Help Training an Older Bird

[peachykeen]

I've had my conure Oscar for about a month now, so I think it's time to start getting serious about training. However, she's an older bird (at least 15), so I'm worried her habits will be a bit harder to break.

The only major issue she has is, as her owner said on her surrender papers, she's "afraid of hands". Meaning if you bring your hand/fingers near her, she'll either shy away or threaten to bite - though she's never broken my skin.

She's a bit more aggressive with strangers than she is with me, she will accept fruit and seeds from my fingers and will let my hand come a little closer than strangers', so she does at least trust me to some extent.

My goal is to work with her a little bit every day, but the only way I can try to get her to leave her cage is to open the top of it and hope she comes onto my shoulder. Sometimes I can coax her out with a sunflower seed, but usually she will plant herself firmly on her cage. I don't want to take her out forcefully (chase her around w/ my hand or a towel) if I can avoid it, so usually if she won't come onto my shoulder I'll leave her be. Unfortunately this policy means I can only take her out a couple times a week - I'm at work during the day so I can't attempt as often as I'd like.

If she does come onto my shoulder, I'll immediately leave the room with her cage, try to coax her onto my hand. This involves a lot of flapping and screeching and clinging to the neck of my shirt. Since her wings are overclipped, she'll fall straight to the ground if she drops, so I try to stay close to the ground/on a soft surface when I bring her onto my hand. If she does fall, she will come readily to my hand, and once she's on my hand she'll desperately try to climb to my shoulder. I stop this by putting my hand in the way and giving her a firm "No". I'll then take my hand away and repeat if she tries to climb up again.

If she does successfully step up between my fingers, I reward her with many "good girl"s. It is unfortunately difficult to get her to eat treats outside of her cage so they don't work well as rewards - if I give her a sunflower seed, for example, she'll just drop it.

Lastly, she seems to be more afraid of everything else than she is my hand - she's incredibly reluctant to step onto a countertop, for example, and if she does end up on one she'll stand still until I come to "rescue" her.

If you've made it through that wall of text, thank you! Hopefully you can give me some tips to helping her overcome her apprehension of the outside world.

 

[PrimorandMoxi]

I dont know, a month seems a tad to soon for a hand shy bird of fifteen...?

i think its more important that every interaction with you is fun and nonthreatening.
(sorry if i just paraphrased, someone else on this forum)

You have to trick her into thinking that no matter what the past situation was,
that she has now been lucky enough to get into paradise.
and its true.
she hit the jackpot with you.
it sounds like she is light years beyond what her past people bothered to do.

take it slow and win her over with praise and the feeling of security
(i don't use treats to get my birds to do what I want.)

I think that once she trusts you,
you can help her get over her apprehensions of most anything.
(and it sounds like you are already building that trust.)

have fun, sing, dance- its silly but it really works.

 

[LordTriggs]

well there's some things you won't be able to change that she's just got a thing about, if she doesn't like counter tops then that's okay

I advise training her to get on a perch first. If you use one from her cage and get her to step on it to come out and offer a treat each time (try starting in the cage if she's uncomfortable out of it) as she gets more comfortable in the cage doing it on the perch you can bring her out and work on it there, I wouldn't allow her on your shoulder at all until she's stepping up every time as IMO the shoulder is a reward to them. Once she's comfortable out of the cage you can slowly outstretch your finger and hold the perch so eventually over time she is on the perch and your finger, then you can start taking the perch away.

Just remember that she needs to set the pace, if she's not happy ever perching on a hand then that's up to her. You never really know what's happened over her life so she may have a valid reason to be hand-shy. If she wants to say perch on your arm instead then that's fine too, a lot of birds will prefer an arm to a hand

 

[peachykeen]

A thing I forgot to mention - now that I've gotten her accustomed to accepting treats from my hand, I will reach my hand into her cage with a treat and wait. She immediately will get away from my hand, but after a minute or two she will come back to my hand and eat the treat.

I have tried to offer her a perch instead of my hand, but she shies away from that as well. She seems to shy away from most things that approach her, except for my face - she is generally OK with me giving her kisses.

 

[LordTriggs]

okay then, as she will approch your hand for a treat you can try the method I used for taming my old Green cheek.

Essentially have a pile of food in your hand for them and hold it in such a way they have to get onto your hand to get at the delicious food. Try saying "up" or "step up" whatever you want as their step-up command. Each time they do it say your chosen word. As she finds out your hand means food she'll be a lot more ready to approach it. As soon as fear isn't shown towards your hand and they run over the second they see a treat then you can use the food to tempt them onto a perch. Like I say I prefer using a perch that's already in the cage for it as they're used to it. I wouldn't even approach them, just have the perch in your hand in the cage and wait, curiosity soon takes over. Especially if a treat is waiting for them on the perch

 

[clark_conure]

1) don't use a towel thats just cheating and the bird knows it

2) I'm happy you have the bird now and not the previous owner, a conure afraid of hands.....yeah he/she was doing something wrong. I'm absolutely positive you will bring this bird around into happiness.

 

[wrench13]

Work at the parrots pace, not yours. Isuggest you set aside a specific time EVERYDAY to work with her, find her absolute must have treat ( try little slices of pine nut ) and use that for training. Be consistent in your commands, be consistent in how you act. Be prepared to take 2 steps forward and 3 steps back, but always try moving forward. You hsve some real experts on here so heed advice carefully. Read, read read all the stickies at the top of each sub forum, theres gold in them thar hills.

Never towel her, unless its an emergency. when you have progressed to the point where you can actually play with her, try intoducing a small piece of towel , like 6" square, play tug o war, hide treats under it, peek a boo, that way she will not be totally freaked out if you do need to use a towel. Salty likes to be gently patted dry with a towel after a bath, he is so accustomed to them now. Take your time, she is not going anywhere hopefully, and neither are you. GOod Luck

 

[peachykeen]

okay then, as she will approch your hand for a treat you can try the method I used for taming my old Green cheek.

Essentially have a pile of food in your hand for them and hold it in such a way they have to get onto your hand to get at the delicious food. Try saying "up" or "step up" whatever you want as their step-up command. Each time they do it say your chosen word. As she finds out your hand means food she'll be a lot more ready to approach it. As soon as fear isn't shown towards your hand and they run over the second they see a treat then you can use the food to tempt them onto a perch. Like I say I prefer using a perch that's already in the cage for it as they're used to it. I wouldn't even approach them, just have the perch in your hand in the cage and wait, curiosity soon takes over. Especially if a treat is waiting for them on the perch

I have wanted to try this approach as it worked ages ago when I had budgies, but she still shies away from my hand even if I have a pile of sunflower seeds in it. I will keep trying though, if only because it is a technique I am familiar with. If only she went crazy for millet like other birds do, that would make this so much easier!

 

[peachykeen]

This weekend I tried to work with her by getting her to come on my hand w/ the promise of food but she refuses to come near my open hand at all, and will only accept food if it's held in my fingers. She also did not want to come on my shoulder at all even when lured with sunflower seeds.

I'll keep trying to do the "offer her food from within her cage" thing, but at this point I can't get her to come away from her cage to work with her. Should I grab her so I can work with her? I didn't want to resort to that sort of force but it seems like I have no other option.

 

[LordTriggs]

This weekend I tried to work with her by getting her to come on my hand w/ the promise of food but she refuses to come near my open hand at all, and will only accept food if it's held in my fingers. She also did not want to come on my shoulder at all even when lured with sunflower seeds.

I'll keep trying to do the "offer her food from within her cage" thing, but at this point I can't get her to come away from her cage to work with her. Should I grab her so I can work with her? I didn't want to resort to that sort of force but it seems like I have no other option.

in short no. Long version: helllllllllllllllll no. All that will do is make her more scared of hands and give her reason to be scared of them demolishing all of your work

It takes as long as it takes. Keep doing it. Remember she's fifteen and always been wary of hands. Could you imagine having a 15 year old who's been scared of snakes their entire life to suddenly cuddle a python? That's effectively what you're asking her to do. Some birds can take months even years to become comfortable. Others never become confident with hands and instead prefer to love from a distance

 

[peachykeen]

OK, you're right. I will keep doing what I'm doing and be patient, and work with her away from her cage whenever she will let me. Thanks for your advice!

 

[PrimorandMoxi]

Keep working at her pace.

NICE AND SLOW.

it may take six months or longer.
But you will be rewarded with an incredibly trusting relationship.
if you just work on the bond between you and her and not food bribery.
Hand taming is a difficult hump to get over.
and sometimes it seems like it will take forever, or that it will never happen, but it will.

Primor came to us hand shy, & never out of cage at eight years old.
He was terrified of hands.
I put nice castors on his cage and we would wheel him from living room, to kitchen, to out on the deck.
wherever we went so did he, those first months.
We just wanted him to get used to us, without forcing our hands on him.

Nowadays he is absolutely bonded to both of us.

 

[peachykeen]

Wanted to post a little update:

I think the "bring her food inside her cage and wait for her to come to it" is helping a little bit, she no longer immediately shies away from my hand if I reach it into her cage.

However, I come to suspect that it's not hands that are the issue - she's just a plain ol' scaredy bird. If I try to bring anything towards her - I tried sticks, bits of paper, small towels - she scuttles away.

Obviously building trust with her is paramount, and that is more a factor of time than anything else, but any suggestions on easing her fears of her general surroundings?

 

[PrimorandMoxi]

you just have to desensitize bird to everything over time.

Even as tame as my birds are, if I come at them with anything, too fast or unfamiliar, they will still get startled.

instinct tells them to be cautious of everything.