Introducing 9 Month Old Male Eccy to 5 Year Old Girl

[Dacombe]

Hello everyone,
Bear with me for what may be a slightly wordy post, since it's really two posts in one.

I've had my girl Rupee for five years and I love her to bits. Ever since she's become sexually mature though she started nibbling the ends of her feathers, which slowly progressed into clipping them off on her chest and under her wings. This made me very sad as she is such a beautiful girl, but for a while now she's been looking quite ratty.

I tried absolutely everything to curtail this. I bought her so many new, different toys, gave her a radio to listen to while I'm out, and tried to distract her by making elaborate cardboard-box puzzles full of treats, putting her to bed earlier and many many more suggestions from lots of different parrot owners and gleaned from the advice of experts. This bird is out for hours a day, gets endless affection and attention, stacks of toys, is fully flighted and has the run of the house. I adore her and she wants for nothing. But none of it worked. She clipped off her chest feathers down to the grey fuzz, moulted them all back beautifully, then clipped them all off again. At the time she was on a 100% natural fruit and veg diet.

I took her to the vet when it started and he put her on Fluoxetine, which from my understanding is an anti-depressant. We tried it for a few months, it made her dopey, but it didn't help her stop clipping so we weened her off it, thank goodness. The vet also suggested feeding her Harrisons pellets in case she was missing something from her diet, as well as a vitamin and mineral supplement that gets sprinkled on her food. I now give her 50% fruit and veg and 50% pellets. When neither of those things helped the vet suggested it was probably a hormonal issue, likely due to sexual frustration and suggested we get her a mate, if we possibly could.

She has always been very bonded to me in a perhaps not very good way. She bows down and does the sexy dance for me. I don't pet her on the back, only on beak or cheeks, because I don't want to encourage her to do that, but she does it anyway, even if I am not touching her. She is also not interested in playing with her toys much any more, only in making nests in dark places, which she seeks out with a one-track-mind. For a while I blocked off all the dark corners and took away her cardboard boxes, but that just seemed to make her distressed and clip worse, so lately I have been letting her have a cat-carrier to sit in, have left it always in the same place so that she is not stressed by it getting taken away or moved around, and instead I have been avoiding handling her as much. I still spend plenty of time with her, but I try to be more hands-off so that she doesn't think I'm coming onto her in the hopes that she will start feeling less sexy.

But anyway since something is clearly still up with her, she is still clipping feathers, and having ruled out boredom and diet I can only think that she is pining for a mate. She spends HOURS every day sitting in the 'nest' she has made, even though the door is wide open and she is free to fly and play wherever she wants. She doesn't seem to clip her feathers when she is sitting in it, only when she is in her cage or if I take it away. It just breaks my heart to see her like this so I have decided that I will get her another eclectus to be her friend - something I thought I would I never do.

I just think it has to be far more natural to let her have a friend of her own kind. It's usually just me and her in the house since everyone else is usually out, so we don't have much of a 'flock' vibe going on here. Hopefully she will be interested in having a friend of her own species.

So I have put down a deposit on a 9 month old male. These birds are not common in my part of the world, and are not cheap, as you know, so I don't have hundreds of options to choose from when it comes to finding a male and I've had to use most of my savings to pay for him. The male I have put the deposit on has a very sad story and, after hearing it, I know that I would be able to give him a happy home and am determined to do so. From what I understand the male was rescued from some people who bought him, clipped his wings and then stuffed him in a tiny cage with no toys and fed him a horrible diet. Apparently he is friendly and will sit on your arm but has a fear of hands, which I am sure we will be able to work on.

I already have a large spare cage (was Rupee's before spoiled princess here moved into a gigantic macaw size castle) and boxes full of toys and perches. So I have set up his cage ready with lots of nice things and have no doubt he is going to be happy. My ONE concern is that possibly Rupee is not going to like him, or possibly she will get jealous and sad.

I know it would have been better if he was more her age, but I am hoping she will be nice even if she doesn't see him as mate material. She is tame, but can be bossy like any female eclectus. The only other eclectus she has ever met was her younger brother when she went to stay with her breeders for a holiday. Apparently she pecked him, shouted at him and stole all his toys. They were both quite young at that time and I am hoping now that she is of breeding age she will be more willing to accept the companionship of this young male - or failing that will at least enjoy his company.

I am going to put their cages on opposite sides of the room and slowly move them closer, playing with the male separately at first so that Rupee doesn't get jealous, and then very slowly introducing them in neutral ground. I really don't want her to feel jealous. I don't have any plans to breed them, but I am hoping once he matures they will form a bond and would possibly be able to move in together in Rupee's very large cage (realistically a couple of years down the line if they do get along).

So basically I am looking for advice as to how to make this a positive experience for both of them. I don't want her to be jealous and I don't want him to be scared of her. Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks.
:red:

 

[Violet_Diva]

Hello Dacombe. I saw your advert just yesterday as I was posting a similar one seeking a male for my girl! I think Anansi would probably have some practical suggestions for helping with introducing the pair as I know he has experience in this area. OutlawedSpirit has experience of challenging behaviours and might be able to offer some suggestions. Im afraid I'm of no use at this point. I previously asked everyone if they thought getting a companion for my Bella was a good idea or not:

http://www.parrotforums.com/eclectus/64513-companion-bird-good-bad-idea.html

Also Taw5106 Has a female that's been hormonal, she too might have some advice you may find helpful. I remember seeing this thread:

http://www.parrotforums.com/eclectus/63503-venus-update-shes-still-raging-hormone.html

I hope you get a reply with some helpful pointers from someone with more experience. Good luck with your new boy
PS: If you happen across another male - please let me know!

 

[Anansi]

Personally, I stay away from allowing my female ekkie (Maya) any access to anything even remotely nest-like, as I believe it tends to exacerbate the issue. (Please don't take this as judgement from me. I can tell from your post that you love Rupee to death and have simply been looking for a way to ease her hormonal distress.) But I can imagine that she would be quite upset if you were to attempt to take it away at this point.

I would still take away her nest analog and move all of her perches and toys around in an attempt to refresh her environment, so to speak, and then try to ride out her response to the changes. I'd try to offset her distress by keeping her distracted. Exercise is the best bet for this. You've mentioned that she is fully flighted, which allows for flight drills and such which might siphon off enough of her excess energy to put her in a calmer state of mind. Foraging activities and puzzle toys are also great diversions.

As for the pending new addition to your household, let me first say congratulations!

Please remember to institute a quarantine of 60-90 days. (90 is best to account for disease cycles and such, but you at least want 60.)

Once quarantine is over, your approach for introducing them sounds good. You do want to establish a kind of routine so far as your training/interactive time is concerned. With Jolly and Maya, I've instituted a turn-based training system. This has been done consistently enough for them to understand that when I'm working with one, the other need only wait his/her turn. This is huge in offsetting any jealousy that might initially arise.

Unfortunately, there's no way to know if they'll truly bond with each other until they meet. Just as with people, some birds click right away... while others take on an immediate dislike for one another. Add to this that your girl has been an "only child" for long enough that she might not be immediately receptive to companionship with another bird. But even if this turns out to be the case, their relationship can be managed well enough to prevent them harming one another... so long as you set their boundaries and establish that consistent routine.

Also, keep in mind the age difference you mentioned between the two. The new addition probably won't provide any palpable relief in terms of Rupee's sexual frustration for another 2+ years. But if they do wind up bonding, it is possible that she might draw some comfort from his presence. Just not a certainty.

And one last thing about poor Rupee's plucking. I debated mentioning this, as it is hearsay and I prefer speaking from my own experience... and also because it goes against how I generally believe the situation should be handled, but this has worked for at least one person and thus deserves mention. And addressing it here allows me to point out the inherent risks, rather than anyone finding it elsewhere and not necessarily being advised of the potential downside.

One ekkie owner that I know of found that her ekkie plucked the chest and under wing areas in order to line her nest, as there was no other nesting material available. So she pretty much went the opposite direction of what I've suggested and provided both a nest and material for the lining of said nest. And this apparently worked to stop the plucking.

The risks inherent to that tactic? Encouraging egg-laying and increasing the possibility of egg-binding. Frequent egg-laying can deplete calcium stores and become a health risk. A risk I personally deem too great.

Please keep us updated on Rupee's condition, as well as how things go with the latest member of your flock once he comes home.

 

[BruceTheQuail]

We introduced a 9 month old boy to a 3 year old girl about this time last year. She bullied him quite a bit (and still does sometimes, where food is concerned) but he is finally putting some moves on her. It was recommended to us that we have his perch slightly higher than hers (I think there is some debate over whether parrots see height as dominance) but I think that the real turning point was when I put them in their travel cages and took them for a half hour drive to the vet. It seemed to settle her bullying a bit and let them get their relationship back on an even keel, which actually the vet's assistance thought might happen if I bought them both down at the same time.

 

[Dacombe]

Thanks everyone for the good advice. I will keep him in a seperate room at first to quarantine, which will probably also help him to feel comfortable in his new home before introducing him to the Queen Bee. I would also like to start training him to harness, since Rupee enjoys walks and perhaps taking them both outside on harness would be a good way to get them used to eachother's company in an entirely neutral territory.

With regards to providing nesting material, Rupee actually took some bits of cardboard from her cage into her cat-carrier and has shredded it in there. This activity seems to keep her very occupied and contented so I am torn between not encouraging her to nest, and just letting her satisfy her natural urges.

I did just rearrange her cage yesterday, and have replaced lots of her solid perches with swings hanging from the top. She has never enjoyed using swings and seems to distrust them because they move so I generally use natural branch perches instead, but I am hoping the challenge of navigating around her cage with them will provide a distraction and maybe she will learn to enjoy using them.

Also, Violet Diva, it seems there is a shortage of male eclectus, and lots of people looking for mates for their girls. I will let you know if I see any though. Thank you for the links, I will read them. And thank you everyone for your advice. It's just so tricky when there is no easy 'right and wrong' answer!

 

[Kiwibird]

Is your vet an avian specialized vet? Never heard of an AV suggesting a non-breeder pet bird be given a mate as a cure for hormonal issues before. If you haven't been seeing an avian specialized vet, let us help you find one or perhaps find a second opinion to help work through your females problems and get your new male off on the right foot, so they can be friends, not mates. I also would be curious what tests your vet ran to try to determine the cause of the plucking? Ekkies are very diet sensitive and prone to food allergies. The onset of hormones can exacerbate those kinds of issues. Toxins in the environment and some illnesses can cause plucking too, again exacerbated by raging hormones.