Eclectus Diet - confused

So the more I read up on the best diet for an Eclectus, the more confused I get since there is so much conflicting info.

I got Kiwi last month, he's 8 months now. When I took him to the Vet last month and told her I plan on feeding him mostly fruits & veggies, she said no - that I should be mostly feeding him pellets (not the colored ones, but Roudybush, Harrisons, or Zupreem.). She said pellets are formulated to have everything he needs. I tried to tell her that I've read differently and that Ekkies needs are different but she didn't seem swayed. Still I don't agree with her and his diet has fruits and veggies (see below)


This is pretty much his daily diet right now:

• Mixed Veggies - the frozen bags of peas/carrots/corn/green beans (we thaw it out)
  
• Fruit - cut up Apples (mostly), sometimes mixed with other fruits but he prefers Apples (no seeds)
  
• Roudybush Low Fat pellets

He gets plenty of each of the above each day and I'd say eats approx this ratio on average:
33% veggies, 33% fruit, 33% pellets based on what is left at the end of the day.

As a treat when training him each day, he gets what the pet store called Jungle Mix (it's basically a mix of nuts, dried fruit, dried corn and some crunchie colored things) and I also give him some sunflower seeds and walnuts. I give him one bit at a time but probably ends up being a small handful in total (so this is in addition to the above diet)


There is so much conflicting info out there, I don't know if I'm doing the right thing. Based on some of the threads here it sounds like maybe I should be giving him more veggies and less fruit?

And the pellets - it does make sense that the high quality pellets would be formulated with just about everything he needs... of course I don't plan to only feed him pellets but my gut feeling is that this should be an important part of his diet (along with fruits/veggies)

Is the ratio above OK? (basically 1/3 mixed veggies, 1/3 fruit, 1/3 quality pellets)

Any advice would be appreciated.


Thanks
Nathalie

A lot of vets push pellets, but Eclectus don't do well on mostly pellets and we all know this. It was smart of you to go with your own opinion at a time like that.

Rather than frozen veggies I would feed a chop mix of some sort. These are usually made in bulk then frozen in week sized baggies, you can also put frozen veggies in them. they have a much more varried amount of food and will benefit more than the few frozen veggies you are currently feeding.
Apples are ok but they aren't too nutritious. Try feeding a bunch of different fruits, banana, mango, guava, a popular one with eclectus is figs.

*edit*

I just found this forum thread, it's worth looking into

As copperarabian has already said, Eclectus do not do well on pellets.
This is because they have not evolved to cope with the dense nutrient content. It can lead to feather picking and toe tapping, as well as the unknown quality of the pellets harboring potential issues.
They need a diet very high vitamin A, far more than other bird species. So carrots, pumpkin and sweet potato in every meal... at least the main ones.

The also don't process fat as well as too's, macaws, etc, so do not feed seeds aside from as training treats. Same with animal protein; A little now and then is fine, but not all the time as it stresses the liver. A combination of re-hydrated pulses and grains should provide appropriate protein.

My vet is an expert on Eclectus (Dr Rob Marshall. He's written a very good book on them, "A Guide to Eclectus Parrots as Pet and Aviary Birds".) He has developed a supplement course that mimics the wild Eclectus diet, so I serve mostly cooked food (which is more easily digested) to Poe which has the supplements added.
Of course, it's expensive and you might not want to go that far. But don't do pellets. If you do, maybe a couple of teaspoons a week for added vitamins without the overdosing.
Your vet might know birds, but doesn't know specifically about Eclectus or their unusual diet.

A big part of Poe's diet is re-hydrated cooked beans/pulses (dry beans soaked overnight. Don't do tinned - too much salt and preservatives).

This is my vet's website. Definitely worth a scroll through the Eclectus pages.
Complete Care System For Eclectus

CathnPoe, what beans/pulses do you use? Do you buy a mix? Or do you just store buy them and mix them yourself?

The links are super helpful!

Hi everyone, I have a four year old male eckie, and Dr Rob Marshall is also my boy " boogies" vet. He truelly IS an expert on eclectus parrots, and I also follow Dr Marshall's pulses and beans diet, along with his supplements. You can buy the dried organic bean mix from his vet clinic in Sydney. Or for those not in Australia, you may be able to order them online? One thing Dr Marshall told me about captive eckies,is they require at least 20mins to half an hour of direct sunlight a day, this keeps thier vitimin D intake correct and strengthens the immune system. I religiously do this everyday with boogie, and in 4 months, his feather quality, energy levels and general vitality have improved 100%. I hope this info helps..

I hope you are cooking the dried beans you soak overnight if there are large beans in the mix. Small pulses like lentils, garbanzo beans, mung beans and adzuki do not need to be cooked. But most of the large beans contain enzyme inhibitors and are very hard to digest when raw.

Something that is overlooked, IMO, in many Eclectus diets are leafy greens. I'm not talking spinach or lettuce. Instead collard greens, kale, mustard greens, dandelion greens and endive. I live in a rural area and my local grocer does not carry a wide selection, but usually I can find at least one of the above. I mince them and mix into my chop. Normally I chop up what I won't use in a couple days then bag and freeze rather than letting them dry out and get yellow in the frig. If the greens are dried well after rinsing, before chopping (don't use a blender) they stay loose in the bags in the freezer and are easier to use.

The biggest advantage to feeding pellets, IMO, is as a source of Vitamin D, especially for those of us who live where parrots cannot go outside much of the year. I am not convinced that Full Spectrum Lighting results in Vitamin D production. I certainly hope it does of course.

For all species except Eclectus I think pellets are great. With Eclectus I think moderation is the key.

Fruit and seeds both have a bad reputation, IMO. Berries including cranberries are so nutritious. Same with papaya and kiwi. I also feed tart green apples every day.

A bit of seed is fine, but it should be unfortified and that can be difficult to find. The mixes with sulfured dried fruits are probably not something any parrot should eat.

Also, if you do some research you'll see that both almonds and walnuts are beneficial. Not 15 or twenty a day however! Maybe 2 almonds or 1/2 walnut.

Graham Taylor and Laurella Desborough both keep dozens (Laurella has more than 100) Eclectus birds and have worked with this species for decades. Go to their websites and see the diet they feed. They don't have pluckers and they don't feed a complicated diet. Laurella uses Volkman Fancy Soak and Simmer as a base to her chop. This is a grain and legume product that must be soaked for hours, then cooked for about half hour. The combination of grains and legumes results in a complete protein.

Laurella also uses celery, another vegetable that is often overlooked. My birds love it.

So what happened to fresh fruit and veggies? I give Willy fresh sprouts daily and fresh stuff 2X daily. He also gets a little sweet mashed potato with cinnamon and brown rice. Holy crap, this is getting to be a pain trying to figure out, fresh? cooked? pellets? Back to researching

Of course fresh fruit and veggies. I was not trying to make things confusing.

Here is exactly what I feed:

cooked grains (usually brown rice but sometimes Volkmans Soak & Simmer)
(I also buy quinoa and buckwheat to sprout)
cooked legumes OR sprouted pulses
frozen vegetables
chopped greens (today kale)
chopped raw hot peppers
chopped green apple
chopped celery
berries
kiwi
occasionally grapes
pomegranate in season
occasionally mango
winter squash or pumpkin
sometimes sweet potato or yams
watermellon in season
wheels of corn on the cob
whole green beans
occasionally tofu

Then, late in the afternoon I give 1/4 cup Volmans Eclectus seed mix

treats: almonds and walnut pieces and every couple days a large spray of millet

Sodakat...was not necessarily responding to your post, just generally. I thought Kale and broccoli were supposed to be good for birds, but apparently not for Ekkies, as per another forum. I stopped the kale and broccoli. It just gets confusing when you have vets, breeders and owner's experiences conflicting. My gut tells me that processed, and for me, that means cooked as well, is the lessor of the choices. I spend a good 45 minutes cutting up fresh stuff and I think I will continue with that and adding sprouts. I didn't think sprouts would be so easy but it has turned out to be one of the easier details to manage regarding Willy's food. I just have a few pellets in the hope that they will cover any shortfalls. He also gets an almond a day. Sheesh, the birds get fed better than I do.

Vets know that most people don't follow through on providing healthy diets day after day, year after year. So they suggest pellets because then the bird stands a fighting chance at all around nutrition.

I'm like you, dragonlady2, I enjoy sprouting and find it simple to do. I know my birds eat better than I do too!

Without pointing fingers, there was a suggestion to feed meat and grapes for heavens sake. What kind of rounded diet is that for an Eclectus? Just because someone owns an Eclectus and can type doesn't mean their advice should be followed.

I saw pictures of typical cupboards of food posted on another forum by people who own various species of parrots. Some of those cupboards had 20 or more store bought bird food and treat items. All I could say was, "and you think feeding an Eclectus is complicated???!!!" We just serve fresh food!

Can I add fruits to the chop mix? The link above to the chop mix looks like a great recipe, but I noticed it doesn't list any fruits.

Is that because fruits shouldn't be mixed with the veggies, or that they don't freeze well? Or is ok to add fruits to this chop mix and freeze it in batches?

Thanks
Nathalie

natv said:

Can I add fruits to the chop mix? The link above to the chop mix looks like a great recipe, but I noticed it doesn't list any fruits.

Is that because fruits shouldn't be mixed with the veggies, or that they don't freeze well? Or is ok to add fruits to this chop mix and freeze it in batches

Click to expand...

That looks like a great recipe.
I'd add fruits. Make things easier on yourself.

_ad_ said:

CathnPoe, what beans/pulses do you use? Do you buy a mix? Or do you just store buy them and mix them yourself?

Click to expand...

Glad I could help.
I buy a bag a soup-mix beans, one of chick peas, red lentils, black beans, quinoa and then mix them before soaking overnight and cooking the next day.
(Chickpeas are the first thing Poe aims for.)

Yes! Fresh is best! I say NO to pellets. If you research vitimin content of each fresh food item you feed your eckie, combined with full spectrum sunlight...your eckie will be getting all that he needs, with fresh variety, the less processed the better

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

My husband and I went to a farmer's market yesterday and then today spent a few hours making the chop mix. Looks like we have enough for several months! (used a Foodsaver to store the extra in one-week portion bags that we put in the freezer)

Great thread! I think we all sort of agree on the general proportions of fruits, legumes, fresh veggies, etc., but I can't deny my red-sided's improved plumage and energy level after I started sprinkling 1/2-1 Tbs of Harrison's high potency mash on his chop mix morning and night. Either I wasn't doing a good enough job of including all of the necessary vitamins with my chop mix, or he thinks Harrison's is tasty so he eats more of everything there.
I'll continue to try to improve my chop mix, but I don't think I will risk going back to the underweight, sickly-looking birdie I had before

My vet advocates very little fruits for parrots. She didn't explain why, but I would guess it's because they have less nutrients but more sugar than veggies. Maybe that's why it's not in the BirdTricks.com mix...?

I'm thinking that it should be more veggies than fruits, not sure proportion. I think the main reason why fruits aren't in the mix is because most don't last long, even frozen (at least, from reading the manual that came with the fruitsaver, it seems that veggies can last much longer in the freezer)

Plus since I've packed them in week-size portion bags, some fruits may spoil too quick (berries especially). The only fruit I added was pomegranates, and everything else is pretty much exactly like the birdtricks.com chop mix recipe.

Along with his breakfast we also give him a side of fresh fruit, mostly startfruit and apples right now (we have a starfruit tree), also have a mango tree so can't wait until that is in season!

I love this post but have a few questions as well. When you cook sweet potatoes - how long and how? Also what is okay raw? Are carrots? Once you make up this mix of goodies how much do you feed?

I'm still learning and my breeder gave her just some seed diet that I think is so wrong!

EclecticEclectus said:

I love this post but have a few questions as well. When you cook sweet potatoes - how long and how?

Click to expand...

I try to steam my sweet potatoes in the microwave enough to where they crumble. The mushier the food, the more my Ekkies love it.

Carrots and Sweet potatoes are staples in 2 of the 3 meals my ekkies get daily.

They prefer cooked foods in the morning and evenings.

Fruits and oats in the morning

Beans/rice/and pureed greens in the evening.


and they love raw veggies/fruits during the day.


Sunday's is when they get to cheat on their little diet.. I feed them a millet spray. 1 hour of an eclectus dried seed mix (No Pellets or peanuts) and they love cheerios... My female ekkie literally moans in pleasure when I give her a few cheerios (regular not honey or frosted). and of course I give them a smaller portion of their weekday meals..

This thread is a great resource! Thanks everyone.
So far with Charlie I've just been using my knowledge from this forum + many books and sites to make food every day. I try and include a mix of cooked & raw veggies, a bean and brown rice mixture, and the healthier fruits I can pick up (mango, pomegranate, etc.). I got a bag of organic pellets from my breeder when I got Charlie, and he does seem to like them, but favors his chop much more during meal times.

I have a foraging wheel that Charlie hasn't figured out just yet, but I filled each compartment with pellets and so he can eat them as he pleases. The airtight compartments work to keep the other pellets fresh and he goes through less than one compartment a day (>2 tbsp) so I just turn it a compartment over each day. xD

This thread is definitely going to help me with lots of ideas though!