's) scared, or something is happening he doesn't understand, or he hears a sound he doesn't recognize, or he doesn't like what's going on. Rocky raises his crest when i leave for work. He knows the signs and that's one way of telling me he disapproves. But any time his crest is raised, i'm out of reach because he might chomp. When your son was bobbing and bouncing, your 'too took that as a sign of aggression and reacted with returned aggression. I agree that a child that age should never interact with a large parrot unsupervised, but the bird was only behaving according to its instinct and can't be blamed for it. The playfulness that your son meant to exhibit would work with a dog. It means something else entirely to a parrot.

exactly! Well said... That is about 90% of what happened...

I'd be willing to bet the other 10% was either "that's mine" or "get that thing out of my face!"

 

[Ripstied]

PIZZA is a universal truth for all parrots...

And it even comes with a free bird toy - THE PIZZA BOX. Almost as good as the thing that came in it...

Have you tried walnuts, cashews and/or pistacios yet?!

Excellent idea! I'll get some of those today. I bought a mixed bag of mixed organic seed and dried fruit that's supposed to appeal to large Macaws and cockatoos, just to supplement her diet. The only thing she really like in it is the dried mango and these tiny little white seeds. Anything that she has to crack open she doesn't bother. I have to physically crack them open and then she MIGHT peel the rest of it back. It's the weirdest thing, because everything I've read says they love toys and foraging for food, but she isn't interested in anything she has to work for. She JUST started chewing on some wood toys in her cage, but she acts like she could care less about any of it.

 

[Dopey]

Welcome to large parrots small kids world. Your too was just being a too and your kid was just being a kid. Everyone in your household has to be so excited to have this new BIG white bird in the house. I hope your son doesn't have a bad feeling for the too after his experience.

Let the too get used to the household and let the household get used to the too. This may take a LONG time. You may have to put a play yard around the cage until your son learns not to touch the cage or put his fingers near the bird. I've seen people on this forum who have done that but I don't know where a picture is.

Please try to stop feeling bad. It happens and it will probably happen again to someone else in the household but learn what you can from this. Hug yourself and your kid and love your bird. Give him some pizza!

 

[Ripstied]

Thanks to everyone posting!! I knew I could count on getting some advice. If anyone has ideas on training and socialization, keep it coming. I pride myself on being a responsible pet owner, so I don't mind putting in the time to do it right. Animals bring so much enrichment to our lives, so it's worth the effort.

 

[riddick07]

Happens to the best of us!

Just be glad you haven't gotten the actor that is surely hiding in your too...I always tell adopters that cockatoos are some of the best actors you will ever have the dubious pleasure of meeting.

My cockatoo has this sweet voice that he lures people in with and then he clicks at them and puts his head down. If you watch closely you'll see the pure evil gotcha moment when he succeeds in luring his victim in right before he lunges. I do warn people he isn't friendly but they never listen....

Just a warning that there isn't always an obvious sign that they are going to bite at least not until you know your bird well enough. I always know when he is pretending and when he will actually be semi nice. (Nice for him is taking what your offering and flinging it across the room)

 

[punkindave]

As as been said, ALL birds will bite and it has nothing to do with them wanting to be "bad" it's because they are wild undomesticated animals that have very few ways to communicate their wants and needs to us.
Cockatoos are especially odd because of the eyes having no detectable pupils, those soulful black pools are beautiful and expressive but you can't tell when they are "pinning" and about to bie as you can tell with most parrots!

Try Cheerios, our Toos love to hook them with the beak and move them around with the tongue, grapes and the occasional crispy Cheeto are also favorites. Salt free almonds, pine nuts, walnuts (in the shell)

 

[Solo]

Could be that she hasn't been taught to forage. My girl seemed to think she would get in trouble for shredding things when I first brought her home, that has changed drastically now.

Socializing is a never ending process, as is the case with dogs but to more of an extreme with parrots. They will adjust to being in a particular setting with certain people after awhile. It's no longer new, and no longer outside their comfort zone. Socializing is always expanding that comfort zone. New places, new people, new apparel and accessories. There will always be something NEW.

A couple days ago a friend of mine who is in transition came over. Phoebe was perplexed and reacted poorly. She needed time to adjust and for my to show her there was nothing wrong.

Please don't mistake this for coddling!! That will only make the problem worse. Don't sooth her when she doesn't know how to act, but instead show her. Touch the object or person she isn't reacting well to, then ignore her and interact as normal. She'll get the idea.

Also keep in mind. A bird is a bird is a bird. They bite! Even if pressure trained they sometimes bite hard, it is simply reality when you live with these majestic creatures. Your children will need to be taught how to behave properly around and while interacting with the bird.

I'm sure it was not intentional, but the behaviour described from the child would not have been accepted by a dog either. Movement should be slow and respectful, and not directed straight towards the bird as it can be seen as threatening.