How to stop Rotating Perches (pack-o-bird/northernparrots/ any other)

[ChristaNL]

I know I am not always the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to creative thinking... :52: so I would like to ask you guys (m/f) out there if you have any clever ideas about this.

All my backpacks are (at least) secondhand
and ALL have the same issue:
Rotating Perches!!

=

I have (for the greys) a NorthernParrots backpack as well (got lucky) a Pack-O-Bird.
(Why? Well I discovered too late that my largest grey, Japie, is just too large to fit in a medium NP-backpack. So when someone offered me a M/L POB I went for it.)

While looking for a larger cage for Sunny that same person just happened to have an older POB-macawsize lying around...
It looks like someone sat on it for an extended period of time, and the straps are missing (but since all the POBstraps are the same that really is not a problem, I just borrow them from the greys) but at least she will not have to go back in her doggy-bench to get to the vet.
(She always backslides into stressinduced trance-hanginging from the ceiling and now she has half a tail she does not even fit that well anymore... and those feathers *must* be protected of course )

Since I do not have a car and go (almost) everywhere by bicycle or on foot (sometimes the bus/train) they need to have a good, solid & stable perch to hold on to.

==

so .... apart from brute force and some handtools (pliers etc.) to really force everything together, what can I do??

(not a very strong person here, and Sunny is heavy! 1250 grams, no idea how much that is in american-weights, sorry.
But even Appies perch rotates all the time )

I have tried rubber rings in between the metal- but they take up too much room -> the end-screwy/threaded-parts are not that long.

I have even considered adding 'legs' to the wood/ perch itself so it could not rotate any further. (Like a stool.)

The NP-backpacks are (in)famous for the rotation (actually reason number one people ditch them - according to what I found online) and because they just have a single piece of metal with the screwy-thread going in the exact same direction the whole lenght it is impossible to really tighten it -> because if you do you just unscrew it from where it is embedded/glued in the perch/wood part.
Been there, done that!



How you do keep those perches in the same place?? :20: and your parrots safely seated ??




(They all are great to take apart for cleaning etc- but I cannot even put one back together so it is fully functional... )

 

[SailBoat]

Christa,
I do not own any of this group of products, so the question: Are the perches attached on only one side (end) or both ends?
Also, what diameter are the perch ends (thickness of the perch)?

1250 grams is a bit over 2 pounds. That said, most everyone with Parrots in the USA are somewhat able to follow gram weight for Parrots.

 

[ChristaNL]

(thanks on the weight/ I know american pounds are lighter than the universal ones, so it is alway hard to translate. She would be about 275.5778 or so? No idea how to write that correctly.)


If you put large-ish branches in cages you kind of make a sandwich:
end of stick / washer /--cagebars or mesh--/ washer/ and nut (or wingnut)

All the backpacks have these metal rings to protect the hole / keep the surrounding material from fraying.
But is is more or less the same:
end of stick / washer /--metal ring--/ washer/ and nut (or wingnut)


somehow the washers do not get enough "grip" on that ring to stop the perch from spinning.
(does this make any sense?)

So the perch wil behave like a swing or even rotate competely round and round.

 

[Betrisher]

It's 3.30am, so my thinking brain isn't fully in gear. I'll try for better tomorrow.

My first thought, though, was to try making big fat leather washers out of veg tanned leather. I have exactly the right stuff here in my leatherwork kit: it's 10oz calf with a good hefty nap on the flesh side. I'd be cutting two washers for each end of the perch and affix them so the flesh is against the fabric on each side of the pack. Then, tighten the nuts that hold the perches and you should get a good strong grip. It may be the sides of the bag that support the perch need reinforcing. You could use heavy canvas or sheets of acrylic or some heavy lining leather or the plastic stuff used to make ring-binders or document holders, depending on your needs.

Why don't you post some photos of the backpack and perch, so we can see the problem clearly and then brainstorm how to fix it?

 

[LordTriggs]

what I would opt for is to secure one of the screws into place with a glue of some sort but not glue the other screw on the other side, that way you can still remove the screw from one end and then just twist the perch itself to remove it for cleaning. Unless the problem is different to what I'm thinking?

 

[bill_e]

If the issue is the nut or wingnut getting loose then just paint a little nail polish on the threads before attaching the nut.

If the issue is the screw itself twisting, these are usually hanger bolts that are screwed into the end of the perch. Remove the perch. Take two nuts and screw them onto one of the ends and using two wrenches tighten them against each other. Doing this will allow you to tighten up the hanger bolt into the perch. Now place your wrench on the outer nut making sure you are not also on the inner nut, and turn clockwise to tighten the hanger bolt into the perch. Once tight, use the two wrenches like before only this time apply counterclockwise force to loosen them. once loose you can remove them. The last thing to do is to get some super glue and apply it to the thread when it enters the perch so that it wicks down and secures the bolt. Do this to both ends of the perch.

If everything is tight and it's still rotating, get a piece of rubber from a bicycle inner tube or the like and cut up two washers which will be placed so that they are in contact with the carrier, then tighten everything down. You can us leather if you're worried about your bird chewing or just make sure any of the rubber washers that he can get to are smaller diameter than the metal washer which covers it.

Sorry if this is confusing, it's difficult to write instructions when some people might be totally mechanically dis-inclinded

 

[SailBoat]

As stated, photo would be nice. But, I believe what you are talking about is also the same or near the same as Kiwi's Mom, (Big Amazon) has.

Glue is not a good choice in this application even when placed on the threads as they screw into the perch. But very good choice, if the wood begins to stripe and lose shape.

The washes appear to be the most likely problem as their surface and that of the metal eye openings are both flat and smooth.
A traditional lock washer may work as they tend to place a cross-cut edge against the metal eye opening. They are tricky to place because one needs to understand that they must be places so that if they begin to slip, the direction of the cross-cut edge then cuts into the metal eye. The simple way around this is to use two. One on the inside against the perch and one on the outside. As you look down on the sandwich, the lifted side of the locking washer faces the Nut and the other faces the Perch. Take care not to over size the lock washer as the metal base of the Nut needs to make full contact with the lock washer.

The Nut: Here you want a locking Nut. The best type for this application would be a Nylock Nut. Likely has a different name on your side of the Pond. It is like a standard Nut with a additional piece of plastic encased by the top of the Nut. It starts-on with easy and when the threads makes contact with the plastic insert it become more difficult to turn.

Lock Washer: Better choice is a 'Specially' Locking Washer. They can come in a wrinkled (grooved) appearance that increase the number of cross-cuts on the metal eyes, which resists turning. There is also a version that uses a series of cuts across the washer, which does the same thing. These can be difficult to find and they come in a fairly large number of configurations for different applications.

Consider taking the bag and perch to a Big Box Store or a local Hardware Store (not sure how that translates). Once there look for someone with gray hair and tell them that it is very important that the perch does not turn, but you cannot apply to much torque.

If this does not work. I have another idea, but it is more invasive.

 

[ChristaNL]

No (problem), its allright, you all are making perfect sense!!
(I am the one hampered by not knowing the technical terms / sometimes not even in dutch ...so that is not helping either)


So glad to have your imput here! :07:


=


I know I needed to replace the rotten, unworkable one from the NP-pack anyway.
Got a few of the hanger bolts (thanks- the guy here called them "stok-einde" because they are mainly used on flagpoles, to add a nice decorative top on them)- the fist batch I bought was too small and then I could not figure out how to get them screwed in tight without damaging the other end...
I think I get that picture now.


I would never have thought of using that type of glue, but it makes perfect sense.
(I have 3 types of woodglue, but none of them will get in deep enough)


=


will badger my friend with the camera to make some pictures this weekend, lets see if I can (or need to) add those "1000 words" to this thread

 

[bill_e]

YouTube has everything. This video is for installing hanger bolts but it also shows the method of using two nuts to screw the hanger bolt tighter into the perch. If the bolt itself has stripped out of the perch, you can easily just buy the next size up and use that.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSSh1qfHxMs"]Leg Daddy University: Installing Hanger Bolts Into Sofa Legs - YouTube[/ame]

 

[ChristaNL]

Thank you Bill, that is spot on!

 

[ChristaNL]

Today I got one of the backpacks fitted with a few pieces of leather in between.
(wood perch, leather, inside washer, leather, pack-o-bird-ring, outside washer, wingnut)

I hope this will work - it's pretty tight now- let's see how it will behave after some wear and tear in a few months. (Too cold to take them outside atm.)
The first perch (M/L POB ) is reasonably stable now.
I can turn the perch a bit when I really put force on it, but I hope with just Japie/ Appie on it, it will be fine.

The macawsized one is giving me some trouble
(It's one of those "just add a set of stronger muscles to the equation" situations.)
and it is definitely an old model, the foodcups are rotating like one of our fabled windmills, but thats okay, as long as the perch is firm ...


once again: thank you all for thinking along!
Will keep you posted

 

[bill_e]

Christa,

I know you don't want to take it apart again but if I were doing it my stackup would be perch, washer, leather, POB Ring (grommet), leather, washer, wing nut with nail polish on the threads. If strength is an issue with the wingnut, substitute a regular nut for the wingnut and tighten with a wrench.

 

[Betrisher]

... and maybe add some loctite deep inside the threads!

 

[ChristaNL]

LOL, I wanted to add the second layer of leather on the outside of the grommet (oh, another word for the collection, thank you!) as well but the free screw-on part of the hanger bolt is not long enough.
(Too much material, so I had to gamble a bit.)


Unfortunately- being a bird-transporter- I have to be able to take it apart for cleaning regularly, so with nailpolish/glue etc. applied as well...would I still be able to disassemble/ asemble it again ?


(Oh yes... replacing a wingnut for a regular one is pure genious! I can do that easily. Thank you so much for thinking along)


*happy*

 

[Betrisher]

Yeah, don't put wingnuts! Rosetta and the Beaks are really, *really* good at undoing those, no matter how hard I tighten them. I ended up giving them some stainless steel bolts with stainless steel wingnuts on them for Christmas. Guess what? They're over them! They worked out what to do within five minutes and now the wingnuts and bolts are old-hat. (PS. Stainless steel is expensive).

 

[SammyAndyAlex]

Yeah, don't put wingnuts! Rosetta and the Beaks are really, *really* good at undoing those, no matter how hard I tighten them. I ended up giving them some stainless steel bolts with stainless steel wingnuts on them for Christmas. Guess what? They're over them! They worked out what to do within five minutes and now the wingnuts and bolts are old-hat. (PS. Stainless steel is expensive).

The wing nuts are on the outside, so the parrot cannot undo them (unless it is outside the carrier, which it wont be, because that would defeat the purpose of a carrier)

 

[bill_e]

Christa, the stackup I proposed will give you more bite than the way you did it and not use any more material. The nail polish will act like a lock washer to prevent the whole thing from loosening up. And yes, the nail polish will release easily when you apply force to loosen the nut. It is more important with wingnuts that normal nuts but I would use it with both. You can use Loctite but if you do you want to use only the blue one. I figure you have nail polish laying around and it will work well for this purpose.

Edit: If you're constantly assembling/disassembling I suppose you can try it without the nail polish because its purpose is really to prevent loosening over time. If you assemble, transport somewhere, then disassemble constantly it will be less useful so it can be omitted.

 

[ChristaNL]

***swapping leather ***

(and wingnut -> nut ; it's is official now: I am going nuts! )

I even debated on glueing the inner washer to the wood of the perch.
(That is why I put the first in-between piece leather there, one of my friends was convinced I needed more traction in that place. Getting the washer to grip the perch as well as the grommet.)