Black tipped feathers?

[nightinday]

Yesterday I was reading some articles about common birds deseases, etc. and the thing that got my attention was something about black/brown discoloration on green feathers when the bird has a liver desease. On the other hand, I've heard that black tipped green feathers are pretty common on GCC (Louis has some dark tipped feathers on the back). My wondering is, how to tell if feathers are starting to get discoloured abnormal?

 

[MonicaMc]

Black tipped feathers can also be a sign of wear and tear on otherwise normally perfect, healthy feathers. This is known as feather bronzing and it's when the pigment of the feathers get worn off. Bronzing is not the same as a bird that sick, usually.

https://www.wellvet.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ART_BIRDGROOMING

This is a good photo showing bronzing vs normal feathers
http://kili.sazhin.net/photos/3/before_after.jpg

And this site has photos with birds in poor health showing some bad plumage. Please be warned, there are some graphic images here...
birds

 

[amysaviary]

The feathers on the Senegal (bronzing vs normal) looks more like stress marks to me. Stress marks r not from pigment being worn off but stress during the feather growth. Which is not good! If u have questions about it take him to the vet! U can never be to careful!

 

[MonicaMc]

It's definitely feather bronzing on the senegal.

Stress Bars - Occurs while the feathers are growing

Feather Bronzing - Occurs after the feather is fully grown

 

[nightinday]

Louis has only little tips which are darker but he had it since I remember. But I will ask the vet, because I am taking him tomorrow. His poops are worrying me.

 

[MonicaMc]

Hope the vet visit goes well!

Abnormal feathers can mean a multitude of things, obviously... some harmless, but not all. On a young bird though, I wouldn't really worry about it, since it seems to be a somewhat common thing in young birds. Don't know why... but as long as they check out healthy otherwise!

Droppings though, that's another story!

 

[nightinday]

Feathers were checked by the vet before Louis came to me and he said that it's really normal. Besides, his 'mother' started to picking feathers from all little babies, that's why for example he had some bald spots which now aren't bald anymore. Poops came back to normal again so I guess he is healthy

 

[MaraWentz]

MY macaw has both. The black tips are just beautiful, but the stress bars are more blotchy and well, look stressfull.

 

[MollyGreenCheeks]

Please keep us updated. My Molly had feather bronzing prior to her first molt because I would cuddle her in my hand almost all the time. She loved the feeling of safety and security and I had no idea that the oils from my had would effect her feather colors. I became concerned and asked my vet about it. All tests were run and Molly was/is in great health. Now I try to keep my hands cleaner and try not to cradle both my GCC's in my hands so much. It's tough because I love to hold them securely in my hands and snuggle them under my nose. Anyway, like I said, keep us posted!

 

[MonicaMc]

Feathers were checked by the vet before Louis came to me and he said that it's really normal. Besides, his 'mother' started to picking feathers from all little babies, that's why for example he had some bald spots which now aren't bald anymore. Poops came back to normal again so I guess he is healthy

It sounds like he should go anyway, just to be on the safe side. Casey, my tiel, was acting just a little "off" one morning, eyes not as bright as they usually are, somewhat sluggish, etc. It was just one morning, and all mornings after that, she was acting perfectly normal! Being a little paranoid anyway, I took her in and she had an infection!

Minor things like that, even droppings, can be a potential sign of an ill bird, even if everything goes back to normal. At minimum it wouldn't hurt to get a fecal done. Better yet, put something metal container or perhaps wax paper beneath the spot where your conure normally poops in the morning, then save that morning poo in a small container with lid (I've found that little plastic sauce containers work great! but a plastic zip lock bag also works) and take that in as the fecal sample!

 

[khaiqha]

Now I'm just confused as to bronzing vs stress marks. The picture of the bronzing looks like it starts at the tip of the feather, where as stress marks will be a line through different parts of the feather, right?

 

[MonicaMc]

Bronzing can occur at any spot on the feather, but occurs most often at the tips.

Stress is indeed a line through the feather and typically weakens the feather to the point that the feather may break off at that line.

 

[MaraWentz]

Stress bars usually appear near the vien of the feather, but the difference is quite clear, as stress marks are very blotchy. black tips are very neat and clean appearing. I will post a picture of the stress marks on my macaw, vs her black tips later tonight

 

[amysaviary]

It's definitely feather bronzing on the senegal.

Stress Bars - Occurs while the feathers are growing

Feather Bronzing - Occurs after the feather is fully grown

I can't find any other articles on feather bronzing then the 1 u posted. I have never heard of it either. The original pic. of the Senegal is from another forum and she even said it was stress marks. Do u have any other info on it? I googled it and bronze wing pionus is what comes up. No saying u r wrong just can seem to find anything on it and I would like to learn!! Thanks

 

[BoomBoom]

https://www.wellvet.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ART_BIRDGROOMING

That article worries me now! It pretty much states that birds preen when they need to feel good or relax. Does that mean I should worry when my bird preens? He has a lot of things to keep him busy on his cage but when he hangs out on my arm while I'm on the computer he will either nap or preen. If he is in a chewy/playful mood I let him play with his toys on or in the cage which he likes. I don't want to encourage him to preen but at the same time he always wants to hang out on my arm.

He appears very healthy and well adjusted, I have no reason to suspect he is stressed but I don't want him to potentially learn the habit of over preening. He doesnt appear to over preen but what if he starts doing it a lot? Should I discourage preening when I see him do it? Maybe distract him with a toy?

 

[MonicaMc]

I can't find any other articles on feather bronzing then the 1 u posted. I have never heard of it either. The original pic. of the Senegal is from another forum and she even said it was stress marks. Do u have any other info on it? I googled it and bronze wing pionus is what comes up. No saying u r wrong just can seem to find anything on it and I would like to learn!! Thanks

It's only been within the past year that people have started recognizing the differences between stress bars and feather bronzing... any time before that, almost everyone assumed that feather bronzing was stress bars... so it should be of no surprise if you can't find much about it, or that many people are calling feather bronzing as stress bars.

I pulled the photo off of Google Images, which leads directly back to this forum. I don't really know much more other than Kili is rather famous on YouTube. I'll see if I can get more information for you.

Going to another forum though... theres a great photo of a military macaw showing off all her stress bars.
What are stress bars?? - Avian Avenue

Second page shows some examples of stress bars in a green cheek conure... plus someone else posted a link to what stress bars appear like in their african grey.
Feathers

https://www.wellvet.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ART_BIRDGROOMING

That article worries me now! It pretty much states that birds preen when they need to feel good or relax. Does that mean I should worry when my bird preens? He has a lot of things to keep him busy on his cage but when he hangs out on my arm while I'm on the computer he will either nap or preen. If he is in a chewy/playful mood I let him play with his toys on or in the cage which he likes. I don't want to encourage him to preen but at the same time he always wants to hang out on my arm.

He appears very healthy and well adjusted, I have no reason to suspect he is stressed but I don't want him to potentially learn the habit of over preening. He doesnt appear to over preen but what if he starts doing it a lot? Should I discourage preening when I see him do it? Maybe distract him with a toy?

No, don't discourage preening! Preening can be a relaxing thing, but that doesn't mean that your bird is stressed! It would be like combing your hair, perhaps. Birds have to keep their feathers in shape for flying, keep bugs and dust at bay, etc.

 

[MonicaMc]

Found the forum that Kili's owner belongs to, and I see that he calls them stress bars... and that she came that way. It's hard to say then because we don't know if her feathers grew out that way or if she's a playful young bird or if the feathers became that way through a lot of handling. Being that it's restricted to the wings only, I'd lean towards feather bronzing rather than stress bars simply because that's a common area where feather bronzing occurs. If she was bought as a young bird, then the discoloration should be throughout the entire body at that degree of "stress" - but I can't find anything (on a short search) about her history.

So you are right, I may very well be wrong there! Being that a lot of people don't know what feather bronzing is, I'm not discounting it, either!

 

[amysaviary]

Found the forum that Kili's owner belongs to, and I see that he calls them stress bars... and that she came that way. It's hard to say then because we don't know if her feathers grew out that way or if she's a playful young bird or if the feathers became that way through a lot of handling. Being that it's restricted to the wings only, I'd lean towards feather bronzing rather than stress bars simply because that's a common area where feather bronzing occurs. If she was bought as a young bird, then the discoloration should be throughout the entire body at that degree of "stress" - but I can't find anything (on a short search) about her history.

So you are right, I may very well be wrong there! Being that a lot of people don't know what feather bronzing is, I'm not discounting it, either!

Thanks MonicaMC again was not trying to say it was untrue just didn't know about it. I will keep looking for stuff! I always want to learn and do better so thanks for bringing it up!

 

[BoomBoom]

https://www.wellvet.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=ART_BIRDGROOMING

That article worries me now! It pretty much states that birds preen when they need to feel good or relax. Does that mean I should worry when my bird preens? He has a lot of things to keep him busy on his cage but when he hangs out on my arm while I'm on the computer he will either nap or preen. If he is in a chewy/playful mood I let him play with his toys on or in the cage which he likes. I don't want to encourage him to preen but at the same time he always wants to hang out on my arm.

He appears very healthy and well adjusted, I have no reason to suspect he is stressed but I don't want him to potentially learn the habit of over preening. He doesnt appear to over preen but what if he starts doing it a lot? Should I discourage preening when I see him do it? Maybe distract him with a toy?

No, don't discourage preening! Preening can be a relaxing thing, but that doesn't mean that your bird is stressed! It would be like combing your hair, perhaps. Birds have to keep their feathers in shape for flying, keep bugs and dust at bay, etc.[/QUOTE]

Ok thanks. I just don't know where to draw the line sometimes and I tend to magnify potential issues in my head. So preening = OK, Good even! Over preening = BAD

I just don't know how to tell if its turned into over preening I guess :0

 

[MonicaMc]

Thanks MonicaMC again was not trying to say it was untrue just didn't know about it. I will keep looking for stuff! I always want to learn and do better so thanks for bringing it up!

Stress bars are *usually* well defined... but I have seen stress bars so bad that the feathers were a dark color, and not defined on a young bird. I'm not sure if we could still call them stress bars, as the feathers did not appear weak, but they were certainly not the right color.

And hey, it's better to ask a question and to question what you are told! I'd rather bash heads with someone over a debate, and perhaps both of us leaving learning something new rather than accepting someones word on something simply because they are an "expert" (i.e. they work in a pet store, they are a breeder, they have vast experience, etc - doesn't mean they are right! - but often, there is no one *right* answer, but several!).

So feel free to question! And if I can, I'll back up what I say! If not, well, I'll either try or change my mind! Learn something new!

Ok thanks. I just don't know where to draw the line sometimes and I tend to magnify potential issues in my head. So preening = OK, Good even! Over preening = BAD

I just don't know how to tell if its turned into over preening I guess :0

That's correct, BoomBoom! FDB (Feather Destructive Behavior) comes in many forms... from barbering feathers (snipping off the ends - feather at end will be an inverted "V" shape), plucking feathers (fluffy feather down instead of the colorful body feathers, bare skin [not to be confused with areas that are normally featherless], sparse feathers, etc), over-preening (allopreening a mate), to mutilation even (causing self harm, bleeding, holes, etc).

Some species, predominantly alexandrines, indian ringnecks and eclectus can have such a *hard* molt that there appears to be some FDB going on because they look like crap! After they are done molting, they look perfectly normal again!


Birds with FDB need to be *encouraged* to preen in a healthy manner to try and stop them from FDB behaviors. There's a lot of things one can try to stop a bird from over-preening and destroying their feathers, starting with ruling out medical problems, then try and enriching their life physically as well as mentally.

It's kind of like chewing... birds should not be discouraged from chewing on things, but they do need to be encouraged to chew on *appropriate* things - such as toys. Sometimes, it can be hard to find the 'appropriate' boundary of what's good and what's not.