advise needed - biting Ekkie

[StChelle]

So I am working to be able to handle Harley more. We have made progress from not stepping up without me coming from behind to grab his foot, to stepping up on my wrist for a treat.

However, most often he will try to bite me when I get my hand anywhere near him to try step up without luring him with a treat. His beak is super sharp and he bites pretty hard. I have a scar on my thumb.

He is almost 4 months old, and has been with me for less than a month, so I know I have a ton more work to do.

I am wondering if anyone has any advice? I will sometimes use a stick to have him step up on when he's in a really bitey mood. Then he tries to bite my hand holding the stick at times. I am seriously considering thick gloves, but I would rather not. I don't want him to be afraid of my hands. I believe he is biting more as a "go away and leave me alone" than fear, but he does still shake at times when I am talking to him and he is in his cage. Once he is out of his cage he isn't so bitey, but I'd like to teach him not to bite. Anytime he moves his head in the direction of my hand, I slowly pull back and say "no bite", but I sometimes wonder if he intends to bite me hard all the time, or if he may be trying to explore. His bite is so painful when he does bite down and he applies pressure, sometimes increasingly and sometimes right away. He usually draws blood.

Anyway, to glove or not to glove, or is there any other thoughts for training him not to bite me? Or should I stick to the stick so to speak

 

[Scott]

Harley is still a young bird, but old enough to begin training. Better to help manage his biting before he gets older and emboldened to escalate.

Eclectus do have an interesting sort of bite; they progressively increase pressure, often in a grinding manner. Check this link for Bite Pressure Training: http://www.parrotforums.com/training/63988-bite-pressure-training.html

While written for macaws, this is the gold standard for understanding the many uses of the beak: http://www.parrotforums.com/macaws/56384-big-beak-o-phobes-guide-understanding-macaw-beaks.html

 

[StChelle]

Great! Thanks so much for the links.

I actually read the one about bit pressure training before. The thing is "time outs" dont seem to work well with him as he is wanting to be left alone lol. I am making progress though so I guess I need to keep at it. He doesn't strike fast so I get warning. I guess I need to show him a bit of trust and actually see if he will bite me hard when he's going for my hand or not then gently tap his beak when he starts applying pressure.

Great read on the Macaw link.

 

[OutlawedSpirit]

One thing that might help is try asking him to step up onto your forearm instead of your hand. When I brought my female ekkie home, she would not come out of the cage without biting. I found that if I offered her my wrist instead of my hand, when she would try to bite, it was harder for her to easily grab skin. It also gives you the option to wear a sweatshirt, which offers padding without "hiding" your hand under a glove. If he still bites through it, use an ace wrap to wrap a small towel around your arm UNDER the sweatshirt. Then he can bite your arm all he wants without causing you any harm. I did this with my girl, and when she realized that biting wasn't going to get her her way, she quit. The point, though, it to protect your arm from his bite without him realizing your protecting it.

It might work, it might not. Just, from what you are describing, it may be as simple as showing him biting is not going to let him stay where he wants. Like Scott said, you don't want him to get into the mindset at this young of an age, that he can use his beak to get his way.

Another thing that has worked well with my ekkie as far as bite pressure training is to grab her beak when biting. I allow her to put her beak on my fingers all the time, but when she starts getting too rough, I will grab her upper beak between my thumb and index finger. Then I will hold it still for a moment and tell her "too hard". I suggest not tapping his beak. For one, their beaks are very sensitive and that can cause pain which I don't think you are trying to do. For another, that may well just piss him off, which is something you don't want to do to a bird that already has your hand in his beak.

 

[StChelle]

Progress!! I have been able to get Harley to step up on my wrist twice now without the treat and without a bite! He is let me pet his head and tummy a bit too this morning. Thanks for the advice OutlawedSpirit!

 

[Anansi]

Great news on the progress!

Another thing to consider: I got the feeling reading your posts that you sometimes pull back when Harley is reaching for your hand with his mouth. Thing is, birds often use their beaks like we would our hands. Basically, as an aid for climbing. Why? For increased stability. Considering that birds spend so much time far above the ground, balance is VERY important to them.

When you withdraw your hand, however, you are threatening that balance. Endangering their stability. And you are doing so for no discernible reason (from Harley's perspective, anyway). Remember, birds do much of their communication via body language. So if he reaches out without ill intent, simply seeking to grasp your hand with his beak as a "hand-hold", he'll find your apprehension baffling... even frustrating.

My Bixby, for instance, found such behavior VERY aggravating. When a family member did this to him, he actually held a grudge for a few weeks. He took to lunging at her when she would attempt to get him to step up. Almost like, "Oh, you're not fooling me with that, again!" Lol!

It's a feat of faith to will yourself not to pull away when that beak opens up and comes toward you, but it's something you have to train yourself to do. (Eventually you'll recognize the difference in body language between an attempt to beak and an intent to bite.)

 

[StChelle]

https://flic.kr/p/VRQU4k

Progress!! He is stepping up now without a treat and without biting! Thanks all for the advise!