I need advice regarding SassyByrd & relationships...

[PickleMeDickles]

Hello All,

The Amazon Forum has been sooooo quiet lately, what is going on? :33:

Thanks in advance for taking the time to read this! It seems like just when you think you have a grasp on these complex green dinos, something else rears its head. Its like having to learn a whole new language, culture and way of thinking! I'm at the point where I need advice from those of you more experienced/knowledgeable. But before I get to all that, here is a photo I snapped of Sass the other day that is just so "her".

Okay, now on to our latest problem. There is so much to say/include, I hope I can get this to make sense.

The History:

It is just hubby and me at home, and we work out of our house so we are around the birds all day. Hubby was in the hospital from Dec-Mar this year. SassyByrd spends 90% or more of her day with me (hubby is in the other room). I do EVERYTHING (did I say everything?) for the birds. They would never have a toy, or vegetable, or even be out of their cage if it were up to my husband. He "likes" the birds, but I am the one who is passionate.

SassyByrd and Me (Mom)

We have a very good friendship and almost everything she has learned to say she has learned from me. She is gentle with me and loves to step up and spend 1:1 time with me but any kind of scritches are not tolerated. She "never" leaves her play area spontaneously to come to say hi to me.

SassyByrd and Hubby (Dad)

Hubby likes the Sass, but is not in love. They hardly ever play and he really doesn't encourage any type of relationship. However, any time he comes into the room SassyByrd immediately does what she has to so that she can climb up his wheelchair and be cuddled. This has become very annoying to hubby and he will typically cuddle her for a few minutes and then put her in her cage and shut the door so he can work without having her on him (she steals his glasses). When she first approaches him he grabs her like a puppy and pets her all over (which she would NEVER tolerate from me). However, she is great at first when he cuddles her then she starts biting him hard. Also, if I come to close to them when they are a "couple" she will bite him. And if I have to retrieve her from him I best use a dowel or I will get bit. This is the only time she is aggressive with me.

My Thoughts

I totally realize that relationships, esp. with our fids, can eb and flow over time and what exists today may look very different with time. I just want to do what I can so that everybody is happy.

Of course ideally I want to be the love of SassyByrd's life but they want ice water in hell too, so I know that is not in the cards at this time. Second best is remaining good friends, and this is part of the advice I need. Other than the obvious (working actively to maintain that friendship) is there anything else I should be aware of?

Thought on Hubby & Cuddling

This is an area of immense frustration to me :12:. Hubby and I have gotten into WW III :56: with me trying to get him to only scritch the head and neck only. He just doesn't accept that stroking behind the neck could be a really dumb thing to do with harmful outcomes for Sass. I get the feeling that The Sass is taking all his cuddling (stoking the back, wings, etc) personal, as in sexual. Is this why she is getting aggressive toward him when I come near? Why does she encourage this type of "petting" and then get irritated and aggressive within 5 minutes or so? Is she getting sexually frustrated because he won't move past 2nd base? Would video of any of this be helpful to any of you?

In Closing

So, there is our current major problem. Of course there are always little side dramas and I actually plan on posting a couple of other questions, but this issue is definitely one that has me the most worried. I don't want Sass developing issues that may stay with her for a lifetime.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts, advice or anything you may have to contribute. Have a fantastic weekend!

-Jen

 

[SailBoat]

The demon word in Amazon relationships is: Expectation!
The rule is: Expectations do not exist as it /they only get into the way of expanding a relationship. Remember, this process can be and often is years in the making.

On the wall behind our DYH Amazons cage is:
It is never the Fault of the Amazon!
It is always the Fault of the Human!
When you view your interaction(s) from this vantage point, clarity of what one is doing wrong is seen sooner and one can correct one's interaction sooner.

In near all relationships I am aware of, one Human always has a richer relationship that the other. It is the way it is... FYI: Amazon's have been known to switch their favored status Humans around a bit. No promises!!!

Your Hubby is not helping his relationship. Physical contact (sexual) has a progression to it and if not followed, a sharp bite commonly results. Hence, do not start something that will result in a sharp bite!!! If he gets bit - "It is Never the Fault of the Amazon!!!"

 

[wrench13]

Are we seeking a 'magic bullet' here? You certainly have enough experience to know that does not exist in parrot-dom.

Hubbster to stop physical contact,except for head only scratchies. Cut back or cease being the bearer of treats.

You become the bearer of treats and head scratchies.

 

[PickleMeDickles]

Thanks for the thoughts & advice Sailboat & Wrench. The situation with Sass & Hubby is complicated. Dear Hubby was diagnosed with inoperable cancer and had his leg amputated March 26 of this year. He trained cutting horses for a living and was a "horse whisperer" before that term was ever uttered. He has a true knack for getting "in the head" of other species. And he is a staunch advocate in the belief that it is always the humans fault, regardless of the type of critter. Unfortunately, he has been to hell and back this year, and although I can honestly say he has never once complained about one single thing, the trauma of the last year (and everything associated with it) is undoubtedly affecting his ability to form new ways of interacting with a species he is not at all familiar with.

I'm not sure what I said that would leave one to believe I was in search of a "magic bullet". Believe me, if I even halfway believed in magic bullets, Hubby would be cancer free, have 2 legs and there would be world peace. I am sure there are people who come to this forum in search of a magic bullet who need to be woken up, but I am the type of person to never assume anything about anyone, especially online. I think, particularly with the anonymity of online communities, it is all too easy to forget that every single person has their own unique world view and individual life experiences they bring with them. And while keeping this in mind, I also believe that the vast majority of people coming to this type of forum come with the goal of bettering the life of a bird. I truly hope that others feel welcome to ask whatever they want to without fear of being judged or looked down upon.

And yes, it may be easy to wonder why the questions. After all, I have a whole 4 years experience with birds. But only the last 18 months with an Amazon. All of my other birds have been conures. And I spent almost 6 of those 18 months living at the hospital (hubby ended up at a hospital 4 hours away from home), trying to keep our business afloat and taking care of everyone on our ranch. And before the Sass, I didn't even know what an Amazon was. I mention these points because every single one is a factor in regards to the original post. And perhaps a 1.5 year Amazon parent should already have all the answers, but I don't, and that's why I posted the question.

What I was (or am) looking for was the opinion of other experienced Amazon people regarding my hypothesis regarding some of Sass's behaviors being caused by or linked to Hubby's interactions with her (as in inappropriate physical contact). I am hoping that as I become more educated I can then educate Hubby. And if the "education" comes from "online experts" it may be more warmly received than if coming from good old wifey. And actually, this part of my "genius plan" has already started working! I read SailBoats response to hubby last night, and this morning the Sass was sitting on the hubster and he was telling her, "Okay honey, I can't scratch past your neck anymore, just head scritches, Mommy's friends say it's for the best". I almost fell out of my chair, I've been on him for months and he reads one post from SailBoat and now he's ready to change his ways? Whatever works!

I was also wondering about the most likely progression in a situation like this. But I think SailBoat answered this one pretty good with his thoughts on expectations. I don't even want to know (expect) what is going to happen next, because it will most likely be a self fulfilling prophecy. I have decided to try to optimize my relationship with Sass "today", as in no expectations about tomorrow. If I focus on what is best today, I can try to forget all my misgivings about what tomorrow might bring. I have been so focused on all the horrific ways our friendship could suffer and it was interfering with today's enjoyment of this very special girl.

And finally, if anyone has been through a similar situation or had suggestions on how to maintain a close connection with Sass, I was quite interested in their thoughts. After all, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing the same way and expecting different results. Sharing information and knowledge with one another is where a forum like this really flexes its muscles. We are so lucky to have the technology today to learn from others from all over the world.

Okay, now I have to go redecorate everyone's house (cage). I went a little crazy at my favorite bird store!