Coco the YNA bit me?

[cocotheyna]

Hi all, I've been a non-member lurker for a while now. I'm from Singapore. My boyfriend's family adopted a YNA that they named Coco about 10 ish years ago. Aside from their housekeeper who changes the cage liners and food/water, Coco doesn't get much interaction from anyone else in the family. He's not aggressive, except for when he's around my boyfriend, who threw a stressball at him when he was a child (he deeply regrets it now and is trying to get Coco to get used to him). Whenever Coco even sees my boyfriend he gets aggressive (crawls around the cage bars to get closer, eyes pinning, lunges at him from the cage and 'hisses'). I'm not sure if the hissing is normal or if its a sign of a respiratory issue.

I've made a few changes to Coco's routine for the past month. I've changed his diet from a generic seed mix from the market to pellets mixed with a few of his seeds to get him used to the pellets, and I try to mist him down every time I come over to his place. I'm also adding some toys and a perch to his cage. I've tried looking at larger cages, but his mother disapproves of it because of the amount of space that it takes up at the house. Coco seems to like me and lets me pet him and open his cage to do so.

However, a few days ago my boyfriend and I spent about 30 minutes interacting with Coco. Coco wasn't receptive to my boyfriend (the usual behaviour above) but was fine with me petting him from the cage, until I opened the cage to try to pet him. He kind of shifted back a little, and then lifted one leg up. I took this to mean that he wanted to step up, and put my finger there for him to step up on. Instantly, he bit me. I yelped and reflexively pulled my fingers out, which somehow got him out of the cage too. This was his first time out of the cage since he got to my boyfriend's family's house, and he began flapping around and latched onto my hip. Luckily, I led him back to the cage and then yelped "OW!" at him before leaving (someone on the forum said it might help discourage biting). When I came back to the cage again, Coco instantly came to the bars of the cage and let me pet him again.

I'm confused about the biting because there wasn't any eye pinning, ruffled feathers etc. In addition, what I can do to train Coco to step up (maybe with a stick, but I've tried it before and he seems uninterested)? And is there any other way for my boyfriend to get Coco to like him?

 

[noodles123]

He sounds like he really likes you and you are doing things right! Thank goodness-- he does need to come out and he does probably need a larger cage and toys etc. Think of a 3-year-old. It was very wise of you to switch to a healthier diet, increase cage size and add toys + human interaction (slowly, being the key).

Your boyfriend has to re-build trust, but you are likely dealing with a very cage-bound bird, so the fact that you got as far as you did is impressive. They remember things and they tend to associate people with feelings (like stress). They also see a wide spectrum of colors, so while your boyfriend may think he is playing it cool, if he is nervous, the bird is going to be able to see that just from his skin tone in many cases.

He could have bitten because he doesn't know how hard he is biting (never been handled) or it could be fear (not of you,necessarily, but of hands or of someone reaching into his space). Research cage-bound birds.
It's like PTSD and Stockholm syndrome mixed together and it happens when they aren't let out frequently and socialized...they still NEED that interaction, but when they don't get it, they make their own little world in their cage (and it has to be taken slowly).

Reacting to bites can backfire depending on the reason for the bite. In this case, I am not sure what the reason was. If he bit because of fear and you reacted and let go, that probably wasn't the best move (but he put his foot up, so I can see why you followed that lead-- you are supposed to let them lead and that seems to be your plan, which is great).

If he bit because he didn't know how hard he was biting, that is totally different, and a reaction is then appropriate, but you have to be sure you know or you could accidentally end up reinforcing the biting through your reaction.

Either way, I would slow down a bit and keep building trust. You want to stress him out as little as possible and associate yourself with positive things.

Remember- "positive" to you could be scary to him, so while he absolutely needs toys etc, he will have to be taught to play with them and they should be introduced very slowly. First, just place them in the room (like 10 ft from the cage for a few days). Then move a bit closer, etc etc..If he likes you and trusts you and you show interest in the toys, he may also eventually, but you don't want to just plop them in there, because as fun as they can be, he likely has no idea what they are.

I maintain that, in all likelihood, you are dealing with a traumatized and cage-bound bird who will eventually come out, but only with patience and knowledge of parrot behavior etc. It isn't his fault he was locked up so long and it is hard to get them past that, but if you stick with it and move at his pace, it can be done and has been done. You just have to build trust, take it slow and research behavior.

Imagine Tom Hanks on Castaway (if you have seen it..the one where he makes friends with a volleyball with a hand-print on it). He was alone for so long that he got a little crazy, and while he wanted to leave, when that finally happened, he was a bit freaked out.

Again, I want to emphasize that you are doing an excellent job and thank you for caring!!!

 

[cocotheyna]

Thanks Noodles. I'm going over to my boyfriend's place today so I'll probably give an update if there's any. I've been encouraging my boyfriend to read to Coco and feed him treats (he likes apples and has taken to chili peppers pretty well). Would that work?

 

[noodles123]

absolutely, given time-- as long as he doesn't shove them in his face or something silly lol! Reading is also a great idea.

 

[wrench13]

Noodles knocks it out of the park!! This is a (tragically) cage bound parrot. The advice offered is very good. You and the BF should read the 2 stickies at the top of the Amazon subforum, Amazon Body language and I Love Amazons, written by our resident Amazon shaman. In fact read them several times, out loud in a soft voice , to Coco. It will really help all of you.

 

[cocotheyna]

Hi all, an update about Coco today. My sister and I went over to my boyfriend's place and spent a good part of the afternoon interacting with him and playing with him. Coco seemed a little moody at first (possibly because the last time I saw him we didn't really end things off on a good note) but after a while he warmed up to us.

We tried misting him down but his feathers were totally closed off so we decided not to push any further with him, given his behaviour when he first saw us (avoiding us, turning his back to us). We placed a few toys in his cage and he didn't seem to be afraid of them, just slightly disinterested save for a biting toy. He's also taken a liking to the cuttlebone we placed inside his cage a month ago and it's been chewed up between last week and today. I guess it's good progress because when we first put it in he ignored it completely.

I also tried target training with Coco and he took to it really quickly. He learned so quickly that I didn't need to hold the treat (small pieces of peanuts) in front of him for him to get to the stick. I worry that he bites the stick too hard and it encourages biting. How do I get him to gently touch the stick instead of biting down on it?

 

[cocotheyna]

Remember- "positive" to you could be scary to him, so while he absolutely needs toys etc, he will have to be taught to play with them and they should be introduced very slowly. First, just place them in the room (like 10 ft from the cage for a few days). Then move a bit closer, etc etc..If he likes you and trusts you and you show interest in the toys, he may also eventually, but you don't want to just plop them in there, because as fun as they can be, he likely has no idea what they are.

Hi Noodles, I just noticed this part here. How do I teach Coco to play with a toy? I've read that you can use parrot psychology and use your hands to play with them. Will that work?

 

[noodles123]

Show interest in it yourself from far away- act like it's really every so often. You still want to move it closer over time, but act super excited about it . Once she is comfortable with it, if she gets near it, praise or reward, if she touches it praise or reward (what ever motivates her) and use the word "toy" (" playing with your toy", "thats a toy" etc etc). Then if you have a new one that is different, you would do the same thing as well (gradually introduce, model the behavior, reward any approximations of playing etc).

 

[fiddlejen]

If he bit because he didn't know how hard he was biting, that is totally different, and a reaction is then appropriate, but you have to be sure you know or you could accidentally end up reinforcing the biting through your reaction.

You mention that BF was there, so that Could've been the cause - But - it's also VEry possible he was just testing his perch (your hand) before stepping-up.

I know you're currnetly wotking on the fear & aggression, esp if that's what caused this incident. There are threads on bite pressure training as well, which you may want to work on also. (Maybe not yet.) Especially where he's had limited physical interactions - so that At Least he doesnt have the frustration of human being upset (because bitten) when He didN't Intend to bite.