England's oldest macaw

[Alwese]

When I am out in public with my birds, people are often stunned to hear that Kayko my B&G is 32 years old. I often tell them if they want to see a truly old macaw to put the words "Winston Churchill's Parrot" into Google and select the YouTube video that comes up. When this video was created, Charlie was 107 years old. If I am counting correctly Charlie should now be 116 years old, but I have not heard anything as to if he has passed. Has anyone heard more about him???

 

[JerseyWendy]

I just did some googling and found this about Charlie:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_(parrot)

'Hello': Having a chat with Churchill's parrot and - at 114-years-old - one of Reigate's oldest residents | Surrey Mirror

 

[Kiwibird]

I just did some googling and found this about Charlie:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_(parrot)

'Hello': Having a chat with Churchill's parrot and - at 114-years-old - one of Reigate's oldest residents | Surrey Mirror

Someday we'll be hearing about Niko and Ripley the centurions:54:

These birds have insanely long lifespans!

 

[Scott]

That's a great story! I can imagine Churchill enjoying teaching Charlie to spout anti-Nazi epithets!! Probably was a pleasant diversion from the endless pressures of wartime leadership.

 

[RavensGryf]

Amazing... Also they didn't have very good care back then compared to today's standards, so makes me think a lot of the longevity is also in the genes of the individual.

 

[Bartleby]

Did you guys even read the Wikipedia link?

There is zero evidence the bird ever belonged to Churchill and a ton of evidence that the bird didn't. There is also no proof the bird is as old as claimed, Mr. Oram can't provide a single shred of evidence to support any of his claims. There was an old article in a bird magazine that raised doubts that the current incarnation of "Charlie" is even the same bird that was first presented to the public all those years ago. It's a clever marketing gimmick to get tourist dollars and attention.

Parrot longevity is such a mystery and we are just now approaching a widespread standard of care that may facilitate the eventual glimpse of these species' possible lifespans. It bothers me when people make false claims that then lead well meaning owners to expect such and such lifespan or beat themselves up when their well cared for parrot doesn't attain a certain longevity.

 

[Terry57]

What an amazing story!
I did not read the Wiki link, I don't really have much faith in Wikipedia.

 

[Bartleby]

I don't really have much faith in Wikipedia.

Regardless of the veracity of Wikipedia (which I wholeheartedly agree is dubious at best and should always be followed up with real sources) a simple Google search of "Churchill's parrot" will come up with 3/4s of the results containing the words "hoax", "myth" or "bunk".

The only sources who support Mr. Oram's claims are individuals who have a vested interest in them...like people employed by the park where Charlie lives or people in the city where Charlie is a tourist attraction. Churchill scholars, the Churchill Society, societies that oversee Churchill memorials and grounds and even Churchill's own daughter have all stated he never had a macaw. They've poured through all the known records and photographs and found not one indication of the existence of a macaw.

Churchill was quite the animal lover, having a huge variety of pets throughout his life. There's photographic evidence, writings, statements from employees, recollections of his contemporaries, etc. of a large number of them. Why can no evidence be found of a pet that he supposedly treasured and kept for more than 3 decades? His daughter does recall an African Grey, but that was before his days as Prime Minister.

 

[willist]

I once saw an old B&W photo of Chruchill with a cockatoo and a macaw. I don't remember where I saw it.

 

[Birdman666]

I had heard that Churchill had two birds - a DYH and a B&G... but that the bird that was always with him that swore at Hitler was "Toby," the DYH not Charlie, the B&G.

That's what I had heard anyway... there is a book out written by one of his relatives that talks about his animals, including his birds. He had a fair number of exotic animals... including an exotic parrot aviary with not just one, but several macaws. (Charlie being his favorite.) It mentions Charlie by name, and says he appeared to be "the favorite bird," and that Churchill was Charlie's third owner - so they were re-homed a lot even then... and apparently Churchill had toos as well.

Here's a photo with Churchill and several of "his" parrots. According to the caption the bird on his shoulder is "Charlie." So, we don't know if THIS bird IS Charlie, but we do know that Churchill did have a Charlie... (and that he was a shoulder bird!)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/pic...s-family-archives-for-sale.html?frame=3136945

 

[Alwese]

Well THANK YOU Kiwibird for the links so I could read the updates. Despite all the controversy it at least sounds like "Charlie" is still alive. The oldest macaw I have seen is David Clayton's Greenwing here in Jacksonville. His father brought the bird home just after WWII in 1946. That bird is at least 69 years old and may be as old as 80 as it was wild caught. There was a girl on one of the bird boards that has a Scarlet hen that is positively 86 years old and still lays 4 fertile eggs a year. Most of the people I know have macaws in the 20-28 year range, as a great many were imported into Florida in the 70's. In 1988 the CITES treaty was established (Conservation In Trade of Exotic Species) severely limiting the importation of many birds.

 

[Birdman666]

The St. Louis zoo had a Scarlet that was the oldest parrot ever documented in America. It hatched in the zoo, so they had the hatch date. It lived to be 127!!!

So it's possible.

The San Diego zoo just lost a 98 year old M2.

 

[Alwese]

The San Diego zoo just lost a 98 year old M2.

Wow! I didn't know 'Toos lived that long. It seems like the bigger the bird, the longer they live. Good to know about the macaw record... I'll use that in my outing talks

 

[jns1201]

Great to know scarlet or macaw and live for so long

 

[Birdman666]

According to what I read, Charlie hatched around 1889... and Churchill took possession of it in the late 1920's (1927?) and was that bird's third owner, so that would make THIS bird around 126 years old today...

Which I find just slightly implausible. I doubt that's Churchill's Charlie... but it appears he did have one.

And yet, other relatives deny he kept parrots.

According to this he had cats, dogs, horses, a lion, a Kangaroo, fish, and was particularly fond of his exotic pig collection... one of whom was 70 years old (and there is a framed photo of a handwritten birthday note signed by W that is one of the objects up for auction from his daughter's memorabilia) and a budgie named Toby... (not a DYH.) BUT NO PARROTS except an African Gray that he had when he was much younger.

So who knows?!

 

[Bartleby]

According to what I read, Charlie hatched around 1889... and Churchill took possession of it in the late 1920's (1927?) and was that bird's third owner, so that would make THIS bird around 226 years old today...

Which I find just slightly implausible. I doubt that's Churchill's Charlie... but it appears he did have one.

And yet, other relatives deny he kept parrots.

According to this he had cats, dogs, horses, a lion, a Kangaroo, fish, and was particularly fond of his exotic pig collection... one of whom was 70 years old (and there is a framed photo of a handwritten birthday note signed by W that is one of the objects up for auction from his daughter's memorabilia) and a budgie named Toby... (not a DYH.) BUT NO PARROTS except an African Gray that he had when he was much younger.

Probably should recheck your math.

Also, you are spot on, he had NO parrots except a budgie and that African Grey that was supposedly only around for a very short time. It was vicious apparently. Lots of people claiming he had parrots, but there is no evidence from ANY credible sources. Like a picture, family remembrances, contemporary statements, letters, nothing, nada, zilch. The picture with the macaw and cockatoo was actually some sort of promotional thing, not his personal pets. It's the same picture over and over again too, just sometimes a different background.

 

[Birdman666]

According to what I read, Charlie hatched around 1889... and Churchill took possession of it in the late 1920's (1927?) and was that bird's third owner, so that would make THIS bird around 226 years old today...

Which I find just slightly implausible. I doubt that's Churchill's Charlie... but it appears he did have one.

And yet, other relatives deny he kept parrots.

According to this he had cats, dogs, horses, a lion, a Kangaroo, fish, and was particularly fond of his exotic pig collection... one of whom was 70 years old (and there is a framed photo of a handwritten birthday note signed by W that is one of the objects up for auction from his daughter's memorabilia) and a budgie named Toby... (not a DYH.) BUT NO PARROTS except an African Gray that he had when he was much younger.

Probably should recheck your math.

Also, you are spot on, he had NO parrots except a budgie and that African Grey that was supposedly only around for a very short time. It was vicious apparently. Lots of people claiming he had parrots, but there is no evidence from ANY credible sources. Like a picture, family remembrances, contemporary statements, letters, nothing, nada, zilch. The picture with the macaw and cockatoo was actually some sort of promotional thing, not his personal pets. It's the same picture over and over again too, just sometimes a different background.

Sorry. Typo 126...

Looks like this one is a myth...

Which leaves us with TR's Hyacinth as the only CONFIRMED big mac owned by a world leader...

 

[Birdman666]

Found this when I was looking for more on Churchill's bird(s)...

Famous people with parrots:

Classics By The Sea: Famous People With Parrots

 

[Abigal7]

I do not know if Winston Churchill had a parrot or not (he seems to be a animal person though). I do not want to get into details but some people recently even have tried to twist the views onto Winston Churchill. That said I am surprised Andrew Jackson and Dolly Madison did not make the famouse people with parrots. I am trying to find out if Dolly Madison's parrot outlived her. Supposedly Andrew Jacksons bird outlived him and had to be escorted from the funeral when it screamed obscenities (I do not know if that is true or not though).

 

[Abigal7]

Amazing... Also they didn't have very good care back then compared to today's standards, so makes me think a lot of the longevity is also in the genes of the individual.

I know people use to feed just seeds and I know song birds were in cages now considered way to small. But what little stuff I have seen on the net It seems parrots were sometimes on stands. Whether they were chained to the stand or not that I do not know.