Capes are difficult,stubborn and almost untrainable?

[rockyhermes]

Hi there,
I just read a very long and elaborate article from a parrot expert and cape owner that says that capes are very difficult birds,nothing for inexperienced owners. I always thought theyre supposed to be so easy going and gentle?
He also states that theyre very stubborn and almost untrainable. I had never heard any of these facts before. He also said that hourlong screaming sessions are normal. I'm very confused now as for what or who to believe. Can you cape owners out there please share your experiences with me please?
Things like temperament,noise,follow simple commands?
Thanks so much!

 

[MonicaMc]

Yes, it's true, capes are practically untrainable! Just look at the videos of Truman!


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtwVKnEZ9rQ]Well Behaved Parrots (Step up, Potty Trained, No Biting, Recall, Petting) - YouTube[/ame]



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_akBwWIQGQQ]Parrots Play Flighted Fetch - YouTube[/ame]



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvLU1wiOtDk]Flying Parrots in a Theater - Advanced Indoor Flight Training Day 4 - YouTube[/ame]



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0F8Ns0Pw1uw]How to Train Parrot the Bat Trick - Hang Upside Down - YouTube[/ame]




(if you didn't notice, what I said was sarcasm! )

 

[khaiqha]

Michael, Truman's owner, is most likely the author of the article the OP was referring to. He recently released an article advising against Capes for inexperienced owners.

 

[Shade]

I was quoted in that article. Is my Cape stubborn? Yes, but Poicephalus parrot normally are. While I don't trick train them like Michael does, I can get her to recall to me and she knows the step up command as well.

She's currently going through the "terrible twos" phase and it means she's testing her boundaries. She's very smart about how she does it and she does clearly show that she knows what she can and can't do...the fact is, when you read about most parrots, they will go through such a phase.

I would not say hourlong screaming sessions are normal. I've seen videos where Truman is just screaming and screaming but I have not experienced that with Léa. The worse she's ever been was when I just brought her home and she wanted to us to be with her all the time so she would call back. However, she quickly learned that we would eventually go back, when it was her time to come out, and what was normal in this house and she stopped. I have talked with many other Cape parrots who have never have this issue.

So it depends what you want out of your pet. If you want one to train in she same fashion as Michael, then maybe Capes aren't the best fit. But if you want one as a companion without putting it through such a set training regime, which I think is the case for most people, then maybe it'll be alright. Just bear in mind that, like ANY parrot, it won't always be easy going. They have personalities. As I mentioned, I recently went through a rougher patch with my Cape where she was challenging but over the last week she's slowly reverted back to her old self. And during this whole time, while she might have nipped a little harder, she never broke skin. And given how strong her beak is, she really didn't do as much damage as she can.

 

[MonicaMc]

Is Michael really an expert? Or does he just know a lot about trick training and the experience he has with his two pois?

Many medium and large parrots really aren't for the inexperienced owner, unless that inexperienced owner has the commitment to make it work, regardless of whether or not they've done their research.


I know one owner went into a pet store to buy some toys for her furred critters and walked out with a "cockatiel". Said cockatiel was actually an umbrella cockatoo! She knew nothing about 'toos before bring her first bird home! Some years later, she has a female eclectus and a greenwing macaw, including her cockatoo, all in great big cages, and she started her own toy making company!

 

[Shade]

Or does he just know a lot about trick training and the experience he has with his two pois

I think this might be the most accurate statement.
He does seem to know a lot about trick training but not everyone will agree with some of the methods.

There is still so much we have to learn about parrots, I don't think anyone is really an "expert". Some might have a better understanding of some species though.

 

[rockyhermes]

Thanks monicamc and shade!
I also have a little red belly by the name of luca. He is a handful , but my wife and I love him dearly! Can the capes personality be compared to the red belly at all? One more question about cage size requirements for capes , what's the minimum ?
Thank you guys , you're awesome!

 

[Shade]

Thanks monicamc and shade!
I also have a little red belly by the name of luca. He is a handful , but my wife and I love him dearly! Can the capes personality be compared to the red belly at all? One more question about cage size requirements for capes , what's the minimum ?
Thank you guys , you're awesome!

I have two RBs as well, one male (Joey) and one female (Pixel).
They are both pretty outgoing. They are both clowns, although the male more so. He's silly and doesn't really seem to plan things out whereas his sister..there's method behind the madness

Léa (Cape) reminds me a little of them in her clumsy way. But she, like the RBs (specially Joey) has gotten less clumsy but there are still times where her gigantic feet get in her way

Pois as a general rule tend to be capable of independence and I think it applies to all Poi members of my flock (also have a Senegal and two Meyer's). They all LOVE to chip wood (the smaller guys love balsa and thin cut pine whereas Léa LOVES hardwood beads). They can all be on the stubborn side, but I find it's part of their charm.

As for a Cape, I really wouldn't go below 34" x 24" deep. That's what I had Léa in as a baby, and it was quite appropriate in the first few months when she was stumbling all over the place. I have since upgraded her to a 42" x 30" stainless steel cage - the SS part was a must with her, as she had started to strip the powder coating off her old cage. I must say, she loves all the space in her new cage

 

[MonicaMc]

I don't know what his (Michael's) background history is, but if you only have experience with one bird from one species, and no matter the amount of reading and trick training you do with that one bird, I don't really think you can say you are an expert on the species. I was thinking the article came from a breeder of capes, where-in they would have had more hands on experience with the species.

It pained me to see how abnormal my cherry headed conure was compared to others of his species. He was the only cherry head I ever owned or cared for, and he came to me with health problems that only got worse with age.

In comparison, my mitred conure seems pretty normal for a conure! If not the epitome of all of the word that 'conure' implies! And yet, my a-vet said he's not your typical conure, either!


I know a lot about both species through research, listening to other owners and my own experience with those two birds, but that doesn't make me an expert on them!



I agree with Shade in regards to cage size, although I was going to say a minimum of 32" x 23", which is practically the same. I know that cape's are larger than mitred conures, and I honestly have a hard time imagining keeping my mitred conure in a cage any smaller than 32" x 23". The cages most often recommended [for conures] are 20x20 or 24x24, but these cages honestly appear way too small for a large conure! Heck, I wouldn't even want to put a small conure or cockatiel in one! Used to own an 18x18x46(H?) cage that four cockatiels came in. They weren't in it for long and I got rid of it as soon as I could!



Although the amount of time a bird spends out of the cage could mean that you might be able to go smaller, life can change, why not go for the largest you can afford and accommodate?

 

[BeakersBro]

My Cape is not stubborn at all. Maybe they would be stubborn if they don't like you...

And it depends what you mean by stubborn... Capes are not circus parrots. Don't get one if all you care about is "training it" to say your stupid words or do your stupid tricks.

Only get one if you want the most best life-long companion in the world.

 

[Shade]

My Cape is not stubborn at all. Maybe they would be stubborn if they don't like you...

And it depends what you mean by stubborn... Capes are not circus parrots. Don't get one if all you care about is "training it" to say your stupid words or do your stupid tricks.

Only get one if you want the most best life-long companion in the world.

I don't mean "stubborn" in a bad way - but if Léa has something on her mind, she will try to make it happen, even if it's trying to get at something she shouldn't get at (and knows it). She knows what she wants. But it's part of what makes her, "her". I don't think it has anything with her not liking me, in fact I don't feel that way at all. I think it's because I let her be what she wants to be and if all she wants to do is cuddle, she'll come right in my arms.
My other Pois are similar and I've read it's a trait of theirs. I find it endearing.

 

[khaiqha]

I'm not sure why trick training has such a bad reputation. It's an effective wag of developing communication between you and your bird. The goal is not to get a bird to spin in circles for no reason. It's to get the bird thinking that sometimes you want it to do something, and if the bird can figure out what that is then it gets a reward. This concept extends far beyond little tricks.

Likewise it also trains the owner to be aware of their bird's body language, so they can learn when their bird is saying no, or that it wants something, etc.

Finally, we all say our birds are intelligent, as smart as 3 year olds in some cases. Trick training gives birds a way to exercise that intelligence. I see many posts where people complain that their bird's scream too much, are too energetic, etc. While there could be many reasons for those, it could also be because of lack of mental stimulation. Just like a human child, a bored parrot can easily.become destructive.

 

[Shade]

And what if it looks like the parrot doesn't want to do training and you still go ahead?
I don't think subjecting it to a training schedule you set up regardless of whether the parrot wants to or not is the answer.

I don't do it and I wouldn't call my birds bored or unhappy. I provide them with opportunities to come out of their cages as a flock, with plenty of enrichment and they keep busy and generally with things destined to be destroyed. They aren't unhappy to be in their cages either because, once again, there is plenty to do.

Training or no training, I am quite capable of reading my parrots body language and seeing if something is wrong.

Not saying all trick training is bad, but I don't believe it's the only way to have a great relationship with your birds. Sometime just accepting them for what they are does wonders.

 

[khaiqha]

As I said earlier, part of training is for the owner to learn when the parrot is saying no, so you won't push a bird that is saying no.

I'm not saying trick training is mandatory and that birds should be forced to fly through hoops. But people who hate on it and call t circus tricks fail to see the point of what it is about.

 

[Dharmawaits]

Sometime's just accepting them for what they are does wonders.

From your mouth to every. single. person. even considering owning a parrot. And I'm about to kind of go off topic....but not really.

We all try so hard to be informed before getting a parrot. Even to the point of topics like this one. The funny thing is, I could have changed the title to any other bird species. Some of those birds would totally fit what the article stated others would not. We try so hard to pigeon hole these birds into this "typical capelovebirdamazonmacaw behavior and its a losing battle.

I have noticed over all my years of dealing with birds the one's I enjoyed the most. I went in the relationship with a child like wonder and with not a clue what the so called "typical" traits of that bird was.