Casey acting increasingly hostile towards fiance

[caseysthecrazhchicken]

My fiance has raised Casey our Quaker for 7 years. she is now 8 years old. for the past year since I've come into their lives, Casey has begun to prefer me but was still okay with my fiance holding her or going near her, or even playing with her when I wasn't in sight. For the past 3 months however, she's become extremely hostile towards him and demands attention from me 24/7 and screams when I don't (I don't reinforce screaming, I ignore her when she does and will give attention when she chirps or stops screaming instead). she will lunge towards and attempt to bite my fiance even if he just stands up and screams anytime she hears him speak, even when she's inside her cage or nowhere near him, and wont let him anywhere near even if I'm not in the room.
she's also been trying to "mate" with me when I give her cuddles or scritches so I wonder if maybe she's just hormonal and that explains the change in behavior?
we're at our wits end is there anything I'm missing or something we can do?

 

[wrench13]

I would do the usual things to try an minimize hormonal behavior : scratch only the head and neck, no cuddles, low sugar diet, 12hrs sleep time, no nesting materials , no dark hidey hole or corners. And try to get her away from the cage when she's out - quakers are notoriously cage agressive. SHe may see your SO as competition for you. Move her cage into another room, and set up a play stand for when she is out of the cage.

 

[OzBlue]

definitely sounds hormonal, we're going through a change of season now too. Ours has just gotten hormonal. Normally around noon on the clock. She'll fly to me and do the mating behaviour stuff, when she does i sit her down somewhere else away from me. In addition to what Wrench mentioned, maybe also ensure she's getting plenty of fresh veg, no chewy toys, minimize fruits (sugar), i'd avoid any cuddles at this point, even head scratches until you're out of your change of season. With our quaker, head scratches will often lead to her showing mating behaviour.

Getting your SO to do clicker training with her or trick training without you in the room would also be a good idea to try and help bonding, but thats just an idea. Sounds like your quaker has picked you as her mate, its just a matter of removing any stimulations that reinforce her perception of that. Lots of articles on how to deter mating behaviour, they may have steps that seem hard to comply with (changing out chew/shread toys, stop the cuddles) ultimately they work. In addition to plenty of sleep plenty of fly time is also a good way to burn off energy for them. I've been trying to move her away from me when she comes seeking attention during this time, encouraging her to play away from me (but near me) instead of on me. No shoulder rides, no hanging out on my arms, lots of target training to keep her distracted. She's actually learned how to wave since we started to head into winter haha. So try to turn this into a positive!

 

[caseysthecrazhchicken]

so we got her a new play perch (she's still gotta get used to it) but now we have a new issue:
if I set her down away from me she'll scream and fly to me, and she's TERRIFIED of flying so she screams a lot. how do I get her to stop flying whenever or at the least stop screaming while she does it. also any tips on helping her adjust to the new perch? she's pretty scared of it.

 

[noodles123]

Hello and welcome. Please don't hate me for the following advice, but I think it is really important to consider (even though your past experiences may seem to contradict the statements that follow):

NO CUDDLES for any parrot (from ANYONE). If they give them willingly, it is highly sexual and leads to behaviors down the road. Do not ever pet a bird anywhere other than the head and neck (even if they like it and even if they want it). It is making a promise you can't keep, and it contributes to major problems and re-homing of birds on a world-wide scale. If you want cuddles, consider a different pet, please. If you cuddle a baby, you set a standard that is extremely detrimental once they hit puberty, so you need to be consistent and set behavioral expectations from a young age (even before they start getting hormonal).

Also-- not huts, shadowy spaces, tents etc...these areas simulate nesting environments and they may not create issues in a baby, but they will in a sexually mature bird...and since birds hate change, it is best not to start something you cannot sustain.

I also think you need to look into parrot behavior/ABA training to deal with this- I have another post on that that I can paste in.

In terms of the new perch- stop pushing it. Keep it positive and model yourselves interacting with it while it is a safe distance from her. If she shows ANY interest, reward with whatever the strongest motivator may be (in your case, that could be YOUR attention--but again, non-sexual). You need to re-frame your relationship. It won't hurt to add treats in, but you are a powerful source if reward right now.

 

[caseysthecrazhchicken]

Hello and welcome. Please don't hate me for the following advice, but I think it is really important to consider (even though your past experiences may seem to contradict the statements that follow):

NO CUDDLES for any parrot (from ANYONE). If they give them willingly, it is highly sexual and leads to behaviors down the road. Do not ever pet a bird anywhere other than the head and neck (even if they like it and even if they want it). It is making a promise you can't keep, and it contributes to major problems and re-homing of birds on a world-wide scale. If you want cuddles, consider a different pet, please. If you cuddle a baby, you set a standard that is extremely detrimental once they hit puberty, so you need to be consistent and set behavioral expectations from a young age (even before they start getting hormonal).

Also-- not huts, shadowy spaces, tents etc...these areas simulate nesting environments and they may not create issues in a baby, but they will in a sexually mature bird...and since birds hate change, it is best not to start something you cannot sustain.

I also think you need to look into parrot behavior/ABA training to deal with this- I have another post on that that I can paste in.

In terms of the new perch- stop pushing it. Keep it positive and model yourselves interacting with it while it is a safe distance from her. If she shows ANY interest, reward with whatever the strongest motivator may be (in your case, that could be YOUR attention--but again, non-sexual). You need to re-frame your relationship. It won't hurt to add treats in, but you are a powerful source if reward right now.

that is so helpful. she doesn't have huts or anything like that, and I only pet above the neck but even that seems to get her going so Ive stopped.
and by cuddles I mean more like she sits on my shoulder or knee and I pet her but I'm wondering if that also contributes so I should stop?
I'm very very new to all this and this behavior is new to my SO as well
thank you

 

[noodles123]

When mine is in a hormonal bender, chests, laps and under my chin/under hair = also out (dark spaces and huts/snuggles are out all year-round and the rest (laps etc)are kept to a minimum)...I think we are re-entering that season as I type this, because sometimes, the last couple of days, mine just looks out the window for a long time and when I pet her on the head, she tries to lean into my torso and will do this VERY subtle eye twitch,--you definitely do not want to reinforce the behavior though....so probably just changing the subject and not allowing the bird to get triggered= best...while researching behavior and not reinforcing undesireable reactions--- try to make things positive..

I still need to get you that ABA post. It doesn't apply to your situation exactly, but it breaks it down in a way that might allow you to apply it to your household....again, it works for all people and animals, but the intervention will vary based on the function (underlying reason) for the behavior.

 

[noodles123]

Here is my copy-and-paste ABA speech ---it isn't going to apply to you EXACTLY, because your bird's motivations are impossible to know for sure without charting , but the principles are the same for any animal (humans included):
My main point in posting this is for the details on ABA- I am NOT saying your situation is the same at all, but it give you an idea of how ABA works.


"First--- mitigate hormonal influences and get rid of triggers--In the short-term, things that impact behavior outside of you or the bird are sometimes called "setting events" :
1. remove all snuggle huts, tents, caves and hammocks from his cage and don't let him hang out in bedding, under cloths, in boxes etc.
2. Pet on the head and neck only.
3. 10 hours of sleep on a schedule each night.
4. Make sure he is getting plenty of activity and enrichment/ things to do

***This is normal---all birds go threw a rough patch at puberty BUT with appropriate responses, you can adjust to these changes****

From there, I would recommend Applied Behavior Analysis (ABA). Start by making what they call an ABC chart (antecedent= what happens right before the bird's behavior, behavior=what the bird does, c= consequence =what happens right after the behavior (good or bad---consequence is just the RESULT and it doesn't mean consequence in the same way that we sometimes think of a consequence).

In the scenario you gave above:

Antecedent= Son laughed while you were playing with him and bird was on you.
behavior= bird flew off and bit son on lip.....You didn't say what happened next, but that would be the consequence.
consequence= WHATEVER YOU AND YOUR SON DID=== did he cry? Did you yell? Did your son leave the room? Did you put the bird back on the cage? Did you stop playing Monopoly? All of these things are really important because all behaviors serves a purpose. People and animals only do things because we are rewarded in some conscious or subconscious way by the results of the behavior. This is called the "function" of a behavior (the reason we do it). A behavior can have more than one function, but all behaviors fall into 1 of 4 categories:

1. Escape (to get out of a location, get away from a person, avoid a task/activity etc)
2. Attention (to get attention from humans or animals which may include eye contact, yelling, laughter, increased proximity, scolding etc)
3.Tangibles- to obtain a physical item---e.g., a kid throwing a fit to get candy at the grocery store or hitting another kid to take their toy. Heck---working for a paycheck also falls into this realm.
4. Sensory= eating when hungry (to stop the hunger), taking a pill for a headache, scratching your skin because it itches, crying as a response to legitimate pain.

I would say that this behavior, while rooted in a sudden change in hormones/ drive, can be shaped if you start to understand how everyone's reactions are likely feeding into it.

By charting ABC's of a behavior, you start to see a pattern. When you look at the "c" column (consequences) you will find a general pattern. Without knowing more about this pattern of behavior and consequences (e.g., charting it) I cannot say with certainty what the function/reason is, but just based on what you said and based on my experiences, I am going to guess that after you do the charting, you will probably notice that the majority of the "consequences" will be linked to the theme/"function" of attention ---but when you look at the chart, you will want to ask yourself, is this consequence creating an opportunity for attention, escape, tangibles or sensory. You may have a combination, but you are looking for the once you see most frequently across the board in relation to this behavior.

This is how you determine the function (reason for doing) a behavior. When you know the function, you can then manipulate the behavior by A) NOT gratifying/rewarding the behavior with consequences that serve the function and B) providing more appropriate ways for the function of that behavior to be met without doing it in an inappropriate way. These are socially acceptable alternatives to the undesirable location--- they allow the same function to be met/gratified, but in a more appropriate way.

From the sounds of it, your bird is likely motivated by 1. primarily attention from you and 2. Escape/avoidance of your son (because he is an attention-blocker/associated with lack of attention from you).--I AM JUST GUESSING--- IF I AM WRONG ABOUT ATTENTION BEING THE FUNCTION THEN YOU WILL NEED TO DO A DIFFERENT INTERVENTION---

I can't say for sure without knowing how you react when this stuff happens, but if he is like most 7 year-olds, here's what I imagine:

Playing game with you (attention is on game and kid) , Kid laughs, bird bites.
Kid screams, you stop paying attention to the game , you yell/scold/react while looking at bird-- if this happens, so far, the bird has learned that biting gets attention from you and your kid (if what happens is anything like what I just described)--if your kid leaves, then your bird no longer sees you giving him that attention and all is right in the world again (the "threat" has been removed). He wants your attention because he is a flock creature, but also because he is reaching sexual maturity and likely views you as a mate and in the wild, conures do not share mates. Your kid is a potential threat as long as you are a sexual object. This doesn't mean withdrawing all attention from your bird, but it does mean that you will have to be EXTRA mindful about how you interact with him in order to set the bird up for success (before the behavior occurs and in situations where the behavior is likely to occur).

In an attention seeking behavior, the bigger your reaction, the more you are rewarding the bird. In this case, 2 people reacting with urgency could be quite gratifying!
Assuming the bird really wants attention from you, instead of making a big thing of it, my suggestion would be to firmly say No (NOT loudly, one time) and use something like a time-out cage to isolate the bird immediately following the bite. If you are the object of the bird's attention seeking then you need to accomplish this as quickly as possible with as little eye-contact/reaction as possible. This will only work if you are absolutely certain that your bird is biting for attention--- by doing a short time-out away from you and your son, his attention seeking behavior cannot be reinforced.

At the same time, after a short time-out, you need to show him positive ways that he can get attention from you while your son is around WITHOUT biting. This is that socially acceptable equivalent I discussed earlier-- if he bites for attention, maybe you teach him to ring a bell for attention, say a word word for attention, take a treat for attention etc. Something that gets him the same type of reward without upsetting the household.

Because this involves a kid, it IS more complicated though because it's going to be really hard for your son to control his reactions. If he cannot control his reactions, then you need to consider avoiding situations in which things like this can occur, because if you are trying to stick with the "ignoring" program, but he keeps reacting, then you will likely make the behavior even worse...so it's important to be as consistent as possible once you start an intervention.

I would definitely try to pair your son with positives for the bird. It is likely that you pay attention to your child more than the bird when he is around, and that is no fun for the bird. Try to make a consious effort of giving your bird MORE attention (for positives) when your son is around and pair him with as many positives as possible. In an attention seeker, attention will always be the most important reward, but you can tack on other incentives too (like a favorite treat whenever he is with you and your son). The thing is, the treat MUST be secondary to the main reward (attention ). While it can help strengthen positive associations, an attention-seeker's behavior is never going to be impacted by food alone (unless getting that food is accompanied by the attention it desires)."

 

[noodles123]

Here are a few human ABA sites, but this is great with other animals too- ESPECIALLY parrots.. it's just the way we all (as humans/animals).
I have used it on every animal I have met and it works amazingly as long as you understand the motivation behind a behavior. My cockatoo has come SO far as a result of this mindset and I have used it since I adopted her years ago (she was an adult re-home)...It doesn't always fix a problem right away- but sometimes, in simple cases, it can work like magic.

Even a neuro-typical or gifted adult human will still follow these same behavioral patterns, so I want to emphasize that it isn't about training people as though they were animals..it's about training animals as though they were people...and YES, WE ALL WERE TRAINED. Why do you eat with a fork, pee in a toilet, say excuse me when you burp, wear pants? BECAUSE IT WAS REINFORCED and the benefits of doing these behaviors outweigh the consequences of not doing them. I say all of this because I feel like sometimes people get offended when they first read about ABA, but it's just a way of looking at the world .. People who don't like ABA still run around reinforcing behaviors (good and bad ones) but it's the mindset that is lacking, so they are kind of flying blind.

A lot of the literature tends to focus on kids with autism, but it impacts ALL of us, every single day A light turns green when you are driving, so you go... A police officer flashes his lights behind your car so you either pull over (or run if you are guilty lol) , but either way it's to avoid getting into trouble (escape) lol! Now, not ALL behaviors will fit perfectly into a single function of attention, escape, sensory or tangibles but there is almost always a primary (even in dual function behaviors).

https://www.autismspeaks.org/applied-behavior-analysis-aba-0

Here is another "reader's digest" explanation : https://www.abadegreeprograms.net/faq/what-is-applied-behavior-analysis-in-simple-terms/
This goes into greater detail-- http://theautismhelper.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/ABA-101-Handouts-The-Autism-Helper.pdf <--honestly, this one is the best, but it could be overwhelming...
When you understand ABA it teaches socially acceptable behavior (to a "flock" animal) and it rewards in a personalized way-- that is all anyone really wants! It may sound a little shallow and dehumanizing at first, but truly ask yourself why you do what you do, and even if it SEEMS selfless, I bet you are getting something out of it...it's human nature.

NO ONE does anything for no reason---people give to charity because they want to see a change or like the way it makes them feel..or because of the admiration it brings..people work for a check....kids have fits because they find out it works to get them what they want....or sometimes, because they are overwhelmed (sensory), It's all the same.. I want to emphasize that it is used with ALL PEOPLE and intelligent animals (regardless of academic or mental functioning)--not just kids with special needs...

 

[caseysthecrazhchicken]

so I've been following the above advice, and she's made so much improvement. she's not as violent and she seems happier. however today when I tried to get her out of her cage and onto her perch she got territorial and tried to bite me, then later when she was on her perch she laid an egg. she only laid one but she doesn't seem interested or seems to know that's it their or what it is. what should I do with the egg? should I leave her in her cage? this is the first time she's ever laid an egg

 

[OzBlue]

Quakers are definitely known to be cage aggressive so perhaps use a training perch to get her out, or simply leave the cage door open and let her come out when she wants to.

As far as the egg laying is concerned, this article seemed to have some advice, but i personally have no experience dealing with this.

http://www.animalhouseofchicago.com...hicago/articles/unwanted-egg-laying-pet-birds

 

[noodles123]

so I've been following the above advice, and she's made so much improvement. she's not as violent and she seems happier. however today when I tried to get her out of her cage and onto her perch she got territorial and tried to bite me, then later when she was on her perch she laid an egg. she only laid one but she doesn't seem interested or seems to know that's it their or what it is. what should I do with the egg? should I leave her in her cage? this is the first time she's ever laid an egg

If she has no interest for a few days, I would remove it. Sorry this is so late!!