5yr old GW: potential new family member - good deal?

[Screech]

This is a 5 year old Greenwing, has a recent history of biting (I'm doomed to have a good bite, I'm sure) and does tends to be vary wary of new people (sent the current owner to the hospital when a potential buyer was startled by the bird). Personally, I can deal with one or two bites, so long as I can keep use of my hands and don't end up requiring too many stitches, so not something that scares me.

I am worried though that the bird might come to always have a sharp distrust towards unfamiliar people - not that it is the final determining factor, but is there a chance that the bird can be conditioned to be friendly towards a group of people?

Other than that, I don't mind if someone tries to come up with a good reason why this might be a bad deal - I like to make sure I have all bases covered.

 

[noblemacaw]

I would meet the bird and see how it responds to me. Multiple visits might be in order to get a accurate feel for this parrot.

Can visits be done?

 

[Screech]

I guess I should have mentioned that I have met the bird already, just haven't handled him yet. I'll be doing a trial handling session in a couple of days.

 

[noblemacaw]

I think it is good you are visiting the parrot more than once to get a better feel for the bird. I would go with your gut feeling of this parrot by spending time with the bird. If you can see the potential there why not go for it. This bird is still very young and not even of breeding age. You have the age going WITH you and I think if you are willing to do the work to get this bird the way you want why not go for it.

It has been my experience you get out of any parrot what you put into that parrot. Having a parrot as a companion is nothing like any other animal for companionship. It takes dedication and a lot of work......and lots of love.

 

[cstambaugh]

5yr old for a GW is right smack in the middle of his terrible times. He is in his phase of "who am I, and what power do I have over these human slaves."
He will be bitey, and testing. He is very hormonal most of the time. If you can fight though this time with him for the next couple of years, he will bond very well to you. Everytime my GW is being a huge PITA, I just say "whats the rush, we have our entire lives together."
My GW is 10 yrs old and is luckly out of this phase (for the most part).

Also, a HUGE thing with macaws. They are much more intelligent than you will realize. If you are nervous or afraid while trying to get them to do something for you, they will feed off of that and use it to their advantage. They definitely understand they have the upper hand in that situation and WILL bluff/test to come out on top.

He probably wont seriously bite if he is testing/bluffing. He may 1-2 times, but its not going to be detrimental. It'll be more of "lets see what he can handle". Once you show him bites do nothing, he'll start to realize you are the alpha. He may move onto faking a bite, but not actually following though with it. If you get to this, and can basically laugh in his face when he does it without being afraid, there is no doubt he will subside to you.
Really, the only times a macaw will snap your fingers off is if you're downright forcing him to do something he is afraid of. Even at that point, you've trenched through so many other signs of him saying "no" that its all he's left with. I'm talking him freaking out, running away, flaring with wings spread and beak out, and you still forcing him. I doubt you would ever get to that point, but some people just dont understand, and they wonder why they get bitten.

These are birds of prey, they trust nothing at first. Even you. Its taking months to years before he is 100% trusting. Again, whats the rush? You have the rest of your lives together.

 

[Birdman666]

Well, I agree with a lot of what was just said...

They aren't birds of prey - those would be hawks, and eagles, etc.

They ARE the prey, and they are smart enough to know that other living things try to eat them, and large enough to do something about it...

Socializing a macaw around strangers is reasonably easy to do... It's simply a matter of taking the bird out and about, to unfamiliar setting, around unfamiliar people, until nothing phases the bird anymore...

IF THE BIRD BITES, NO ONE HANDLES HIM RIGHT NOW.

AND I DON'T EVER LET THEM BITE ME, IF THERE IS AN ALTERNATIVE.

Sounds like a "get to know you first" macaw. Take it slow, and let the bird get familiar with you before trying to handle him. (Maggie was painfully shy, and hadn't been handled in 8 years when I got her. It took 4 days for her to warm up to me. I started handling her the second day, I believe.)

You already know my method:

Wrap a towel around your perch arm, deflect bites with two fingers, and put his butt on the floor until he steps up nice. Build on your relationship from there.

 

[Screech]

Thanks all for the responses!

Birdman, indeed I have been following your posts.

I feel pretty optimistic that things will go well, the bird hasn't been known to lunge as far as I know and he has only been known to bite once really hard when he was frighted by a customer (made a gesture at customer; customer freaked out; bird freaked out).

When you say to put him on the floor how do you go about this, whether the bird is on or off your arm?

 

[Birdman666]

I would have this bird clipped since he has caused injury, and if he bites when you go to step him up, simply push his beak away with two fingers and pull your hand out from under him and let him flutter to the floor.

He can stay there, being ignored, and thinking about what he just did (when he wants off the floor) until he steps up nice. Again, if he tries to latch on, down he goes again. If he has to go to the floor 10 times, then he goes to the floor 10 times. The session continues til he steps up nice... END IT ON THE POSITIVE, AND REWARD HIM WITH PRAISE AND TREATS WHEN HE DOES.

This is a socialization/training issue.

 

[Birdman666]

Thanks all for the responses!

Birdman, indeed I have been following your posts.

I feel pretty optimistic that things will go well, the bird hasn't been known to lunge as far as I know and he has only been known to bite once really hard when he was frighted by a customer (made a gesture at customer; customer freaked out; bird freaked out).

When you say to put him on the floor how do you go about this, whether the bird is on or off your arm?

Someone startled him. Gradually increase the exposure to startle stimulus, and he will be less inclined to freak out. Sounds more like just one of the hazards of large macaw ownership to me...

And by the way, this bird is obviously NOT bite pressure trained. So that's the first order of business after you get him used to you...

 

[Screech]

OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG! So my wife and I are going to be taking a trip to the vet tomorrow morning with "Heorshe" (he or she - not DNA'd ever, pronounced Hershey). He was actually quite a softy and requested that he be step-up'ed by raising his feet up (I'm a little jealous, I think he likes my wife more).

So here's the story: the store has a cage area and then a perch up front. A couple requested to see him and just after the owner brought him out of the cage one of the customers rushed to the bird with arm outstretched. Obviously the bird intended to defend itself and went to go for the strike, the owner put an arm out to stop the customer from getting into bite range: owner took the bite.

The bird's clipped and otherwise well trained and moderately well socialized, after hearing the full story I really think this is nearly an isolated incident (for now anyway).


Thank you Mr Stroud, er I mean birdman666 for the good directions! I'll certainly try the bite pressure training when we get a chance.

 

[MikeyTN]

Well, the owner made a terrible mistake by using their arm to block the bite. All he/she had to do is lift the bird upwards or do a little shake with the arms back and fourth, the bird will stop immediately. But will usually try again. I personally will never use my arm to block their bites as I know better then that, the only time I would use my arm is to protect them.

Birdman is already given you some great advice on how to train but there are other ways of training others would put on here. But his advice does work cause I've done the same training before and it applies to Macaws pretty good. But I've also done other training methods that works as well with a Macaw. I'm glad the training Birdman provided you is working well for you, good luck!!!

 

[Screech]

WHAT. JUST. HAPPENED!!?!?

So my wife and I were on the way home today, bird in travel cage on wife's lap, and we were stopped for a lunch break. So the bird decides that I'm the expendable test subject and makes a test lunge at me. I wasn't expecting it, because he just did a "scritch my head" language. My cat instincts are still a little hard wired so in a flash (and I have really fast reflexes) my hand was behind me. So from then on he would lung at me in the car while I was driving. When we get home I go to let him out of the travel cage and he just nips at my hand repeatedly while I open the cage up. Once I cool off for a bit and he's now on top, I return with water, and food of a few varieties. He drinks well and eats a little, then when he calls it done and backs away he then comes back and decides to lunge and try and dig his beak in!


Now he's taken two bites on me and he's decided that I'm not welcome company (until I play some music or him, then he temporarily decides I'm really interesting and cool). So I warn my wife the bird is in a bad mood: she just goes up to the bird and starts scritching - and this lasts for twenty minutes! THE BIRD STOLE MY WIFE!!!

The bird and I will be having some special sessions tomorrow.

 

[MikeyTN]

The Scratch my head language is a lie...they do that to trick you! Macaws are very well known to do so. You should have a one on one session with him alone without your wife present. He's taken a liking to your wife.

 

[Screech]

Yeah, a little alone time between the two of, even a few minutes, really seems to make a difference. I blew under his feathers when he was in the cage earlier today and he closed his eyes while I blew under his neck feathers.

I think the challenge here is really showing that hard biting is not a way to communicate. Some might really cringe at this, but gently squirting water into his beak for every mouth open lunge got him to calm down a bit. And I emphasize that a gentle stream works well, otherwise it only makes him back away, which is not what we want. That gives me just enough to confidence to pick him once with my fingers exposed.

We still don't know the sex of this guy, but we call "him" Beaker. Why we picked this should be self-explanatory

 

[Screech]

lift the bird upwards or do a little shake with the arms back and fourth, the bird will stop immediately.

I just saw your post MikeyTN, and this really makes sense. Stupidly obvious for when the bird goes to take a nip at you while it's on your arm, but not something I thought of.

 

[Screech]

Woohoo! Just had a good step-up session!

This guy was trained well and I just have to show him he's accountable when he goes to find a hiding spot in the cage. I started with my arm, then when that didn't work I pulled out my home made perch stick. He hates the thing so much, but he eventually resigned to it and after three attempts he finally came out and was soon eager to be on my arm.

We are currently enjoying the works of Beethoven together and he's just closing his eyes and fluffing up his feathers in bliss. Already he has shown to be a superior companion!

Still trying to work out a good splash guard size to perch height ratio so Beaker doesn't get his (or her?) tail in all the mess and we can still transport the stand from room to room.

 

[Birdman666]

Well, the owner made a terrible mistake by using their arm to block the bite. All he/she had to do is lift the bird upwards or do a little shake with the arms back and fourth, the bird will stop immediately. But will usually try again. I personally will never use my arm to block their bites as I know better then that, the only time I would use my arm is to protect them.

Birdman is already given you some great advice on how to train but there are other ways of training others would put on here. But his advice does work cause I've done the same training before and it applies to Macaws pretty good. But I've also done other training methods that works as well with a Macaw. I'm glad the training Birdman provided you is working well for you, good luck!!!

I use two fingers on the beak to prevent bites. And this is EXACTLY the situation that training is designed to prevent...

And if someone is approaching the bird with their hands from above, I STOP THE PERSON and tell them that this approach is the wrong way for a stranger to come up to a macaw. Come up slowly from underneath, not fast from above the way a predator would... Bird training is a two way street. Sometimes it's train the humans.

Lastly, your wife is obviously the new "favorite" person. Which does not necessarily preclude you from handling the bird, it just means you need to be more careful than she does...

Use the same two fingers on the beak when scratching heads... then the "Tricked you! HA! HA!" birdie manipulation stuff will stop. "He isn't falling for it anymore... but he does give a good head scratch! This is nice..." The bird will gradually warm up to both of you that way.

My Girlfriend is doing this with my GW right now.

 

[Birdman666]

the scratch my head language is a lie...they do that to trick you! Macaws are very well known to do so. You should have a one on one session with him alone without your wife present. He's taken a liking to your wife.

absolutely! This is birdie manipulation... He's falling for it... He's falling for it... Gotcha!!! This isn't "moodiness." This is a birdie test. You flunked that time.

Two fingers on that beak prevents this every time. He's not falling for it... Oh, well, fun while it lasted.

 

[Screech]

He's now decided that scritches can be a nice thing, but I think the last two sessions have turned him off of it. Both times he didn't have any better way of saying stop than turning around and nipping at my fingers so he ended up on the floor.

 

[Birdman666]

He's now decided that scritches can be a nice thing, but I think the last two sessions have turned him off of it. Both times he didn't have any better way of saying stop than turning around and nipping at my fingers so he ended up on the floor.

There might be a few things going on...

First of all, if you hit a pin feather, those hurt. He might be telling you that hurt.

Secondly, as you work with this bird, and bond, you'll learn to anticipate when he's had enough.

Thirdly, if Mom is his favorite person, and she walks by while scratching a head... that could also trigger a nip. "We wouldn't want to make Mom jealous..."