just venting, is it that time of the year again?

[ChristaNL]

It's probably nothing much, but well... still new to macaws and all.

Sunny has been "difficult" this past week and I am losing my optimism a bit.
(so this post)
One moment she is fine, making progress etc. etc. the next there is biting going on and I have a nice set of bruises or another hole in my hand.

A good thing she is not *really* serious about it or it would be worse ( with a beak like that and a temper to match) etc. but the "why are you lunging at me now?" is getting to me.

It's not helping in the whole 'building of trust' department if she suddenly starts behaving as if we've never met.
We are just halfway through our breakfast/morning routine and already I am patching a hole in my hand & removing bloodstains from the computermouse.
(the second hole in the past 24 hours)

There is nothing different at all in the way we do things compared to the months of other days...
(not counting the sudden lunging and bites )

Yes...I will haul her feathery arse to the vet a soon as I can make and appointment (she is due for one anyway)-
but I am a bit stumped-
she had been losing quite a few smaller feathers the past week -> molting time again?
(that would explain the crankyness and make sense to me)
The usual things are going in and coming out (and plenty of both!)
She is gnawing her willow, bathing a lot (because that is one way to keep her temper more even: she really is part penguin! not just the looks ), still loves to play.


She managed to regurge about half the meds I just got into her
(something she never does)
and was drinking water twice (also not a morning-routine-thing for her/ but being put back in the cage isn't either)-> usually she is having a nice drink of warm showerwater instead.

She is also back to squealing and being extremely defensive about her wings again (esp the one she just removed the primary from) she will lunge if I come close to them - but the moments in between (sweet spots) where she behaves as if she actually trusts me <and I was allowed to take a look and feel> nothing out of the ordinary was there!


It is not even the behaviours as such that I mind (though I am certainly *not* enjoying it) but I do not understand the why.
The whole russian-roulette-feeling here, not nice.

(plze tell me it just 'molting again')




Time to hop on a bus and get back to square One?
Or just trust on everything what we've done and proceed as if she is not behaving like that and hope she steps back in line?


(I am so much more confident with my greys - so at least I am relearning what is to start fresh with a strange species again, maybe I needed that reminder?
Japie came over especially - he normally plays around the house in the mornings- and Appie is letting me pet her, so they are helping me atm.)

 

[SailBoat]

Regarding molting and a new Parrot. You have likely greatly improved her diet and with the combination of better energy reserves from the improved diet, she is molting earlier, also driven by the heat of this Summer.

The first months with any rescue can be an on going mind games, especially with some Mac's and Amazons (likely others as well). The grace period can be from weeks, to months, or as you are likely seeing, far less.

Please make sure that you are reading Birdman666 Sticky's in the MAC Forum and also Behavioral Forum. Rescue Mac's can also be testing their new owners, i.e. what can I get away with here. It is very important regardless of the species to assure that you are being aware of your Parrot's body language as Mac's are big and so is their Beak and they know it.

It never hurts to start all over as if its day one!
It is never the Parrot's Fault.
It is always the Human's Fault.
This will force you to change your vantage point and see things from a different place.

This process is rarely without set-backs. Drop your expectations and deal one day at a time. Never be concerned about starting over again. Remember, unless the Parrot choose you. You are always working to gain their acceptance.

Just enjoy! I never expect a relationship /bond to develop in the first couple of years. It it does, that wonderful. If not, well that is part of having a Parrot.

 

[bigfellasdad]

Hi there. Not sure if macaws are like cag' s but when enzo is in "that mood" I'll watch out for her body language, if she lunges at me I'll immediately step back and fold my arms and give her a stern look. After 10_15 seconds I'll generally see her body language change and I'll try again. If she lunges a second time I'll give her a few minutes. Third time she will 90% of the time step up or whatever. She keeps the feeling of Having a say but will eventually give in. Works for us. When she is broody or feeling glum due to a moult is the worst time.

If non of this works I find a totally different distraction or I look excited about something and bang, she is over to my shoulder to join in

 

[Jottlebot]

I understand exactly what SailBoat is saying when he says it's never the parrot's fault, but I differ slightly on the belief that it is therefore the human's fault. Sometimes there is no 'fault', it just is. As we all know parrots are emotional and intelligent creatures and sometimes they just feel stuff! If you have tried to work out what the reason could be, and you know you are good at this stuff (or at least we do, even when you're not so sure), I feel it is likely to be something you can't control for.

Your relationship with Sunny is more complex than a lot of complex relationships because she is more complex. You'll never be able to eliminate all the her-ness and of course I have no doubt you wouldn't want to! She might be struggling at the moment, it might be the way she reacts to scary, uncomfortable molting, it might be something about the dynamic with the rest of your flock, it might be she's feeling under the weather, it might be some tiny thing that you can't even know. All you can do is to be consistent and safe and loving, even if this means that you give her more space to reduce the chance of bites. Absolutely have a good think about what it could be, but never forget the trust she has shown in you. The risks she has taken because you are there and the pain and discomfort she has let you cause her BECAUSE SHE TRUSTS YOU. She will not forget this, try not to either.

She broke the feather(s) you were talking about recently, she's deliberately or not started to follow an old, quite literally destructive pattern of behaviour and now there are other changes. You have to be the one to break the pattern. I work as a Psychologist with humans and I often think of this sort of "self destructive" behaviour as an opportunity for me to respond differently. I think of it as showing the person that there are different steps and the dance they know isn't the only one. I'm trying not to humanise Sunny's behaviour too much, but there are parallels here for me.

 

[ChristaNL]

Good one SailBoat!

(yup- have read all the Birdman666's threads )

I am a spoiled brat -> almost all my parrots (all my greys anyway) have chosen me even before they left for my house, so maybe I am not used to put in a lot of work

( actually, unless we are dealing with a severly traumatized being I am convinced it should not take years -- so... I must be doing something very wrong, I am the wrong person for her or she is really more traumatized than I can tell/ have been told.).

Sunny did not have much choice in the matter - she needed help and her previous owners decided I was it.

The thing I just cant get my mind wrapped around: the swinging back-and-forth.
I am not used to that from the greys - once they make up their mind its a done deal and you go from there.
Of course some days I am not as populair as others - that is only natural.
(Everyone has better/ worse days.)
But these are extreme swings in a very short time.


(do I have another bird that thinks it is an amazon? )


One moment I have this fluffed cutelooking bird on my lap that puts her face in my hand, skin on skin, even lets me stretch her busted-up wings etc.etc. - fast forward a few minutes, we concluded the cuddles or the work or just a bit of playing, are chilling (like we always do)
.... and even me moving my arm to reposition my computermouse is out of the blue treated as *the* most agressive move *ever*.

No, I have not gone beyond her tolerance-level -> I stop before that (the positive note and wanting more- approach) and did not wind her up sexually speaking. (Been very carefull about that, especially the last few weeks)

She will also switch when she is playing by herself on the tabletop next to my hand (tearing tissues to shreds, mucking about with things there) - and just starts acting afraid of me/ defensive lunging etc. while we always play interactive games there; I am not even making a move towards her at that time!

That's where the stress starts for me: once she is off into the defensive biting etc. I cannot succesfull ask her to step up and put her in her cage to chill out.


Even the wild rehab. owls, crows, herons, buzzards etc. were more predictable than that.
(LOL, usually they decide you are either out to kill them of are a relative harmless source of food - so that was easy, and we were not suppose to tame them at all because they had to go back to the wild).


I am just left with the *why* ?????


* This is the second time in 7 months she shows signs of molting
* maybe after laying an eg (the 18th last month) she is finally coming down from an hormonal high that was going on for way too long.
* maybe something is very, very wrong with her and I am too daft to notice


It al makes me a little more insecure - also not good when dealing with a pushy parrot:
- I really do not want to punish a parrot for acting out because it feels miserable, but I am also not going to tolerate misbehaviour from an ill-bred toddler!

so- to cuddle or kick butt, *that* is (one of) the question(s) I am trying to find and answer to.


Whats the cause of this?
How do I deal with that?
How do I prevent it from happening again?


(and what am I missing here )
.

 

[ChristaNL]

Oh hey bigfellasdad and Jottlebot- you guys type faster than I can

Thank you both!

Bigfellasdad: Oh yes- the stern look reminder was a good one - I use it almost subconciously a lot.
That means I forget to use it when stressed - so thank you for that!
It *is* a great tool!


Jottlebot: I think the humanizing might be the answer here.
I am just as autistic as the greys and struggle with the more flaboyant displays of macaws as opposed to their subtlety.

The "fault" is mine is as far you SailBoat and you both point out: the parrot cannot change, we need to help them do it.
-> The ball is in my court - and I forgot how to play / can't think of a good move atm.

Thats is one the reasons I am so glad with everyone here: I can flounder for a bit and you will be there!
It's always *so* much easier to keep a clear head when looking at someone elses issues. (at least for me)

Sunny is not just blindly reacting to something I do, but there is a lot going on inside that little mind I know nothing about. (And probably in that littly body as well)


I need to take a step back and figure it out/ or just go completely Zen and hope she will follow... but I don't want her to feel abandoned when I do that.

 

[ChristaNL]

Oh great - now she is lunging at me in the shower as well...
and I am not sure it is because she has had enough showerfun or wants more.


I am *SO* frustrated with my own brainfog atm!! :17:


This morning I got the the point I did not know what to do anymore:
She is sitting on her own showerperch, I am standing next to her, brushing my teeth and trying to enjoy "my turn" ( The greys were both soaking wet, the macaw was dripping and already had her beak brushed -> so they were done afaik) and there is someone tugging at the skin around my elbow (not very gently I might add).
I tried if she wanted to step up and get more of the spray - but lunging and lunging and I did not know what to do about it, because I did not understand the cause.

(I was already foaming at the mouth at that time! --> toothpaste, not rabies )

:light:

so...I reached out and turned of the light!

 

[ChristaNL]

(you cant bite what you cant see)


(yes, macaws like to talk in the dark )


(no, step-up after that, turning the light back on and finish the routine, to go downstairs was no problem at all)


(omg, did I just traumatize my parrots?)


(no, my bathroom does not have a window)

 

[Laurasea]

Hi ChristaNA!
First treat yourself to some expensive chocolate! You have been doing great work!!! Think of this as a big test to see if you are worthy for her to trust you more. The shower could have caused her pain and when the distracting joy of shower was done she felt the pain. Same with your therapy, when the pleasure of you working with her stops she feels the pain more... I certainly had some set backs with Penny, she started biting my neck at random times . . I had to throw away my anger and disappointment at this, and come back with more kindness, respect, and patience. She's a traumatized being. It seemed like she was testing me, to see how I would treat her if she was biting. Like if I bite and act bad you'll just act like everyone else has in my life! I had to work to put myself in the right headspace before working with her. Then it just stopped as suddenly as it had started. I think Sunny is having some pain, and also wants trust building. But first you need chocolate!!

 

[ChristaNL]

Oh, I like the way your mind works !

 

[ChristaNL]

Today: she is more balanced : the other wing has been "trimmed" as well,
so it's back to full penguin again:

Penguinbutt (with 2 large pinfeathers that get 'killed" as soon as it does not hurt too much for her to do so - aka: peel first, strip and sever after)
Penguinwings
Parrotfeet & beak

and it is not even Halloween yet!