Indecision...

[Helitorian]

I've got feathers on my brain from all the searching I've been doing on parrots that I can get but I seem to have a problem. I'm stuck between choosing a Sun conure, Turquoise conure or a Hanhs Macaw. A sun will be the same size as Con, the GC will be a tad smaller, and the Macaw will be an inch longer. My brain hurts because I can't choose which one will be best for Con so I'd really like some advice and input from you guys. I really appreciate it. Thanks!

 

[Pedro]

Well IMO I would go for the Hahn's, they are cute & funny, have a bit of attitude & can talk very well. If you get a sun you would have to get the same sex as con to avoid breeding. GCC has more attitude than them all.LOL. But what ever you decide on there are no guarantees that Con will get on with them.

 

[DaCoSim]

I ADORE my turk!!!! She is the sweetest thing ever known to man, IMO!!!

 

[QuackQuack]

Turquoise GCC sounds best easiest to plan for in the future, compact, snuggly, smart, clownish cheap to feed comparatively! I could gush about GCC all day. They are great - everyone needs one ....OK not EVERYONE !

 

[cdog]

I was going to get a Hahns but I couldn't find one near me, I read that they are little balls of awesome fun, but its comes down to noise and what you prefer. If you cant decide then go visit some and see which you like best.

 

[Helitorian]

Thanks to YouTube and my best friend, I have decided on a Hahns Macaw. I'll just not tell my dad about the macaw part or he'll get all freaky. He's got this weird thing about anything larger than a conure because he says it'll be mean and eat his fingers. Silly Father lol Thanks for the advice from you guys and letting me bounce my idea/indecision off you though

 

[QuackQuack]

Will it be living with your father? If so, let him know so it doesn't have to be rehomed!

 

[Helitorian]

Will it be living with your father? If so, let him know so it doesn't have to be rehomed!

The bird will be living with my father and I until my 6 months are up at my new job and I can go buy a house. My dad just has this thing about any bird that isn't a conure being evil because out neighbors have two Grays that you can't touch or anything. He thinks all large birds are like that and no amount of research or proof I can provide will change his mind. You should have seen his face when I said I put a deposit down on an African Gray. He told me I had a week to pack my **** and leave. He just needs to get over his weird fear and Hahns are the same size as Con anyway so there isn't a massive difference between the sizes. I'll be letting him know about my choice tomorrow.

 

[Amber]

Will it be living with your father? If so, let him know so it doesn't have to be rehomed!

The bird will be living with my father and I until my 6 months are up at my new job and I can go buy a house. My dad just has this thing about any bird that isn't a conure being evil because out neighbors have two Grays that you can't touch or anything. He thinks all large birds are like that and no amount of research or proof I can provide will change his mind. You should have seen his face when I said I put a deposit down on an African Gray. He told me I had a week to pack my **** and leave. He just needs to get over his weird fear and Hahns are the same size as Con anyway so there isn't a massive difference between the sizes. I'll be letting him know about my choice tomorrow.

It may or may not help to tell him that Hans can be considered close to the conures on the genetic tree due to them being (supposedly, their are examples on the internet but I have never seen one IRL so can not confirm personally) able to hybridise with some conures. As far as macaws go, their the most 'conure like'

Here is one supposed sun x hans, though I'm not 100% on if it actually is what they claim

Though the bare parts around the eyes kind of halfway between a conure ring and a hahns bareface do make it seem possible.


And here's the Hahn's x nanday

There are also reputable records of hahns x blue crowned

Just tell your dad to think of him as a slightly larger conure! Conures in turn are often thought of as mini macaws. You'll just have to do some careful explaining.

 

[Joeyx]

go with the hahn's!! they're such cute little characters!

 

[Helitorian]

I spoke with him about getting a Hahns and as soon as I said Macaw, he told me to move out. I had to carefully explain the size ration of a Hahns to Con and he asked if he could sleep on it. The next day, he wanted to read about them then he said he'd rather I'd get a conure but it was my decision. I called up my local breeder and asked if he had any or knew where to get any. He said he'd have to get one shipped in for me but if I was still interested in a Sun Conure, he could get me a Red Factor Sun baby for $450.

He explained that he was trying to get a RF pair and that the money I gave him for the baby would be used to help buy the parents and he'd wean the baby for me and give me a recipt and all that. I think its a good deal and I've always wanted a RF Sun. I can get the Hahns when I'm in my own place that way I don't have to worry about my dad being afraid of the Macaw.

I really liked those pictures of the macaw/conure hybrid. The Nanday one was beautiful! I wonder how much one of those would go for? But thanks you guys for letting me bounce my ideas and stuff off you!

 

[Spiritbird]

I always say if you cannot decide then wait.

 

[Wulfgeist]

I spoke with him about getting a Hahns and as soon as I said Macaw, he told me to move out. I had to carefully explain the size ration of a Hahns to Con and he asked if he could sleep on it. The next day, he wanted to read about them then he said he'd rather I'd get a conure but it was my decision. I called up my local breeder and asked if he had any or knew where to get any. He said he'd have to get one shipped in for me but if I was still interested in a Sun Conure, he could get me a Red Factor Sun baby for $450.

He explained that he was trying to get a RF pair and that the money I gave him for the baby would be used to help buy the parents and he'd wean the baby for me and give me a recipt and all that. I think its a good deal and I've always wanted a RF Sun. I can get the Hahns when I'm in my own place that way I don't have to worry about my dad being afraid of the Macaw.

I really liked those pictures of the macaw/conure hybrid. The Nanday one was beautiful! I wonder how much one of those would go for? But thanks you guys for letting me bounce my ideas and stuff off you!

So if I'm reading this right you will be paying for a baby before he even has a pair to breed it?

 

[Amber]

Hansday i think they call them, without starting the hybrid debate, I do think they are lovely birds without conflicting urges/habits who do rather well like most macaw hybrids, unlike some lovebird hybrids. Though I wouldn't deliberately breed one, I do like them and would certiantly adopt one if I had the chance.

I spoke with him about getting a Hahns and as soon as I said Macaw, he told me to move out. I had to carefully explain the size ration of a Hahns to Con and he asked if he could sleep on it. The next day, he wanted to read about them then he said he'd rather I'd get a conure but it was my decision. I called up my local breeder and asked if he had any or knew where to get any. He said he'd have to get one shipped in for me but if I was still interested in a Sun Conure, he could get me a Red Factor Sun baby for $450.

He explained that he was trying to get a RF pair and that the money I gave him for the baby would be used to help buy the parents and he'd wean the baby for me and give me a recipt and all that. I think its a good deal and I've always wanted a RF Sun. I can get the Hahns when I'm in my own place that way I don't have to worry about my dad being afraid of the Macaw.

I really liked those pictures of the macaw/conure hybrid. The Nanday one was beautiful! I wonder how much one of those would go for? But thanks you guys for letting me bounce my ideas and stuff off you!

So if I'm reading this right you will be paying for a baby before he even has a pair to breed it?

That's how I read it too. Just be aware here that it could take months for him to find suitable/compatible RF as their are certain breeding conditions and genetics that must be ensured to avoid breeding the hypothetical 'double reds' which are lethal. After actually getting the right pair, most probably a RF and a normal if he knows what he is doing, which is the safest breeding pair to avoid lethals, they would actually need to bond and breed (and maybe even mature to be old enough to do so first). Then, no RF babies can even be guaranteed in each clutch, as while it would be a 50% chance of each chick being RF, that doesn't mean heir will necessary be one in the first clutch.

So assuming he can source a pair, they are old enough, they actually bond and breed AND a RF is produced in the clutch, you will be waiting awhile, more so if their is a hiccup along the way

RF is dominant accumulative and seems to be lethal in the double form (either due to the RF gene itself OR a gene associated with that separates with it that is lethal in the double form). As it is cumulative, some RF are barley red (commonly called tangerine) and others vibrant and it takes special line breeding to actually get decent RFs without producing lethal chicks. So although he may source a RF their is no guarantee on quality, or guarantee on the quality of the chicks. Also due to inbreeding in many RF lines they can be genetically less healthy/more prone to disease so quality birds with strong genes from reputable breeders who out cross regularly need to be chosen.

The usual (And safe!) cross is...

R r --> RF parent
r Rr rr
r Rr rr
|
v
Normal parent

Which results in
50% RF offspring chance
50% normal chance

Any chick with one R will be RF. Any with two R lethal (requires both parents to have RF genes to occur), and with none normal
This means what while they have the potential to produce RF chicks it's not going to happen 100% of the time, so you might (worst case scenario) actually have to wait a clutch or two as they might all be normal! That said, on the other side, it's 50/50 so you may end up with more RF babies then you can handle! Usually its roughly a 50/50 mix of them in each clutch of course though

But I also need to say that by RF pair I sincerely hope he does not mean a breeding pair or two red birds, as he is going to produce lethal chicks. It's a very complex mutation to breed correctly. If you want RF, I am not saying this guy is bad, but I would personally be going to an experienced RF or sun breeder to ensure genetic health/no problems from the previous inbreeding taken to establish the mutation, and that they are being bred ethically to avoid lethal chicks. Just food for thought, I LOVE RF but they require a bit of thought as to where you get them to ensure long term health and that lethal chicks are not being bred deliberate to get lots of RF in the surviving siblings.

 

[caliopi]

Well IMO I would go for the Hahn's, they are cute & funny, have a bit of attitude & can talk very well. If you get a sun you would have to get the same sex as con to avoid breeding. GCC has more attitude than them all.LOL. But what ever you decide on there are no guarantees that Con will get on with them.

I am with Pedro on this one. I am so jealous because here in Oz birds like Amazons and Macaws are just sooooooo expensive! I would dearly love either an Amazon or a Macaw but they are just a dream at this stage.

 

[KatherineI]

I spoke with him about getting a Hahns and as soon as I said Macaw, he told me to move out. I had to carefully explain the size ration of a Hahns to Con and he asked if he could sleep on it. The next day, he wanted to read about them then he said he'd rather I'd get a conure but it was my decision. I called up my local breeder and asked if he had any or knew where to get any. He said he'd have to get one shipped in for me but if I was still interested in a Sun Conure, he could get me a Red Factor Sun baby for $450.

He explained that he was trying to get a RF pair and that the money I gave him for the baby would be used to help buy the parents and he'd wean the baby for me and give me a recipt and all that. I think its a good deal and I've always wanted a RF Sun. I can get the Hahns when I'm in my own place that way I don't have to worry about my dad being afraid of the Macaw.

I really liked those pictures of the macaw/conure hybrid. The Nanday one was beautiful! I wonder how much one of those would go for? But thanks you guys for letting me bounce my ideas and stuff off you!

So if I'm reading this right you will be paying for a baby before he even has a pair to breed it?

That's how I read it too... personally, that would raise some serious red flags for me and I'd search for another breeder, unless this is someone I've known or have tons of credible references for. And I'd never do anything in this type of situation unless I had everything in writing.

 

[Amber]

Well IMO I would go for the Hahn's, they are cute & funny, have a bit of attitude & can talk very well. If you get a sun you would have to get the same sex as con to avoid breeding. GCC has more attitude than them all.LOL. But what ever you decide on there are no guarantees that Con will get on with them.

I am with Pedro on this one. I am so jealous because here in Oz birds like Amazons and Macaws are just sooooooo expensive! I would dearly love either an Amazon or a Macaw but they are just a dream at this stage.

Aus here too, when I as younger their was a baby B&G for 7,000 at the per store down the road from my grandmothers. She was beautiful! Had I not just been getting into birds at the time (Alex was not even a thought in my mind at that stage!) she probably would have come home with me and my mother (where I was living at the time) I later learnt that for Aus, that is a very reasonable price for a B&G

But we do have the benefit that our native birds (Ekkies, toos, etc) are very reasonably priced. Sulphurs overseas can be thousands, here, a measly $100 or two, for example. This is both good and bad though, as so many irresponsible or unsuitable people end up with these high maintenance birds. ):

 

[Helitorian]

Guess I didn't do a very good job of explaining. My breeder is actually the owner of one of the two rescues in my state and he breeds on the side as well. We were chatting about Sun Conures and he said he'd contact all his breeder friends then get back to me. Several told him they had babies available and one said that he had a pair of RF Suns with hatchlings that he was interested in selling. The rescue guy has been looking for a pair of RFs so when I called he told me about the suns he could get me and mentioned the RFs.

I really want one and after inquiring as to what he'd charge me for one, I wanted one and that's when he explained that he had to buy the pair. Since he runs the Rescue/Sanctuary as well, he's tight on money so he asked if it'd be alright if the money I gave him for the chick could be used towards the parents. I didn't mind as long as I got a receipt for the transaction. He then said he wants me to come check out his rescue and his breeding program before I buy to make sure I'm ok with his methods and with my choice.

Either way, he'll get money from me because I want to start supporting a bird rescue and possibly volunteering and he's the closest. So if something happens, I can get my money back or a new chick of whichever species I choose. I'm being careful with my money because I don't have much for starters and I don't want to buy a sick bird and go through the pain of losing it. When we meet face to face, I will tell him this and make it clear I will not not tolerate being jerked around.

Thank you Amber for informing me about the lethal chicks. I will definitely ask about the parents and the previous breeders used to make them. If something sounds off, I'll decide on a different bird.

 

[KatherineI]

Guess I didn't do a very good job of explaining. My breeder is actually the owner of one of the two rescues in my state and he breeds on the side as well. We were chatting about Sun Conures and he said he'd contact all his breeder friends then get back to me. Several told him they had babies available and one said that he had a pair of RF Suns with hatchlings that he was interested in selling. The rescue guy has been looking for a pair of RFs so when I called he told me about the suns he could get me and mentioned the RFs.

I really want one and after inquiring as to what he'd charge me for one, I wanted one and that's when he explained that he had to buy the pair. Since he runs the Rescue/Sanctuary as well, he's tight on money so he asked if it'd be alright if the money I gave him for the chick could be used towards the parents. I didn't mind as long as I got a receipt for the transaction. He then said he wants me to come check out his rescue and his breeding program before I buy to make sure I'm ok with his methods and with my choice.

Either way, he'll get money from me because I want to start supporting a bird rescue and possibly volunteering and he's the closest. So if something happens, I can get my money back or a new chick of whichever species I choose. I'm being careful with my money because I don't have much for starters and I don't want to buy a sick bird and go through the pain of losing it. When we meet face to face, I will tell him this and make it clear I will not not tolerate being jerked around.

Thank you Amber for informing me about the lethal chicks. I will definitely ask about the parents and the previous breeders used to make them. If something sounds off, I'll decide on a different bird.

Aaah, now that makes soooo much more sense!! At least to me. Good luck!!